Welsh Peregrine
Well-known member
Oliveiros et al 2019 is the only reference quoted in the Lynx book.
-
Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.
Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
Motacillidae (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Richard Klim
- Start date
Acanthis
Well-known member
Well that's a little frustrating!🤨
l_raty
laurent raty
My tree is here, FWIW: https://www.birdforum.net/threads/petronia-or-gymnoris.323133/post-3388608 , but support for the position of this taxon was poor.
Carpospiza was made a Passeridae based on the structure of its tongue apparatus : Ivanistkiy 1997 http://ashipunov.info/shipunov/school/books/ivanitskij1996_vorobji.djvu (p. 128: "Как ноказали результаты препаровки, проведенной но нашей просьбе Л.П.Корзуном, подъязычный аппарат и язык Carpospiza весьма подвижны и по своему строению типичны для Passeridae (см. Bock, Morony, 1978), но отлнчаются от ирочих зерноядных птиц."), Bock 2004 https://www.researchgate.net/publication/226579202 . Motacillidae were not discussed in this context, however.
I have seen no publication supporting Carpospiza being a Motacillidae either. I do not believe, in any case, that it might be embedded in this family, and it does not match Motacillidae morphologically at all -- hence, if it happened to be basal in a clade also including traditional Motacillidae, I'd rather tend to make it a family on its own. (Ivanistkiy 1997 made it a separate subfamily within Passeridae.)
Last edited:
Jim LeNomenclatoriste
Je suis un mignon petit Traquet rubicole
Can not open this link
l_raty
laurent raty
You need either a djvu viewer, or a plugin/add-on/extension that would achieve the same thing in your browser. See e.g. http://www.djvu.org/resources/ for the former; or the options of your browser for the latter.
Welsh Peregrine
Well-known member
The Lynx tree shows it as a unique basal offshoot to the Motacillid tree.
Xenospiza
Distracted
Thanks Laurent. I found another publication putting Carpospiza in Passeridae (on morphological grounds) as well.
Maybe Lynx is presenting original research. The reference is wrong in any case.
l_raty
laurent raty
Hi J-H. OK, maybe I should refrain from embedding Cyrillic quotes in my English text if I don't want to lose my readers.
I actually cited this too; I quoted Ivanitskiy's sentence in full because the .djvu file is image-only, and I wanted to make it possible to copy-paste the text for translation.
The argument in both works is basically the same (i.e., the morphology of the tongue of Carpospiza is that of a typical Passeridae); Ivanitskiy stated it as a single sentence, while Bock's paper, which was specifically about this aspect, went into much finer details; Ivanitskiy was earlier, but Bock did not cite him.
Last edited:
Xenospiza
Distracted
I can read Cyrillic so I have no excuse, haha!Hi J-H. OK, maybe I should refrain from embedding Cyrillic quotes in my English text if I don't want to lose my readers.
I actually cited this too; I quoted Ivanitskiy's sentence in full because the .djvu file is image-only, and I wanted to make it possible to copy-paste the text for translation.
The argument in both works is basically the same (i.e., the morphology of the tongue of Carpospiza is that of a typical Passeridae); Ivanitskiy stated it as a single sentence, while Bock's paper, which was specifically about this aspect, went into much finer details; Ivanitskiy was earlier, but Bock did not cite him.
Jim LeNomenclatoriste
Je suis un mignon petit Traquet rubicole
Smith P. & Clay R.P. (2021).
Abstract
The identity of Félix de Azara's ''Alondra'' and implications for Neotropical pipit nomenclature (Aves, Motacillidae: Anthus). Félix de Azara described five species of “Alondra” in his seminal work on birds of Paraguay in 1805. Two of these are pipits Anthus: No. 146 Alondra Chií and No. 147 Alondra Correndera. Vieillot (1818) then formally described the two based entirely on Azaraʼs descriptions, respectively Anthus chii and Anthus correndera. The former has long been considered unidentifiable, though it has also been used frequently as a valid name for the Yellowish Pipit Anthus lutescens. The latter of the two names has been in valid usage since its description for the Correndera Pipit A. correndera of southern and Andean South America. In this paper we confirm that the description of No. 146 Alondra Chií is clearly identifiable and Anthus chii is the valid name for the Yellowish Pipit under the Principle of Priority, and Anthus turdinus of Merrem is a junior synonym of it. The description No. 147 Alondra Correndera is shown to refer to Ochre-breasted Pipit A. nattereri and not A. correndera as currently understood. However, the two names have been in constant usage for their respective species since their description, and thus we designate a neotype of the Correndera Pipit for current A. correndera under Article 75.6 of the International Code of Zoological Nomenclature to conserve current usage and avoid unnecessary nomenclatural confusion.
So, well, I will need a little more clarification about the valid name of each taxa
Abstract
The identity of Félix de Azara's ''Alondra'' and implications for Neotropical pipit nomenclature (Aves, Motacillidae: Anthus). Félix de Azara described five species of “Alondra” in his seminal work on birds of Paraguay in 1805. Two of these are pipits Anthus: No. 146 Alondra Chií and No. 147 Alondra Correndera. Vieillot (1818) then formally described the two based entirely on Azaraʼs descriptions, respectively Anthus chii and Anthus correndera. The former has long been considered unidentifiable, though it has also been used frequently as a valid name for the Yellowish Pipit Anthus lutescens. The latter of the two names has been in valid usage since its description for the Correndera Pipit A. correndera of southern and Andean South America. In this paper we confirm that the description of No. 146 Alondra Chií is clearly identifiable and Anthus chii is the valid name for the Yellowish Pipit under the Principle of Priority, and Anthus turdinus of Merrem is a junior synonym of it. The description No. 147 Alondra Correndera is shown to refer to Ochre-breasted Pipit A. nattereri and not A. correndera as currently understood. However, the two names have been in constant usage for their respective species since their description, and thus we designate a neotype of the Correndera Pipit for current A. correndera under Article 75.6 of the International Code of Zoological Nomenclature to conserve current usage and avoid unnecessary nomenclatural confusion.
So, well, I will need a little more clarification about the valid name of each taxa
l_raty
laurent raty
Lord.... Which Code is this based on ?
An author can of course ABSOLUTELY NEVER himself designate a neotype which would be demonstrably another taxon than the original type. Only the Commission can do that.
Last edited:
Jim LeNomenclatoriste
Je suis un mignon petit Traquet rubicole
Then, how could Zootaxa come to accept this ?
l_raty
laurent raty
Very good question.
(But the fact that they accepted it does not give it standing. No neotype can have been fixed validly under this type of circumstances. The original (lost) type series stands, and there is probably now a museum, somewhere in the world, with a specimen which is taken care of as if it was a type, but which, currently at least, is not one.)
Last edited:
l_raty
laurent raty
Azara's original Spanish text: https://books.google.com/books?id=4QkAAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA2 .
Sonini's French translation: https://books.google.com/books?id=AUVl3MUBcyQC&pg=PA314 (= "Azara" apud most French authors of this time).
Vieillot' descriptions: https://www.biodiversitylibrary.org/page/18046634 .
Sonini's French translation: https://books.google.com/books?id=AUVl3MUBcyQC&pg=PA314 (= "Azara" apud most French authors of this time).
Vieillot' descriptions: https://www.biodiversitylibrary.org/page/18046634 .
Jim LeNomenclatoriste
Je suis un mignon petit Traquet rubicole
Heraldo V. Norambuena H.V., an Els P., Victoriano P.F. & Knowles L. (2021). Genome‐wide DNA and phenotypic information supports recent colonization of South American grasslands by Correndera Pipit (Aves, Motacillidae). Zoologica Scripta
Abstract
Anthus correndera has a wide distribution in southern South America with several subspecies assigned to the taxon. We take an integrative approach, analysing genome‐wide single‐nucleotide polymorphism (SNP) data collected using ddRAD sequencing, songs and linear morphological data, to evaluate the evolutionary history of A. correndera and divergence of each subspecies. The final genomic data set of 11,467 SNPs for 40 individuals supports a primary divergence of two main lineages: one in the Andean highlands and another in the lowlands. Estimated divergence times suggest the Andean and lowland groups diverged around 135.5 to 99 thousand years ago (Ka), whereas divergence among populations within each group was much more recent, ranging from 54.7 Ka among the Andean populations to as recent as 20.6 Ka among the lowland populations. Analyses of territorial songs showed slight differences between all operational taxonomic units; however, morphological differences were apparent only between geographically distant populations (i.e. Puna vs. South Georgia). Based on multiple lines of evidence, we propose to reduce the number of subspecies within the correndera complex to three: A. c. calcaratus on the Andean Altiplano (treating A. c. catamarcae as a junior synonym), A. c. correndera in the lowlands (treating A. c. chilensis and A. c. grayi as junior synonyms), and A. c. antarcticus on South Georgia.
Abstract
Anthus correndera has a wide distribution in southern South America with several subspecies assigned to the taxon. We take an integrative approach, analysing genome‐wide single‐nucleotide polymorphism (SNP) data collected using ddRAD sequencing, songs and linear morphological data, to evaluate the evolutionary history of A. correndera and divergence of each subspecies. The final genomic data set of 11,467 SNPs for 40 individuals supports a primary divergence of two main lineages: one in the Andean highlands and another in the lowlands. Estimated divergence times suggest the Andean and lowland groups diverged around 135.5 to 99 thousand years ago (Ka), whereas divergence among populations within each group was much more recent, ranging from 54.7 Ka among the Andean populations to as recent as 20.6 Ka among the lowland populations. Analyses of territorial songs showed slight differences between all operational taxonomic units; however, morphological differences were apparent only between geographically distant populations (i.e. Puna vs. South Georgia). Based on multiple lines of evidence, we propose to reduce the number of subspecies within the correndera complex to three: A. c. calcaratus on the Andean Altiplano (treating A. c. catamarcae as a junior synonym), A. c. correndera in the lowlands (treating A. c. chilensis and A. c. grayi as junior synonyms), and A. c. antarcticus on South Georgia.
Peter Kovalik
Well-known member
Peter Kovalik
Well-known member
PASSED (24 Aug 2021)
Peter Kovalik
Well-known member
Alexander Hellquist. 2021. Identification and taxonomy of northern and eastern yellow wagtails – new pieces to the puzzle. Dutch Birding 43: 333-370.
Conclusions
To summarise the main findings of this study, the variation in sampled birds across Arctic regions suggests introgression between thunbergi and tschutschensis between Lower Ob and Lower Kolyma, challenging the division into two separate yellow wagtail species. Overlap between birds from different regions makes it impossible to identify geographic origins of out of range individuals based on measurements and plumage features examined here. However, average differences may provide clues, and when combined with recordings of series of typical contact calls and song, it is possible to assign birds with reasonable certainty to three areas: 1 Scandinavia and north-western Russia: soft calls that are often slightly disyllabic; song either single note type or slow variants of fast type; 2 The area between Yamal/Ob river basin and Taimyr: sharper calls without r-sound and calls with prominent frequency dip midway; song either single-note type or fast type at moderate pace; 3 The area east of Taimyr and in Alaska: sharp Citrine Wagtail-like calls with r-sound; song most likely only a fast type at high pace (more study of song needed in area between Eastern Taimyr and Lower Kolyma). Based on examined features, it is not possible to separate birds breeding east of Taimyr to Lower Kolyma, ie, within the alleged range of plexa, from tschutschensis with enough confidence to meet the 75% rule for subspecific recognition, although males without a supercilium are regular in Lower Kolyma and westwards while being rare in tschutschensis.
For the more southern taxa, the findings corroborate earlier studies showing only slight average differences between simillima and tschutschensis, and more pronounced and consistent average differences in plumage between macronyx and Arctic dark-headed birds. No convincing evidence of the existence of the alleged taxon angarensis has been found. Finally, the results suggest that zaissanensis is a fairly distinct form of Western Yellow Wagtail. Its consistent plumage and separate breeding range in the Altai mountains suggest that it is a valid subspecies (Yaroslav Red’kin in litt), although further study is needed to firmly rule out the possibility of an intergrade population.
From a European field identification perspective, the findings confirm that recordings of calls are essential when dealing with suspected vagrant eastern yellow wagtails. Actually, in Arctic populations, calls seem to provide a more precise indication of geographic origin than the mtDNA haplotypes upon which publication of Eastern Yellow Wagtails records in Europe has relied heavily so far. As long as the status of plexa is unresolved, assignment of north-eastern birds to a specific taxon will however remain problematic.
Conclusions
To summarise the main findings of this study, the variation in sampled birds across Arctic regions suggests introgression between thunbergi and tschutschensis between Lower Ob and Lower Kolyma, challenging the division into two separate yellow wagtail species. Overlap between birds from different regions makes it impossible to identify geographic origins of out of range individuals based on measurements and plumage features examined here. However, average differences may provide clues, and when combined with recordings of series of typical contact calls and song, it is possible to assign birds with reasonable certainty to three areas: 1 Scandinavia and north-western Russia: soft calls that are often slightly disyllabic; song either single note type or slow variants of fast type; 2 The area between Yamal/Ob river basin and Taimyr: sharper calls without r-sound and calls with prominent frequency dip midway; song either single-note type or fast type at moderate pace; 3 The area east of Taimyr and in Alaska: sharp Citrine Wagtail-like calls with r-sound; song most likely only a fast type at high pace (more study of song needed in area between Eastern Taimyr and Lower Kolyma). Based on examined features, it is not possible to separate birds breeding east of Taimyr to Lower Kolyma, ie, within the alleged range of plexa, from tschutschensis with enough confidence to meet the 75% rule for subspecific recognition, although males without a supercilium are regular in Lower Kolyma and westwards while being rare in tschutschensis.
For the more southern taxa, the findings corroborate earlier studies showing only slight average differences between simillima and tschutschensis, and more pronounced and consistent average differences in plumage between macronyx and Arctic dark-headed birds. No convincing evidence of the existence of the alleged taxon angarensis has been found. Finally, the results suggest that zaissanensis is a fairly distinct form of Western Yellow Wagtail. Its consistent plumage and separate breeding range in the Altai mountains suggest that it is a valid subspecies (Yaroslav Red’kin in litt), although further study is needed to firmly rule out the possibility of an intergrade population.
From a European field identification perspective, the findings confirm that recordings of calls are essential when dealing with suspected vagrant eastern yellow wagtails. Actually, in Arctic populations, calls seem to provide a more precise indication of geographic origin than the mtDNA haplotypes upon which publication of Eastern Yellow Wagtails records in Europe has relied heavily so far. As long as the status of plexa is unresolved, assignment of north-eastern birds to a specific taxon will however remain problematic.
MJB
Well-known member
Peter, you've accidentally linked to George Sangster's Redstart article instead of the in-press Guallar & Figuerola!
MJB
Similar threads
