DOC REED
Well-known member
as primarily a birder don't know if could sustain a new thread ,but will shortly post a few photos. Also managed Mikes salamanda but sadly only a roadkill.
-
Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.
Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
wolves and bears in northern Spain (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Steve Babbs
- Start date
as primarily a birder don't know if could sustain a new thread ,but will shortly post a few photos. Also managed Mikes salamanda but sadly only a roadkill.
Mike Richardson
Formerly known as Skink1978
They're much better alive, but I'd swap one for a bear any day!
KFC
Ken Tucker
Bears in Romania
I saw bears in Romania in summer 2005.
The first was a cub as we were driving down out of the Fagaras mountains from Balea Lac. We'd come down below the tree line and as we drove, I was scanning the trees for nutcracker etc. I saw something stocky and brown moving through the trees immediately beside the car and shouted to our guide and driver to stop. I expected it to be a boar when out popped a bear cub - about 50-60cm at the shoulder! It moved through the vegetation at the edge of the trees and then disappeared into the trees. We waited a while in case there were any siblings or mum but saw nothing else. Our guide warned us strongly against getting out of the car as mum would be around. In all his years of birding, our guide had never just stumbled on a bear. He'd only ever seen them at watch points. We were very lucky. The first picture obviously shows the cub disappearing into the trees. (OK - not obvious. It could be a rock!)
Having seen that one, we wanted more and so drove independently to Brasov to see the 'urban' bears there. We were advised not to because our guide said this was not a natural way to see bears and they were trying to discourage tourists from going there. However, we were keen and drove through the night arriving in the early hours. We had 'Bear' written in Romanian on a piece of paper and showed it to a friendly refuse collection van driver. He pointed us in the right direction and eventually we found the right spot. Giant wheelie bins were kept in concrete bunkers behind high-rise flats at the edge of town at the base of a forested mountain. First bunker... nothing. Second bunker... nothing. Third bunker - a bear's backside sticking out of one of the bins, back feet on the floor. She pulled out and stood up looking right at us with her front paws still on the bin... I swore a lot and wound up my car window. She was enormous and I was initially petrified! Much bigger and closer than I had expected. We were just 5m or so from her and her four (!!!) cubs about 25-40cm at the shoulder. She pulled the bin over like it was a waste paper basket and her cubs went in (second photo) while she climbed up onto the wall behind and watched. Unbelievably there were people walking up and down the pavement ignoring the bears and others on the back steps of the flats smoking and chatting within metres of them. Unfortunately for us... but probably fortunately for the bears... there were a couple of policemen who moved us on. We went round the block once more for a second look but thought that was chancing our luck as we'd been told not to try it on with the police here (and we were rather obviously driving an English car).
No, not a natural experience with a bear. But one I will never forget.
We had hired a guide from Hobby Tours for a few days to show us around the Danube Delta and into the mountains. They do also offer bear watching and it is probably cheaper than northern Europe. You can find them here.
I saw bears in Romania in summer 2005.
The first was a cub as we were driving down out of the Fagaras mountains from Balea Lac. We'd come down below the tree line and as we drove, I was scanning the trees for nutcracker etc. I saw something stocky and brown moving through the trees immediately beside the car and shouted to our guide and driver to stop. I expected it to be a boar when out popped a bear cub - about 50-60cm at the shoulder! It moved through the vegetation at the edge of the trees and then disappeared into the trees. We waited a while in case there were any siblings or mum but saw nothing else. Our guide warned us strongly against getting out of the car as mum would be around. In all his years of birding, our guide had never just stumbled on a bear. He'd only ever seen them at watch points. We were very lucky. The first picture obviously shows the cub disappearing into the trees. (OK - not obvious. It could be a rock!)
Having seen that one, we wanted more and so drove independently to Brasov to see the 'urban' bears there. We were advised not to because our guide said this was not a natural way to see bears and they were trying to discourage tourists from going there. However, we were keen and drove through the night arriving in the early hours. We had 'Bear' written in Romanian on a piece of paper and showed it to a friendly refuse collection van driver. He pointed us in the right direction and eventually we found the right spot. Giant wheelie bins were kept in concrete bunkers behind high-rise flats at the edge of town at the base of a forested mountain. First bunker... nothing. Second bunker... nothing. Third bunker - a bear's backside sticking out of one of the bins, back feet on the floor. She pulled out and stood up looking right at us with her front paws still on the bin... I swore a lot and wound up my car window. She was enormous and I was initially petrified! Much bigger and closer than I had expected. We were just 5m or so from her and her four (!!!) cubs about 25-40cm at the shoulder. She pulled the bin over like it was a waste paper basket and her cubs went in (second photo) while she climbed up onto the wall behind and watched. Unbelievably there were people walking up and down the pavement ignoring the bears and others on the back steps of the flats smoking and chatting within metres of them. Unfortunately for us... but probably fortunately for the bears... there were a couple of policemen who moved us on. We went round the block once more for a second look but thought that was chancing our luck as we'd been told not to try it on with the police here (and we were rather obviously driving an English car).
No, not a natural experience with a bear. But one I will never forget.
We had hired a guide from Hobby Tours for a few days to show us around the Danube Delta and into the mountains. They do also offer bear watching and it is probably cheaper than northern Europe. You can find them here.
Attachments
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
I'd certainly visit Brasov as a 'back up plan' if I failed to see them in more wild conditions, or only saw them briefly. I've just done a quick search and have failed to find out if they are still there, but they do have a Facebook page! There's also an on-line petition against shooting them.
Arsenal Birder
Well-known member
Brown Bears
Brown Bears are almost guaranteed from the Hide in the Strimba Valley, Romania. The ranger puts food out for them most evenings. I saw 9 in Aug 2009 and it was pretty amazing; 3 cubs feeding in front of the hide then one after another climbing a tree. Also a fight between a male and a female after the male got between the female and her cubs. The noise was incredible and sent shivers down my spine.
I also cracking views of Wildcat nearby.
Brown Bears are almost guaranteed from the Hide in the Strimba Valley, Romania. The ranger puts food out for them most evenings. I saw 9 in Aug 2009 and it was pretty amazing; 3 cubs feeding in front of the hide then one after another climbing a tree. Also a fight between a male and a female after the male got between the female and her cubs. The noise was incredible and sent shivers down my spine.
I also cracking views of Wildcat nearby.
KFC
Ken Tucker
Now that does sound like a very positive alternative to Brasov.
James Blake
chasing the shadow of a lowskimming gull
I've just booked for Naturetrek's Spanish wolves trip for March, and will report back.
Motmot
Eduardo Amengual
Terrible news if the EU doesn't stop this. The Castilla-León local gov. is asking (again) the EU to allow the hunting of wolves. Cattle owners and hunters are pressing hard. In spanish:
http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2010/12/16/castillayleon/1292515057.html
http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2010/12/16/castillayleon/1292515057.html
James Blake
chasing the shadow of a lowskimming gull
Joined a Naturetrek wolf-watching trip to Spain last week but, alas, no wolves despite 3 days of serious dusk and dawn watching. Wolves are seen on the great majority of these trips but not this one - partly due to a fair bit of mist and rain which made viewing difficult, and probably made the wolves less active.
Actually, I'm surprised the wolves are seen as often as they are: each pack in this area has a territory of about about 250 square miles and apparently ranges over it unpredictably. We visited viewpoints overlooking 3 territories, but obviously in each case could only scan a small portion of the pack's range. There are also major blocks of woodland, plus scrubby vegetation tall enough to make a wolf slipping through hard to spot.
There's no reason the area can't be visited independently, and indeed Spanish and French wildlife watchers do so, although a permit from the local authority is needed to go off-road: I'm not sure everyone bothers with this, but in theory you could be escorted away by the park rangers without one, and from public roads you're chances of seeing the animals are likely to be low. The whole area is a hunting preserve, and the rangers tend to know the wolves' movements better than anyone, though they're still often in the dark about what the animals are up to or where they are.
Please feel free to PM me for more info.
Despite the lack of wolves I enjoyed the trip and might do it again - there are great landscapes and old villages, and a good, simple guesthouse to stay in. The Naturetrek guides Byron and John were great company and sharp-eyed wildlife watchers. We had one good wild boar sighting, hours of red and roe deer - and a fresh wolf paw-print.
The lack of wolves meant I was glad I'd factored in other elements to the trip - soaking up a bit of Spanish urban life in Vallodolid and studying Vermeer and Manet in Paris. Was also pleased to find how easy and affordable a low-pollution trip to Spain is: Eurostar in the afternoon to hook up with the Paris-Madrid sleeper gets you there without fuss.
cheers
James
Actually, I'm surprised the wolves are seen as often as they are: each pack in this area has a territory of about about 250 square miles and apparently ranges over it unpredictably. We visited viewpoints overlooking 3 territories, but obviously in each case could only scan a small portion of the pack's range. There are also major blocks of woodland, plus scrubby vegetation tall enough to make a wolf slipping through hard to spot.
There's no reason the area can't be visited independently, and indeed Spanish and French wildlife watchers do so, although a permit from the local authority is needed to go off-road: I'm not sure everyone bothers with this, but in theory you could be escorted away by the park rangers without one, and from public roads you're chances of seeing the animals are likely to be low. The whole area is a hunting preserve, and the rangers tend to know the wolves' movements better than anyone, though they're still often in the dark about what the animals are up to or where they are.
Please feel free to PM me for more info.
Despite the lack of wolves I enjoyed the trip and might do it again - there are great landscapes and old villages, and a good, simple guesthouse to stay in. The Naturetrek guides Byron and John were great company and sharp-eyed wildlife watchers. We had one good wild boar sighting, hours of red and roe deer - and a fresh wolf paw-print.
The lack of wolves meant I was glad I'd factored in other elements to the trip - soaking up a bit of Spanish urban life in Vallodolid and studying Vermeer and Manet in Paris. Was also pleased to find how easy and affordable a low-pollution trip to Spain is: Eurostar in the afternoon to hook up with the Paris-Madrid sleeper gets you there without fuss.
cheers
James
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
I'm giving this thread a bit of a bump as I'll probably being giving bear and wolf a go in Spain next year. May be a long shot but I love Spain so any excuse to go back.
Mike Richardson
Formerly known as Skink1978
I know guided tours are not your thing (and not mine either) but this link looks interesting. Note they do a combined wolf and bear trip to Spain.
http://www.europesbig5.com/
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
Yes I'd looked at that site, some pretty gripping videos.
Julian Sykes Wildlife
Jules Sykes
Steve, I am planning a recce there next August and will be probably looking to fill a car/minibus. I know the Sierra de Culebra having seen Iberian Wolf several times there including this August.
I have not yet visited Somiedo but I have some good info on where to go but will be looking to source accommo for future trips if it looks feasible for seeing Brown Bear in the area.
Cheers Jules
Attachments
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
Jules
Thanks for your post. At the moment I suspect I'll be in the area, on a family holiday, in August. My planned trip to the States looking like it's going to be a victim of the recession and increasing flight costs. Well that and a desire for a new camera.
Thanks for your post. At the moment I suspect I'll be in the area, on a family holiday, in August. My planned trip to the States looking like it's going to be a victim of the recession and increasing flight costs. Well that and a desire for a new camera.
rosbifs
PutAin STOP
Same as the bins really just surrounded by trees not houses.......
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
I was in Romania this spring. We spent one night in Brasov, everyone we spoke to was convinced that the bears were no longer visiting the bins. We did think about trying anyway, but we'd flown over night, not got any sleep and so food, wine and a reasonably early night won. We did a fair bit of spotlighting in the Carpathian mountains, without success. However it's a superb area and definitely recommended. We did see wild cat - in the middle of the day.
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
Just a bit of a bump, as I'm starting to put together my plans.
Steve Babbs
Well-known member
It looks likely I'll be giving this a bash around Easter time. I have enough gen to go, but I would be keen to know if anyone else has tried independently, recently, and how you got on.
