Portugal/Spain Geese (1 Viewer)

Just doing a bit of housekeeping, and want to make sure I've got some things straight.

1. Both just domestics? Believe this was from Silves, Portugal.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_CXhyGmE59iU/TVEC_sjuEkI/AAAAAAAAHaw/kl93NliaGaY/s640/IMG_8846.JPG

2. Is this a Greater White-fronted Goose? Do they hang around with domestic ducks? Believe this was from Alte, Portugal.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_CXhyGmE59iU/TVEDAVuD-LI/AAAAAAAAHa0/-QkUWuEfwM4/s512/IMG_8866.JPG

Muscovy at same location: https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_CXhyGmE59iU/TVEDiHW62TI/AAAAAAAAHeI/i-XmtfAmvvE/s720/IMG_8868.JPG

3. Terrible pic...from El Rocio, Spain.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_CXhyGmE59iU/TVQdKWREeYI/AAAAAAAAHhQ/1cT4lyPDldc/s720/IMG_9304.JPG

4. One last terrible picture from Donana National Park, Spain.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_CXhyGmE59iU/TVcAywy5BbI/AAAAAAAAHmQ/OFBRL1N0skg/s640/IMG_9164.JPG

guy_incognito said:

Just doing a bit of housekeeping, and want to make sure I've got some things straight.

Click to expand...

The first picture is of domestic geese with varying amounts of fairly recent Greylag Goose ancestry.

A semi-feral population of Muscovy Ducks was around that region in 2006 - perhaps they are still there.

Your other pictures are of Greylag Goose, which has a resident population mostly in the dunes of Doñana.
MJB

Agree on the whole except the left bird in first pic is a domestic Swan Goose possibly with some Greylag in it (natural Chinese/Swan Geese have black bills, but then 'natural' ones aren't white, and the Swan variety is purely feral/domestic anyway), the other is just a white 'farmland' Greylag. Second pic is a domestic Greylag with white around the bill, which even wild birds show sometimes. The duck is a Muscovy of the feral/domestic type (ie not the piebald natural pattern), The one you've labelled 3 looks like the contrast on the pic has been tampered with a fair bit, but doesn't look Greylag to me. Maybe (Tundra) Bean Goose (would be feral/escaped too anyway). Is possible its a bad photo of Greylag though The last is indeed 2 Greylags in flight

Jan

I suspect the goose in photo 3 is a hybrid , but the photo is poor quality, On my PC the bill is pink which points to pink foot , though the head profile looks more bean. Nether species has the white eye\eye ring in the picture and the contrast between the dark neck and the paler cheast it too stark for pink or bean unless its a trick of the light. Beans are possible in Spain as wild birds winter there.

3 looks VERY weird to me... on this monitor, it looks black and white with a bright red bill! I want to say it's a Shelduck x something hybrid, but the shape/structure is very much that of a "true goose"... have Tadorninae x Anserinae hybrids been documented?

It *could* be a manipulated image of a Pinkfoot/Bean Goose, but i'm struggling to see how a camera could produce those colours from any Anser species (or Anser x Anser hybrid) without post-uploading manipulation...

Ok, just got back to the US. Here is a completely unmanipulated image (other than cropping as it was very far away).

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_CXhyGmE59iU/TVjP-xu1M3I/AAAAAAAAHms/zznQUAdh5oc/IMG_9304.JPG

guy_incognito said:

Ok, just got back to the US. Here is a completely unmanipulated image (other than cropping as it was very far away).

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_CXhyGmE59iU/TVjP-xu1M3I/AAAAAAAAHms/zznQUAdh5oc/IMG_9304.JPG

Click to expand...

Does look very odd. Definately not a Pink-foot with that bill profile. Bean is possible allowing for the fact that the photo isn't an easy one to go on (<-very diplomatic of me)

Maybe the tadorna sp x anser sp made above isn't such a bad suggestion.

Jan

I'm struggling to see the link to any species of Shelduck - the bill is pink on my (calibrated) monitor and within range for several Anser spp. Nothing to suggest Shelduck hybrid which would be exceptional - there are, as far as I know, only very old and very dubious reports of any hybrid between Shelduck and any true goose sp.

But as to what it is I don't know - I suspect the photo may be a bit misleading. The bill profile would be extreme for Pink-footed Goose, but if out of range then only just so. The extent of pink on it would be fine for Pink-footed Goose. But it doesn't feel like a Pink-foot to me - not only is the bill extreme, the upperpart barring is extreme (but again within range) but mostly the shape doesn't feel like Pink-foot - it seems too long bodied. With the pink bill any Bean Goose would be unlikely. I get the impression from the back pattern that the contrast is exaggerated. Possibly this may have made the head and neck appear darker than they really were, in which case perhaps Greylag Goose is not ruled out. That would of course be most likely. If not though, then I have to think of an Anser x Anser hybrid - if it's one of them I'd very much like to see better photos - we have a lot to learn still about such birds, most combinations of which seem to be surprisingly scarce.

yes, 3 is the odd thing in this batch of domestics and greylag -apart from what Dave has already mentioned, there is also too much contrast between a dark back and light flanks.

to identify this , there d be more pics necessary...