Shaming birdwatchers on social media (2 Viewers)

[Mysticete]

Unpopular opinion: people are concerned about the welfare of birds at twitches mostly because they don't want the bird to be driven away before they have a look at it. Most rarities die soon anyway and even if they don't, their fate is largely irrelevant to the future of the species.

Disturbance is much more relevant at breeding sites, more for some species than for others, and for some species also at wintering sites, notably for those that are really picky about them. But the "behaviour at twitches" is a social issue, not one of conservation.

I don't think that is an unpopular opinion at all, even if some folks may not want to admit it!

 

[Andy Adcock]

Unpopular opinion: people are concerned about the welfare of birds at twitches mostly because they don't want the bird to be driven away before they have a look at it. Most rarities die soon anyway and even if they don't, their fate is largely irrelevant to the future of the species.

Disturbance is much more relevant at breeding sites, more for some species than for others, and for some species also at wintering sites, notably for those that are really picky about them. But the "behaviour at twitches" is a social issue, not one of conservation.

Evidence?

We all know stories of rarities which have died but the majority of them, we're not sure where they go are we?

 

[Weasel1]

Unpopular opinion: people are concerned about the welfare of birds at twitches mostly because they don't want the bird to be driven away before they have a look at it.

The Least Bittern in 2022 is a great example...a bird that was kept in the hand until just about every birder on Shetland had seen it and taken a picture.

And as for pictures, these guys weren't using long telephoto lenses, they were that close they were using bloody mobile phones, but then I suppose it was the field craft that got them that close to the bird.

There are so many pictures of this clearly sick and terrified bird out there that it's obvious the birds welfare was secondary to the tick, otherwise it would have been rushed into care straight away, but as we all know it wasn't and subsequently died.

But, getting to close on this occasion was ok because they all had binoculars around their necks.

Just an observation as we don't want people thinking it's just photographers with long lenses that get too close.

 

[Xenospiza]

A few years back some Dutch birders handled a dying Ivory Gull in Germany to get better pictures.
The whole story, including photos of the guys in question (put there by themselves!) is on Dutch Birding, much of it in English.
The fate of the bird would have been the same had they behaved perfectly... but it is setting a really bad example.

 

[Farnboro John]

The Least Bittern in 2022 is a great example...a bird that was kept in the hand until just about every birder on Shetland had seen it and taken a picture.

And as for pictures, these guys weren't using long telephoto lenses, they were that close they were using bloody mobile phones, but then I suppose it was the field craft that got them that close to the bird.

There are so many pictures of this clearly sick and terrified bird out there that it's obvious the birds welfare was secondary to the tick, otherwise it would have been rushed into care straight away, but as we all know it wasn't and subsequently died.

But, getting to close on this occasion was ok because they all had binoculars around their necks.

Just an observation as we don't want people thinking it's just photographers with long lenses that get too close.

I'm not sure how you find terrified in a bird in the hand that sat absolutely still because it had no energy left and had been picked up by some misguided Florence Nightingale who should have left it where it was, as it was no business of any birder or other human being to interfere with the life and death of an unrestrained wild creature, if for no other reason than that scavengers deserve their rightful tithe. Birds do not show expressions and anthropomorphism is to be deplored. For all you know it was resigned to death or grateful for the warm hand in which it sat. You've no idea.

As suggested earlier in the thread, without context a photo is meaningless and what actually happened was that said misguided Florence Nightingale picked the bird up and walked it directly and immediately to his distantly parked car and made off with it, though he was prevailed upon by some latecomers including me to pause for a few seconds for a quick click that made no difference whatever either to the bird's mental or physical state. Many birders on Shetland having driven very close to the speed limit to reach the site missed it. A favoured few were invited back to the misguided Florence Nightingale's house to see it later. It doesn't matter: the bird was fundamentally unsaveable even had it been anybody's business to save it, which it wasn't.

Unsurprisingly by morning the Least Bittern was dead. Somewhere a Herring Gull's empty stomach growled painfully.

John

 

[Weasel1]

@Farnboro John and likewise you've no idea if the bird would have lived or died if it had been taken into care as soon as it was found.

As I suspected, when birders get too close there is always an acceptable reason why but, when a photographer does it they are out of order and need shaming.

I know one thing and that is I'll never get that close that I can use a mobile phone to capture an image.

It's just an opinion, both birders and photographers can get too close at times.

 

[Farnboro John]

@Farnboro John and likewise you've no idea if the bird would have lived or died if it had been taken into care as soon as it was found.

As I suspected, when birders get too close there is always an acceptable reason why but, when a photographer does it they are out of order and need shaming.

I know one thing and that is I'll never get that close that I can use a mobile phone to capture an image.

It's just an opinion, both birders and photographers can get too close at times.

You're missing the point. Nobody should be taking wild animals into care and I include in that all the Mrs Tiggywinkles and the idiotic interventions of the British Aqua Cetacean Killers who harass sick whales and dolphins then euthanase them. All the funds that currently get drawn away from real conservation by these bleeding heart pinpricks on the surface of wildlife should be going into wildlife trust donation boxes. Also a dead whale is a massive boost for local wildlife and shouldn't be removed from a shore just because humans like tidiness and the beach to themselves for screaming kids and uncontrolled dogs.

As for distance, I was once lying on my belly photographing a mixed flock of Snow Buntings and Lapland Buntings a few feet away at Salthouse that came to me for grain scattered about, when I heard laughter from the small crowd some yards behind me. I had no idea what it was about, kept taking pictures till the birds moved elsewhere and I could get up without disturbing them. Apparently Turnstones had been actually walking over my legs. But you have to judge the moment carefully and knowledgeably.

John

 

[Weasel1]

Also a dead whale is a massive boost for local wildlife and shouldn't be removed from a shore just because humans like tidiness and the beach to themselves for screaming kids and uncontrolled dogs.

But you have to judge the moment carefully and knowledgeably.

John

Missing the point maybe...and I don't think we are going agree regards the Bittern...but I 100% agree with the above.

 

[KenM]

Dead Whales on beaches, now y’er talking…bring on those Ivory’s! 👍

 

[Patudo]

No shortage of beached whales on Brighton beach last time I visited!

 

[Stephen Dunstan]

The Least Bittern in 2022 is a great example...a bird that was kept in the hand until just about every birder on Shetland had seen it and taken a picture.

And as for pictures, these guys weren't using long telephoto lenses, they were that close they were using bloody mobile phones, but then I suppose it was the field craft that got them that close to the bird.

There are so many pictures of this clearly sick and terrified bird out there that it's obvious the birds welfare was secondary to the tick, otherwise it would have been rushed into care straight away, but as we all know it wasn't and subsequently died.

But, getting to close on this occasion was ok because they all had binoculars around their necks.

Just an observation as we don't want people thinking it's just photographers with long lenses that get too close.

I take the point but there was some very vociferous complaint that the bird was taken into care too soon, precisely because quite a lot of people didn't get there in time. I thought that was a bad look for birders to be honest, whether or not the bird was emaciated beyond recovery.

 

[Andy Adcock]

One thing that people forget, is that most birds, as prey items, exist in a permanent state of hyper vigilance.

 

[Elkhornsun]

In the UK and in the USA the major problem for avian wildlife is habitat loss thanks to industrial farming with its high water demands, planting of non native crops, using herbicides and pesticides.

The only birder practice that has been shown to be destructive is playing bird calls to attract a species. In Yosemite it has been shown that birds have abandoned areas as a result of this practice This is where Cornell Labs making bird calls free to the public to use on the smartphones has been detrimental.

 

[Andy Adcock]

You're missing the point. Nobody should be taking wild animals into care and I include in that all the Mrs Tiggywinkles and the idiotic interventions of the British Aqua Cetacean Killers who harass sick whales and dolphins then euthanase them. All the funds that currently get drawn away from real conservation by these bleeding heart pinpricks on the surface of wildlife should be going into wildlife trust donation boxes. Also a dead whale is a massive boost for local wildlife and shouldn't be removed from a shore just because humans like tidiness and the beach to themselves for screaming kids and uncontrolled dogs.

As for distance, I was once lying on my belly photographing a mixed flock of Snow Buntings and Lapland Buntings a few feet away at Salthouse that came to me for grain scattered about, when I heard laughter from the small crowd some yards behind me. I had no idea what it was about, kept taking pictures till the birds moved elsewhere and I could get up without disturbing them. Apparently Turnstones had been actually walking over my legs. But you have to judge the moment carefully and knowledgeably.

John

Really, a species in severe decline in the UK?

I personally, cannot remember the last time I saw a Hedgehog in the UK, even as roadkill.

 

[Farnboro John]

Really, a species in sevre decline in the UK?

I personally, cannot remeber the last time I saw a Hedgehog in the UK, even as roadkill.

You can't save it by putting a few dozen in care.

John

 

[Andy Adcock]

You can't save it by putting a few dozen in care.

John

Surely on a local level it can make a difference?

 

[Farnboro John]

Surely on a local level it can make a difference?

No, because the real problem for Hedgehogs is climate change preventing them hibernating effectively. They wake up, there's no food, they die. Sooner or later they'll either all be gone or will have changed to a non-hibernating lifestyle as it becomes warm enough for their insectivorous diet to work throughout the "winter".

Up in Scotland where it still gets properly cold they are doing much better. Including of course on all the islands where they have been introduced....

John

 

[KenM]

Surely on a local level it can make a difference?

Until they cross the road.😩

 

[Richard D]

No, because the real problem for Hedgehogs is climate change preventing them hibernating effectively. They wake up, there's no food, they die. Sooner or later they'll either all be gone or will have changed to a non-hibernating lifestyle as it becomes warm enough for their insectivorous diet to work throughout the "winter".

Up in Scotland where it still gets properly cold they are doing much better. Including of course on all the islands where they have been introduced....

John

Is starvation confirmed as a greater threat than Road Traffic incidents?

 

[Farnboro John]

Is starvation confirmed as a greater threat than Road Traffic incidents?

They were fine for years with the RTA cull. Numbers went off a cliff when really warm winters started. They are so rare locally now you don't even see hedgehog pizzas on the roads.

John