1.25" eyepieces: XW14, Barlows, and zooms.. (1 Viewer)

So I replaced my Luepy GR 50mm spotter with a Pentax EDII 65mm a month ago.
First off, great decision. Looking through the Leupy at 30X was not very good, especially compared to the EDII. I bought the EDII used with an XW14 eyepiece for a great price.

Likes with the XW14: The view is awesome, super crisp and bright with a huge FOV.

Dislikes: Once in a while I would like a little more zoom, but really I'm splitting hairs since I don't really need more zoom very often at all, although I'm trying to convince myself otherwise.

I've been doing some research and stumbled across the mod billb9430 posted regarding the GSO 2x Barlow in order to make it work through full focus on a Pentax. I bought one, made the slight mod, and began testing it out.

Thoughts: With the lower Barlow lens unscrewed and screwed into the XW14 it yields a very acceptable 40X, although the little extra zoom is hardly that much of a boost to consider it a big improvement.
When using the full Barlow tube, getting a magnification at 56X, the view is rather bad. A little too dark and fuzzy.

Now I'm thinking about getting a zoom eyepiece instead of the Barlow and carry the XW14 with me, and if need be, use a zoom for a little more oomph.
The issue is that I always see bad reviews for zoom lenses. My thoughts were to either buy a Celestron zoom at $60, a Vixen 8-24mm zoom for $180, or a Pentax XF 6.5-19.5mm that yields 20-60X at a cost of $250 or so.

Is all of this ridiculous? Am I just overthinking all of this? I have a sneaking suspicion I should jut forgo the zoom. I don't have a ton of experience with spotters, so my knowledge is limited. I know if I purchased a $2500 Swaro I could attain perfectly acceptable views at 60X, but something tells me I should forget about that notion with a Pentax 65mm. I'm just trying to get a good feel for what are reasonable expectations for this spotter.

Thoughts?

Instead of a zoom, why not consider a Pentax XW 7 for 55x views? Or, the older Pentax XL 7?
http://www.cloudynights.com/classifieds/item/45646-pentax-smc-xl-7-52/
Or, for under $100 you can get any number of quality 6,7,8 mm eyepieces that will work in the Pentax scope.

However, your initial thought is correct - no matter how good the eyepiece, 55x in a 65mm scope is going to appear dim. The detail will be there but the view is going to be seriously darker that with your XW 14.

Best,
Jerry

I have a Pentax 65 EDII and use an XW14 eyepiece most of the time. When I need extra reach I use a Baader Hyperion 10mm ( 39x ) which gives some very good views and only costs £ 95 ( $ 160 ). I've not tried the XW7 so can't comment.
I do sometimes use the Celestron zoom from my Regal 80 F-Ed but don't like the narrower field of view as much.

Les

I like the idea of just getting a 7mm or 8mm fixed eyepiece. Seems more practical than a zoom since I only want the 50-55X.
Are there any reasonably priced fixed eyepieces that would work well? Since I only need that much power on a few occasions, I'd rather not spend too much.
I was searching around and found these:
http://agenaastro.com/agena-1-25-dual-ed-eyepiece-8mm.html
http://agenaastro.com/celestron-7mm-luminos-eyepiece-93430.html
http://agenaastro.com/celestron-7mm-x-cel-lx-eyepiece-93422.html

So will one of these fixed eyepieces be better than my XW14 with the Barlow? If the Barlowed XW14 yields the same quality view than it isn't worth the extra eyepiece. Can anyone tell me if a dedicated 7mm would produce a better view over a barlowed XW14?

Thanks!

freediver111 said:

I like the idea of just getting a 7mm or 8mm fixed eyepiece. Seems more practical than a zoom since I only want the 50-55X.
Are there any reasonably priced fixed eyepieces that would work well? Since I only need that much power on a few occasions, I'd rather not spend too much.
I was searching around and found these:
http://agenaastro.com/agena-1-25-dual-ed-eyepiece-8mm.html
http://agenaastro.com/celestron-7mm-luminos-eyepiece-93430.html
http://agenaastro.com/celestron-7mm-x-cel-lx-eyepiece-93422.html

So will one of these fixed eyepieces be better than my XW14 with the Barlow? If the Barlowed XW14 yields the same quality view than it isn't worth the extra eyepiece. Can anyone tell me if a dedicated 7mm would produce a better view over a barlowed XW14?

Thanks!

Click to expand...

A good modern Barlow is pretty good! So for quick glimpses the view will probably be very close to the equivalent eyepiece. For me, the catch is in the quick glimpse part of the program.

First, adding a Barlow makes the eyepiece stick out which unbalances my tripod mount and requires fiddling to rebalance. Second, to use the Barlow you have to extract the eyepiece, attach the Barlow and reinsert the now longer and heavier assembly. Although it doesn't sound like much extra, my experience has definitely been that the "quick glimpse" doesn't really exist if you're using a Barlow. Finally, a Barlow introduces an unpurged, un-water-tight element into the optical train.

Using a spotting scope isn't entirely about image quality. If it were we'd all be using Televue refractors and Questar mirrors. In addition to a great image we want something that's quick, easy to use and durable. For me, the single fixed eyepiece maximizes all the variables. If you want to see more than one magnification then one or another important consideration is going to have to endure some compromise.

Image quality is really important to me so I favor multiple single eyepieces of the same optical family so eye relief and focusing changes are minimized. My second choice would be a quality water proof and purged zoom like Pentax PF or the big Pentax zoom. (But the best spotting scope zooms are proprietary to other brands like Kowa, Leica and Zeiss.) Barlows are at the bottom of my list for usability and durability reasons.

A quick comment on your single FL eyepiece choices above - I haven't used any of them so beware - by definition the two 60 afov pieces will not have the same open, expansive feel as the 72 afov Pentax XW or the 68 afov Pentax XL. At $100 the 100 afov eyepiece would be totally surprising if it were as sharp to the edges and free of CA as a Pentax. Miracles do happen but that is an amazing price point for a 100 degree piece of glass.

I have both the Celestron eyepieces ,which I use in my Pentax 80 and 65,and find them excellent ,especially for the money.I got the Luminos for £52 and the X-cel for £44 last xmas in America.The luminos is a lovely eyepiece.

Thanks for the advice. I'm enjoying this discussion in addition to my research.
I was playing with the XW14 and Barlow this morning. In the end, it's not horrible, but obviously much darker/dimmer than the XW14 alone.
I'm leaning away from spending $200-$300 on an eyepiece that would yield a dim 55X, and that's somewhat unavoidable since a 65mm Pentax is just not designed for high quality views at that magnification.
I'm going to wait a while, but I'm leaning slightly towards the Celestron Luminous in 7mm, or possibly the Vixen zoom since I've seen reasonably good reviews for it.

I have a sneaking suspicion that I should probably stick with a fixed 7 or 8mm eyepiece and forget the zoom. In the end, I'm only looking for a decent +50X view with a spotter that isn't well suited for that high mag. I will say the XW14 is superb. The view with that pretty much trumps my use of the barlow since the view at 30X is so much brighter and crisper that with a dim 55X, I'm not really seeing much more detail to make it worthwhile. I think the luminos 7mm may be a decent option. We'll see!

Feel free to chime in if you have any more advice.

In regards to this " I know if I purchased a $2500 Swaro I could attain perfectly acceptable views at 60X, but something tells me I should forget about that notion with a Pentax 65mm. I'm just trying to get a good feel for what are reasonable expectations for this spotter.
.

I don't think so...I had a 80mm Swaro HD and no, I couldn't get 60 power without the exit pupil being a pinprick and the field of view cloudy and dark. Also, the focus was darn near impossible at that range too, let alone trying to do that on a 65 scope. I am just thinking that any 65 scope will not net your much above 50, perhaps 40-45 being what to shoot for. jim

freediver111 said:

So I replaced my Luepy GR 50mm spotter with a Pentax EDII 65mm a month ago.
First off, great decision. Looking through the Leupy at 30X was not very good, especially compared to the EDII. I bought the EDII used with an XW14 eyepiece for a great price.

Likes with the XW14: The view is awesome, super crisp and bright with a huge FOV.

Dislikes: Once in a while I would like a little more zoom, but really I'm splitting hairs since I don't really need more zoom very often at all, although I'm trying to convince myself otherwise.

I've been doing some research and stumbled across the mod billb9430 posted regarding the GSO 2x Barlow in order to make it work through full focus on a Pentax. I bought one, made the slight mod, and began testing it out.

Thoughts: With the lower Barlow lens unscrewed and screwed into the XW14 it yields a very acceptable 40X, although the little extra zoom is hardly that much of a boost to consider it a big improvement.
When using the full Barlow tube, getting a magnification at 56X, the view is rather bad. A little too dark and fuzzy.

Now I'm thinking about getting a zoom eyepiece instead of the Barlow and carry the XW14 with me, and if need be, use a zoom for a little more oomph.
The issue is that I always see bad reviews for zoom lenses. My thoughts were to either buy a Celestron zoom at $60, a Vixen 8-24mm zoom for $180, or a Pentax XF 6.5-19.5mm that yields 20-60X at a cost of $250 or so.

Is all of this ridiculous? Am I just overthinking all of this? I have a sneaking suspicion I should jut forgo the zoom. I don't have a ton of experience with spotters, so my knowledge is limited. I know if I purchased a $2500 Swaro I could attain perfectly acceptable views at 60X, but something tells me I should forget about that notion with a Pentax 65mm. I'm just trying to get a good feel for what are reasonable expectations for this spotter.

Thoughts?

Click to expand...