Reasonably priced, bright scope for Christmas. (1 Viewer)

[Dazed & Confused]

Hi,

I really hope somebody can help me out here.

I would like to buy a scope for a relative of mine to use to look at birds and wildlife. I have started looking into scopes, thinking my background in photography would help me out - but I am much more confused than I had hoped.

The scope is going to be used from inside through open windows, and only outside on really nice days, so it does no have to be really portable or waterproof (but obviously not stupidly flimsy, or absolutely massive). (Looking for scopes is the right thing - I don't need binoculars instead do I?)

Optically, I would like a really big, bright and clear image - absolutely massive zoom is not a priority. (Talking of zoom, does 30x mean 30x bigger than normal, or is it something else?) Variable zoom would be cool too.

The main problem is budget - £500 (I'm in the UK) for everything would be maximum really, and under that would be great. The thing is, most scopes seem not to come with eyepieces, which is very annoying, so I keep forgetting to price them in. (Do they come with tripods - or are they extra? If so, what's a good one for not much money that fits a scope?) My main hope is that what I can save on ruggedness and portability I can make up for in optics at this price.

I also shoot Nikon DSLRs, so if there was any way of cheaply adapting it at a later date that'd be great, but if not, no bother. The number one priority is a bright and clear image for the money!

Please feel free to spell it out overly clearly -you won't patronise me, I have absolutely no clue.

Thanks in advance for all your help! I really do appreciate it!

D&C

 

[dipped]

I'm a bit a bit confused too. Is it for you or a relative? and if either of you don't have binoculars I would recommend these first before thinking about a scope unless it is a static setup fixed on a birdfeeder or table.

You would be able to get a pretty decent pair of bins for £500. I'm sure if you clarify the situation you want them for you will get answers.

 

[PCC]

Look at the Celestron Ultima 80 ED or 100 ED water proof scope. You can unscrew the rubber eyecup and screw on a "T" adapter to attach your slr directly to the zoom eyepiece, cool huh. It sells for as little as $400 US and comes with a full lifetime "no fault" warranty, good luck.

 

[stevetb]

hi there! welcome to BF :t:
im pretty sure you could get a decent scope tripod and eyepiece for 500 in the uk. if its not going to be moved around alot, a large objective lens ( about 80mm) would probably be ideal - they are a lot brighter , but heavier, than, say a 60mm. if the person you are buying for doesn't have binoculars, perhaps a good pair of these would be best, as they will be used more than a scope. you have to remember the more magnification you have, the darker the image will become, however, an 80mm will let you use higher magnification (without it getting too dark) than a 60mm will. by the way, 30X does mean 30x closer than with the naked eye, yes. if your friend wants to take pictures through the scope ( commonly known as digiscoping ) , then ED glass in the optical system improves pictures dramatically, however the difference you see with your eyes isnt as great. try looking at warehouse express for some ideas. there is a link at the top of the page.

 

[stevetb]

looking around at warehouse express, you can get an angled opticron es 80 sd and HDF zoom ( really good eyepiece ) and velbon sherpa 450r for under 500. opticron are a well known brand and are quality. the 80mm objective combined with high quality build and optics will provide bright and sharp images. the zoom on this scope will give a magnification of 20-60X. it doesnt have ED glass, but if your friend doesnt wanna take pics through it, you should be fine with the standard glass version. velbon sherpa series are very good value and build. im no expert on tripods, so another member may be able t help you out with this part.

 

[Dazed & Confused]

Wow, so many replies! This forum is amazing.

Thanks - I think I need to clarify, as it seems the more detail the better.

The scope is not for me, but I might be able to borrow it occasionally, that is why I was asking about the camera adaptor. It is absolutely bottom on the requirements list, though, so the non ED glass would be fine.

The scope will be set up to look at some bird feeders and trees around the house. I know it's not as easy to use as binoculars, but finding a bird in a tree 50 metres right in front of you shouldn't be a huge problem right? The nearest feeder is about 24 feet away - can they focus that close?

I was also thinking, the problem with binoculars is shake and tiredness having to hold them up to your face. The best bit about a telescope is a tripod makes it have a rock steady image, which makes them more comfortable to use too.

Image wise - I sort of assumed a telescope would give a bigger brighter image for the money compared to similar zoom binoculars, due to the much bigger front element.

Does all this seem logical?

Okay, so I'm looking at an 80mm or bigger front element, a zoom eyepiece, and a tripod. The recommendation you made, AC/DC, looks cool. Does anyone else have any suggestions? Also, as people say £500 is plenty, would a slightly lower budget of £350 also get me a good 80mm zoom setup, or am I going to low?

Thanks so much - I can't get over how helpful everyone is!

D&C

 

[stevetb]

someone is selling the es80 ED version on ebay with the aforementioned zoom for 425. described as superb condition. you could get a decent tripod for 75 too.

 

[Dazed & Confused]

Thanks - Ebay - I can't get it at work...

someone is selling the es80 ED version on ebay with the aforementioned zoom for 425. described as superb condition. you could get a decent tripod for 75 too.

But I'll check it out as soon as I get home!

Thanks for the tip!

 

[adw73uk]

I was also thinking, the problem with binoculars is shake and tiredness having to hold them up to your face. The best bit about a telescope is a tripod makes it have a rock steady image, which makes them more comfortable to use too.

D&C

Tripod adapters are available for many binoculars so you could place these on a tripod. The one thing I would worry about using only a scope is eye fatigue. Binoculars are much more comfortable to view through for extended periods.

 

[pduxon]

personally I'd have thought a good pair of bins is ideal. if you are watching birds in the garden they don't half flit around and you'll never follow them with a scope

if you are after a scope to mostly sit indoors I've have thought a cheaper model like an angled Opticron IS60 with the IS pro zoom would be ideal The quoted close focus of 7.9m is more than 24ft. But for something that close you would be better off using bins. If the focus worries you then you could go with an MM2, close focus 3.5m, and HDF lens with the zoom it would be £259 and the 24ww £248.

http://www.sherwoods-photo.com/opticron_scope/opticron_scope_index_fs.htm

it would set you back £208 plus a tripod like the Sherpa250n for £75
http://www.sherwoods-photo.com/velbon_tripods/velbon_fs.htm
that said www.warehouseexpress.com do the sherpa 200r and 250r for £59 and they would be fine.

that leaves £217 (ok a bit less if you went for the MM2 HDF route)

so how about the Minox BL 8x32 £200
http://www.sherwoods-photo.com/minox_bino/minox_bino_fs.html

The ES80 is an excellent scope but I think something like the above would give the best of both worlds.

 

[Chris Oates]

Occasionally I use a straight Mighty Midget II indoors with a full size tripod and it can be a real pain as the legs always get in the way of something.
Do you get an angled or straight scope ??...if there are birds high in trees then an angled is better but is more difficult to line up quickly.
If the scope is to be used from a sitting position an angled scope will be much lower than your normal eyelevel and windows sills can get in the way.
I have the 'grippa' case which allows you to hand hold the scope like a video camera but for easy viewing I'd image a hide clamp would be best.
I'd never use a scope exclusively as it's hard work following flighty birds, an ultralight pair of binoculars and cushions to support the elbows is much better.

 

[scampo]

Hi,

I really hope somebody can help me out here.

I would like to buy a scope for a relative of mine to use to look at birds and wildlife. I have started looking into scopes, thinking my background in photography would help me out - but I am much more confused than I had hoped.

...Thanks in advance for all your help! I really do appreciate it!

D&C

I'd say a very fine choice would be the new Nikon ED50 scope used with a 16xW fixed eyepiece. This scope is small and light, very bright indeed and focuses down to a very useful 3m/9ft.

The angled version can be used perfectly comfortably with a chest/shoulder pod, costing ~£30-00 and would be idea for viewing from an indoor chair. Whilst its 50mm objective lens would not be ideal for low light photography, in normally bright conditions, it will be fine. Used with a camera such as the new Fuji F30, which is capable of taken shots in even dull conditions, it would be a very useable combination.

The whole falls neatly within budget and for its size and weight seems to me to be near ideal.

 

[Pete K.]

See the photos taken with the Celestron Onyx 80ED at the end of this thread http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=72340

 

[Dazed & Confused]

Thanks for all the tips. A lot of people seem to be leaning towards binoculars as a better alternative. Do binoculars give enough zoom and let enough light in with their smaller front element?

If they do, what would people recommend for about £200-250 (Unfortunately think my budget just got tighter - so a scope might be out anyway)? The Minox BL 8x32 was mentioned - do people agree, or do you think we can do better? The Minox BL 10x42, or the BD 10x44 BP? Or a different make altogether? Also, if there any reasonably priced sort or binocular stand people could point me in the direction of?

This is such a great forum - I really appreciate all the advice.

 

[pduxon]

The Minox BL 8x32 was mentioned - do people agree, or do you think we can do better? The Minox BL 10x42, or the BD 10x44 BP? Or a different make altogether? Also, if there any reasonably priced sort or binocular stand people could point me in the direction of?

This is such a great forum - I really appreciate all the advice.

stand??

I mentioned the Minox's but similarly priced are the Nikon Monarch, Opticron Verano's and RSPB BG's. Optics companies like infocus and ACE have there own brands Delta and Avian which are good as well.

 

[scampo]

Thanks for all the tips. A lot of people seem to be leaning towards binoculars as a better alternative. Do binoculars give enough zoom and let enough light in with their smaller front element?

If they do, what would people recommend for about £200-250 (Unfortunately think my budget just got tighter - so a scope might be out anyway)? The Minox BL 8x32 was mentioned - do people agree, or do you think we can do better? The Minox BL 10x42, or the BD 10x44 BP? Or a different make altogether? Also, if there any reasonably priced sort or binocular stand people could point me in the direction of?

This is such a great forum - I really appreciate all the advice.

Zoom binoculars are never recommended as the field of view is always narrow - but I'm not sure, reading your first post, if your use of the word "zoom" is what I mean by it: a zoom lens changes its magnification, in a scope say from 20x to 60x. You also said you wanted them for a relative who wanted to use them indoors looking into a garden - is that still the case?

The advantage of binoculars is that they offer a much wider field of view than a scope and this makes them more useful for close quarters viewing such as into a garden. Minox would be fine binoculars, for sure. A low magnification might be better for garden use - maybe the Opticron Taiga 8x at around £90.00 or, looking at the In Focus page, the Delta PC AG 7x36:

http://www.at-infocus.co.uk/reviews_bins.html

 

[Paul Jarvis]

I have the opticron Countryman 8x42 which are a great choice for garden watching. They have 8.2 field of view and nice contrast to the image for 99 pounds. Other than that for the budget you have quoted my choice would be the Opticron HR WP 8x42 for 239, one of the best low budget bins I have looked through IMHO.

 

[Otto McDiesel]

I'd say a very fine choice would be the new Nikon ED50 scope used with a 16xW fixed eyepiece.

does that work for observation or just photography? I believe that eyepiece is designed for digiscoping.
I would like a 16xw 50 mm Nikon on a monopod.

 

[scampo]

does that work for observation or just photography? I believe that eyepiece is designed for digiscoping.
I would like a 16xw 50 mm Nikon on a monopod.

There's an error on the Warehouse Express website - they don't show the 16xW on the ED50 section but they do on the EDIII and ED82 sections of the web page (it's 30xW eyepiece on the ED82 scope; catalogue no. 90059).

You wouldn't need the 16xW DS - cat. no. 90097.

I was thinking the 13-40x zoom might also be a useful choice - I haven't used this with my ED50. The fixed eyepiece is very wide and so, I would guess, most useful for garden viewing in the situation you describe. Pete Duxon has the zoom - maybe he'll comment on its usefulness.

 

[pduxon]

I was thinking the 13-40x zoom might also be a useful choice - I haven't used this with my ED50. The fixed eyepiece is very wide and so, I would guess, most useful for garden viewing in the situation you describe. Pete Duxon has the zoom - maybe he'll comment on its usefulness.

it works quite well for observation. The zoom is surprisingly wide at 13x and I've cranked it up to 40 in poor light and got decent results, all though the FOV deteriorates. Obviously you can use it at 13x on a mono or shoulder pod and you have the zoom flexibility when using with a tripod or the shoulder pod as a desk pod.