Warning for a few. (3 Viewers)

[Steve]

Gents, no real easy way to say this so I'm going to say it as it is. I am sick to the back teeth of waking up to find a whole load of mail or PMs about the total disregard by a FEW members for the postings and views of other members in the optics section of BF.

One or two on here get involved in every thread posted and it seems if you don't agree with them then you are brow beaten or told how wrong you are, well it doesn't work like that I'm afraid and its going to stop, because I am simply just going to kick some sorry arses into the long grass. the optics section is a community with the whole BF community and long may it continue to be up there with other forums in discussing everything to do with optics, but it is not a sounding board for political bollox, or making absurd sweeping statements about how bad every other optic is EXCEPT the one YOU own is, and taking threads way of course until other members who have something to say on the subject simply don't bother.

Why the **** would you or anyone post anything in a thread they don't have anything sensible to say about, I find it incredible sometimes that a member will start posting negative rubbish simply because they feel as though they need to get involved??? I read some post's on here and think what utter claptrap but I move on because I would not bring anything sensible, readable, or interesting to the discussion, why is it that certain members of the optic section feel they have add their two cents worth of non related crap to upset everyone who has a genuine interest in the post? Beats me:C

Healthy debate and discussion is of course very welcome and to a degree we have to wade through some treacle occasionally to get to the sensible bits, BUT shouting loudest being rude, obnoxious and lets face it boringly repetitive is not going to get you any points, kudos,or a cigar on this site, its going to get you canned in the long run.

If you want to discuss politics, football, star trek, Dr Who, Miss world, the war in Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan, etc or what bins the taliban favour,then go to Ruffled feathers.

No one wants to lose members but if it is for the greater good for the majority, then unfortunately your going to wonder where certain individuals have gone.

Rant over

yours with love

Steve o

 

[OsageArcher]

Isn't it always an option to just pass over and ignore the posts that you don't agree with? Just like on a TV, no one forces me to watch and listen to a channel I don't want to.

It sounds as if YOU are saying, "You must agree with ME and my ideas of decorum etc. or I will banish you!" To me that doesn't seem to be much different than what you are complaining about...

 

[Steve]

Isn't it always an option to just pass over and ignore the posts that you don't agree with? Just like on a TV, no one forces me to watch and listen to a channel I don't want to.

It sounds as if YOU are saying, "You must agree with ME and my ideas of decorum etc. or I will banish you!" To me that doesn't seem to be much different than what you are complaining about...

Osagearcher, thats exactly what I'm saying, agree with the way I want certain members to behave or march off elsewhere to play. re read my post ,(especially about passing post's instead of posting rubbish ) then understand what I'm saying, then take it on board, then make a decision as to whether you are going to make an argument out of it because you want to post here and piss me off ,then I will make a decision on whether you remain a member or not.

Simple isn't it?

 

[NDhunter]

Steve:

This is troubling, and why the ignore feature is offered.

I have used it. OpticsNuts is on mine, and if he is the one complaining, then
consider the source.

Jerry

 

[OPTIC_NUT]

Sir:
I never complain privately or in secret. Never.
I am open in all in my logic and the argumentative fallacies and politics I complain about.
I do not whine privately, and I am content to go down if it is the cost of truth.
The troubles have been experienced by very good people elsewhere. If they find a home here,
I am content to be where discovery lives....somewhere else.
If you have me on ignore, could someone please pass this on?

 

[OPTIC_NUT]

I did send a message in private.
It was a request to be banned.
It's best for all concerned...in the short run.

 

[Troubador]

Steve

Your intervention is well timed. We could all benefit from remembering our manners.

It appears that some folks are proud of their 'I tell it like I see it', 'I don't dress stuff up', 'You need to take me as you find me', 'You don't like what I say then tough, get over it', sort of attitude.

In face to face situations I favour candour over dissembling and although the attitude described above can sometimes feel abrupt, even rude, it can just as often be refreshing.

BUT.

It seems to me that too many folks don't appreciate that when typing out a post, that other folks reading it cannot hear the OP's tone of voice, cannot see body language or gestures, cannot see facial expressions and so can easily misinterpret words, phrases and sentences and be hurt, offended, insulted, enraged etc etc.

I know from personal experience that one or two folks didn't consider this aspect and when it was drawn to their attention they radically changed the way they posted and are valued members of the BF community.

So, Steve, before kicking members off this esteemed site, please consider a bit of 'social coaching' first.

Best wishes Lee

 

[Steve]

I did send a message in private.
It was a request to be banned.
It's best for all concerned...in the short run.

Send it to me I'll make your request priority.

 

[OPTIC_NUT]

I'm thinking....there is only trouble with binoculars.
I can just not go to binoculars. The other places have no real issues
with turf, co-opting, argumentative fallacies, cross-posting, and ad-hom attacks.
I react excessively to such things. I can just not go to that place.

 

[David in NC]

Steve...

I hear what you are saying and ONLY what you are saying (without reading into it like I think some might). As a former moderator on another Internet forum years ago I know of the extra work for no compensation and the need to police every so often.

Thank you.



David

Edited to add: Googling "treacle" now however... :king:

 

[Steve260]

Steve,

Thank you for the work you do to moderate this forum, and for laying out some basic rules to ensure that the forum can remain a respectful and civil place to discuss optics.

I am a relatively new member here. When I first posted to this forum several months ago with a request for some advice, I felt very welcome and received many very helpful and informative replies. I have noticed a recent increase in posts that just seem to be either argumentative for argument's sake, or redirect the thread toward a particular favored or unfavored optic, irrespective of the thread topic. Puzzling....

You will notice that my post count is not high. As a general rule, I will only post if I have something to add to a thread based on my own direct personal experience (not based on hearsay), or if I need to solicit input on a topic. I have been very fortunate to own binoculars from all of the alpha companies, and in my experience, there hasn't been any such thing as a "bad" binocular among them. I am happy to share my experiences to those who may ask, but for me to comment or have a strong opinion about any optic I haven't directly experienced in person seems a bit ridiculous.

Anyway, I think you are doing the right thing by reining things in to keep the forum civil and informative.

Best regards,
Steve

 

[Sancho]

Anyway, I think you are doing the right thing by reining things in to keep the forum civil and informative.

Best regards,
Steve

Agreed. I think it's sad to see people who are probably all nice, decent folk, argue on an Internet forum about an interest they share. BF was the first forum I ever joined, and learning to navigate the protocols of online communication, which differs so much from everyday discourse, was a learning curve. I fell foul of the mods a few times, and occasionally (and unintentionally) rubbed other members up the wrong way. Now I have to remember that online banter can be misinterpreted, and there are also cultural differences - what constitutes a jolly jibe in Cork might read as offensive in New Delhi. As regards binoculars, they're only tubes with glass in. (We could be having real spats about Ivory-billed Woodpeckers and Giant Ravens, like in the old days!). In any case, a polite and gentle apology is, I find, always the best solution when someone has taken offence. It costs nothing except unnecessary ego, and can lead to a friendly online exchange, which is far healthier.

 

[Swissboy]

............... life is too short to argue over a few toys.

VERY well said! :-O

 

[CSG]

I've backed away from posting here recently. I was repeatedly insulted by a couple long time members who didn't like my thoughts on a couple issues and flatly stated I was didn't know what I was talking about. Well, sorry boys, but we all see differently and get along with different optics differently. One of them is posting in this thread but I put him and a few other on ignore. Made life much easier on the binocular forum but it's still not the enjoyable place it was when I first posted there around 2006.

 

[Leif]

I've backed away from posting here recently. I was repeatedly insulted by a couple long time members who didn't like my thoughts on a couple issues and flatly stated I was didn't know what I was talking about. Well, sorry boys, but we all see differently and get along with different optics differently. One of them is posting in this thread but I put him and a few other on ignore. Made life much easier on the binocular forum but it's still not the enjoyable place it was when I first posted there around 2006.

I sympathise. Long ago I gave up on Bird Forum as I got sick of being put down, and basically called ignorant, by a small group of obnoxious people who came over from the Cloudy Nights forum. They pat each other on the back, tell each other that their posts are important, and put others down. After a while I grew tired of their autistic posting style. For a while the binoculars forum was full of long winded rambling nonsensical posts from one of these people.

 

[james holdsworth]

I sympathise. Long ago I gave up on Bird Forum as I got sick of being put down, and basically called ignorant, by a small group of obnoxious people who came over from the Cloudy Nights forum. They pat each other on the back, tell each other that their posts are important, and put others down. After a while I grew tired of their autistic posting style. For a while the binoculars forum was full of long winded rambling nonsensical posts from one of these people.

I wish you would post more, Leif, as I find what you have to say very informative and reasoned.

As for the rest of it, it's the internet and what would the internet be without vitriol? There isn't a forum I have been involved in - Porsche, F1, binoculars etc. etc. that doesn't descend into chaos from time-to-time, usually due to just a few folks that have personal agenda's or conflicts of interest - like selling of the products in question.

That, I think, is a big problem here.

 

[David in NC]

I wish you would post more, Leif, as I find what you have to say very informative and reasoned.

As for the rest of it, it's the internet and what would the internet be without vitriol? There isn't a forum I have been involved in - Porsche, F1, binoculars etc. etc. that doesn't descend into chaos from time-to-time, usually due to just a few folks that have personal agenda's or conflicts of interest - like selling of the products in question.

That, I think, is a big problem here.

Don't forget four pages of coffee...

 

[jan van daalen]

I wish you would post more, Leif, as I find what you have to say very informative and reasoned.

As for the rest of it, it's the internet and what would the internet be without vitriol? There isn't a forum I have been involved in - Porsche, F1, binoculars etc. etc. that doesn't descend into chaos from time-to-time, usually due to just a few folks that have personal agenda's or conflicts of interest - like selling of the products in question.

That, I think, is a big problem here.

Ehhh, do you mean Mike here, James????

Jan

 

[Tord S Eriksson]

I wish you would post more, Leif, as I find what you have to say very informative and reasoned.

As for the rest of it, it's the internet and what would the internet be without vitriol? There isn't a forum I have been involved in - Porsche, F1, binoculars etc. etc. that doesn't descend into chaos from time-to-time, usually due to just a few folks that have personal agenda's or conflicts of interest - like selling of the products in question.

That, I think, is a big problem here.

Many of these miscreants can be reined in by banning them for a while. Done so in another forum where I am the moderator, and it works quite well. Some pop up back, under some other name, but most just don't bother!

I know a few places where stuff like that is unheard of, or very, very rare, but I better not tell where those are!

DPReview's forums for Canon is infamous in this respect, while the Nikon groups are better, and Pentax's even better still!

Many write really dumb things when drunk, so let's hope that alcohol tester becomes part of computers in the future! Blow to access the internet!!!

 

[bh46118]

That darned Canon riff raff.:-O

DPReview's forums for Canon is infamous in this respect, while the Nikon groups are better, and Pentax's even better still!