Any "compact scopes" that you like? (1 Viewer)

[chill6x6]

I'm going to do a little traveling and am going to "need" a compact scope smaller than the Kowa 664 that I have. I would just get the Swarovski STC but I'm more than likely never going to use it beyond an occasional trip and I really don't want to put that much cash into something I don't think I'll use much.

Candidates I'm thinking are... at the top end the Kowa TSN-554...Not really crazy about spending THAT much but I would if the general consensus is it's THE way to go. Other two would be something like the Vortex Razor HD 13-36X56 and the Opticron MM4 60mm. I really don't want to go below a 55mm objective unless you can convince me otherwise.

Some specs right off each website:

TSN-554 15-45X55 length- 11.3 inches....weight 28.2 oz $1600
Opticron MM4 15-45X60mm length 12.6 inches...weight 36oz $959
Vortex Razor HD 13-39X56 length 11.1 inch...weight 29.5oz $879
Others?

Thoughts?

 

[dwatsonbirder]

Get a Nikon ED50 Chuck!

 

[4John]

I'm going to do a little traveling and am going to "need" a compact scope smaller than the Kowa 664 that I have. I would just get the Swarovski STC but I'm more than likely never going to use it beyond an occasional trip and I really don't want to put that much cash into something I don't think I'll use much.

Candidates I'm thinking are... at the top end the Kowa TSN-554...Not really crazy about spending THAT much but I would if the general consensus is it's THE way to go. Other two would be something like the Vortex Razor HD 13-36X56 and the Opticron MM4 60mm. I really don't want to go below a 55mm objective unless you can convince me otherwise.

Some specs right off each website:

TSN-554 15-45X55 length- 11.3 inches....weight 28.2 oz $1600
Opticron MM4 15-45X60mm length 12.6 inches...weight 36oz $959
Vortex Razor HD 13-39X56 length 11.1 inch...weight 29.5oz $879
Others?

Thoughts?

Chill6X6,

Wot dwatsonbirder said : Nikon ED50 . I bought an ED50 10+ years ago and it's been my main scope ever since. I very quickly found the Swarovski STS80 I had stayed at home, so I sold it. In a similar vein, some would therefore argue that once you have a Swarovski ATC you will end up leaving the Kowa at home ! So try an ED50 and an ATC and see what you think.

As you already have a Kowa 664 I can't see the point of getting an Opticron MM4 60. The Opticron 50mm "travel" scopes would make more sense.

There have been varying reports on this forum about the optical performance of the Kowa 554, and some don't like the non-removeable zoom and others, including me, would question the value-for-money. Try one and see what you think. Try the Kowa side-by-side with the 56mm Vortex Razor and an 50mm Opticron.

The elephant in the room for me with a compact scope is that you need to find a "compact" tripod to go with it, otherwise you can end up feeling the "compactness" and lower weight of the scope are wasted. That's why a compact scope only makes sense to me on a monopod - but that's not everyone's cup of tea. I therefore suggest you spend as much time and effort on finding a compact tripod as you do in finding a compact scope to go on it.

 

[MiddleRiver]

I own the 553 (angled). Form factor is superb. It fits in an outer pocket of my camera bag and it's relatively light. Image is crisp, sharp, and lacking all CA. My only complaint might be that I wear specs, and the view is not as expansive as I would like (FOV and ER ok but not 'wow'). But it's not bad by any means and as with compact bins, it's all about compromises. I guess it would also be nice if eyepieces were interchangeable, tho I'm perfectly happy with it as-is (in terms of mag). I'd love to try the little Swaro, but have been turned off by reports of it being hard to lock on to tripod, and I also prefer the focus knob Kowa-style. I've heard great things about MM4, but knowing your taste in bins, I'd say get the best ;-)

 

[chill6x6]

Get a Nikon ED50 Chuck!

Chill6X6,

Wot dwatsonbirder said : Nikon ED50 . I bought an ED50 10+ years ago and it's been my main scope ever since. I very quickly found the Swarovski STS80 I had stayed at home, so I sold it. In a similar vein, some would therefore argue that once you have a Swarovski ATC you will end up leaving the Kowa at home ! So try an ED50 and an ATC and see what you think.

As you already have a Kowa 664 I can't see the point of getting an Opticron MM4 60. The Opticron 50mm "travel" scopes would make more sense.

There have been varying reports on this forum about the optical performance of the Kowa 554, and some don't like the non-removeable zoom and others, including me, would question the value-for-money. Try one and see what you think. Try the Kowa side-by-side with the 56mm Vortex Razor and an 50mm Opticron.

The elephant in the room for me with a compact scope is that you need to find a "compact" tripod to go with it, otherwise you can end up feeling the "compactness" and lower weight of the scope are wasted. That's why a compact scope only makes sense to me on a monopod - but that's not everyone's cup of tea. I therefore suggest you spend as much time and effort on finding a compact tripod as you do in finding a compact scope to go on it.

Thanks for y'alls response!

Okay... Here's my issue with 50mm scopes. I'm really used to 77mm and up scopes and mostly use a Meopta S2 82mm or a Kowa 88S. The Kowa 66mm was bought as a travel scope, lol. This go around the 66mm IS going to be too big but I have to wonder if 50mm will be too small of an objective for me. I also realize a 50mm scope is probably THE definition of a travel scope.

I did go to Cabela's after birding today to actually look at some scopes and of course they had nothing less than 66mm. So unfortunately there won't be any real comparison before I actually buy a scope.

As far as tripods go...I'll pick one from a couple that I have:

Leofoto LX-254CT with a XB-32 ball head- 3lbs 1.5oz(can't stand a ball head, but)OR
Gitzo GT1545T with a Leofoto BV-5 head- 3lbs 6.8oz

50mm......hmmmm.

I own the 553 (angled). Form factor is superb. It fits in an outer pocket of my camera bag and it's relatively light. Image is crisp, sharp, and lacking all CA. My only complaint might be that I wear specs, and the view is not as expansive as I would like (FOV and ER ok but not 'wow'). But it's not bad by any means and as with compact bins, it's all about compromises. I guess it would also be nice if eyepieces were interchangeable, tho I'm perfectly happy with it as-is (in terms of mag). I'd love to try the little Swaro, but have been turned off by reports of it being hard to lock on to tripod, and I also prefer the focus knob Kowa-style. I've heard great things about MM4, but knowing your taste in bins, I'd say get the best ;-)

I really had the 55mm Kowa at the top of my list. But everything I've read and your comments suggest the ER is a little on the low side. Most things I've seen says ER...Swaro>Vortex=Opticron>Kowa. And like you....although the Swaro/Vortex focus looks great...in actual use the Nikon/Kowa/Opticron is what I prefer. It just focuses better/easier.

And you ARE right...I probably should just get the STC and forget it!

 

[etudiant]

Re the tripod, why not just ditch it?
For travel, a straight scope hand held is an effective tool. It points instinctively, offering immediate views, appropriate for an optic which is mostly used to quickly check out specific items. No need for a tripod unless you anticipate spending long periods glassing a flock of shorebirds or gulls to pick out the gems,
If more than hand held stability is needed, a monopod is easier to deploy as well as lighter and more compact than any tripod.
The straight ED50 with the 27x DS eyepiece has served me well on travels. I've no experience with the new Kowa.

 

[dwatsonbirder]

The Nikon ED50 is a capable scope, and compares well with most scopes during typical use in daytime. The only time I really noticed performance affecting my birding was during a trip to Hungary in the autumn when comparing views of distant geese (C.2km) in fog against friends 65 and 80mm Swarovski scopes - obviously not a fair comparison, but it was the first occasion when others could ID birds I could not.
That said, I used a Nikon ED50 (I've had 3 actually, and thinking about a fourth...) on many overseas trips without issue - I've also loaned it to friends to use in the arctic, and they had no issues. When used with a SOC, you shouldn't have any issues with damage etc.
I'd recommend that if you want a scope for travelling, but aren't sure if you are going to use it, a Nikon ED50 + compact tripod and ball head (I use an old Velbon Luxi) is the perfect compromise of weight, "pack-ability" and optical performance.

 

[wllmspd]

This is quite compact, ultra wide 16x, could use a shorter focal length eyepiece for more power, but pocket friendly. Can use it quite well with no tri/monopod.

 

[Sancho]

Hi Chill 6x6, I've used ED50 for years, and also Meopta S282HD. Recently I got this 2nd hand Kowa 613 with 30x ep, I find it makes a better 'travelscope' on a lightweight tripod. I hardly ever use the ED50 or Meopta now.

 

[4John]

This go around the 66mm IS going to be too big but I have to wonder if 50mm will be too small of an objective for me.

I did go to Cabela's after birding today to actually look at some scopes and of course they had nothing less than 66mm.

Chill6x6

Only you can say if a 50mm scope will be too small for you, so I wouldn't give up checking out a 50mm scope for yourself. I would do some online research to see if there are any 50mm scope stockists within reach you could visit and do a side-by-side comparison with your 664. Alternatively if it really is only going to be for occasional use try something relatively inexpensive online which you can return if it's not what you want, like an Opticron 50mm or a Nikon ED50, and do a side-by side comparison at home. Check it out in good light and bad light. Notice perhaps that in good light there's not a lot between a 60mm and a 50mm scope. Notice also that if you use a zoom eyepiece when the light starts to go towards the end of the day the 50mm scope is still useable albeit at a lower magnification than you would be able to use with your 664. You should also put the 50mm scope on your existing tripods. Is the whole package noticeably lighter and more compact with a 50mm scope than with your 664 ? You may find the weight and size of your tripods overwhelms any savings a 50mm scope gives you.

 

[MiddleRiver]

 

[Elkhornsun]

The only significantly lighter angled scope is the Nikon Fieldscope ED30 13-30x50 that weighs only 1.0 lb.

 

[chill6x6]

The Nikon ED50 is a capable scope, and compares well with most scopes during typical use in daytime. The only time I really noticed performance affecting my birding was during a trip to Hungary in the autumn when comparing views of distant geese (C.2km) in fog against friends 65 and 80mm Swarovski scopes - obviously not a fair comparison, but it was the first occasion when others could ID birds I could not.
That said, I used a Nikon ED50 (I've had 3 actually, and thinking about a fourth...) on many overseas trips without issue - I've also loaned it to friends to use in the arctic, and they had no issues. When used with a SOC, you shouldn't have any issues with damage etc.
I'd recommend that if you want a scope for travelling, but aren't sure if you are going to use it, a Nikon ED50 + compact tripod and ball head (I use an old Velbon Luxi) is the perfect compromise of weight, "pack-ability" and optical performance.

Re the tripod, why not just ditch it?
For travel, a straight scope hand held is an effective tool. It points instinctively, offering immediate views, appropriate for an optic which is mostly used to quickly check out specific items. No need for a tripod unless you anticipate spending long periods glassing a flock of shorebirds or gulls to pick out the gems,
If more than hand held stability is needed, a monopod is easier to deploy as well as lighter and more compact than any tripod.
The straight ED50 with the 27x DS eyepiece has served me well on travels. I've no experience with the new Kowa.

So you talked me into it(it's not really that hard!). I'm going to get an ED50. I'm pretty sure neither of you would have it if it wasn't a good scope. I KNOW Daniel has put it thru the paces!

I may try a monopod but I sure like a tripod and for exactly the reason you mentioned...shore birds/peeps and waterfowl. One of the trips is to California so....should be some of both.

Only place I can find one at a price less than retail is B&H Photo, and they will have to order it. So it will be a while.

Daniel....You should start a series, "Beer and Birds!"

Chill6x6

Only you can say if a 50mm scope will be too small for you, so I wouldn't give up checking out a 50mm scope for yourself. I would do some online research to see if there are any 50mm scope stockists within reach you could visit and do a side-by-side comparison with your 664. Alternatively if it really is only going to be for occasional use try something relatively inexpensive online which you can return if it's not what you want, like an Opticron 50mm or a Nikon ED50, and do a side-by side comparison at home. Check it out in good light and bad light. Notice perhaps that in good light there's not a lot between a 60mm and a 50mm scope. Notice also that if you use a zoom eyepiece when the light starts to go towards the end of the day the 50mm scope is still useable albeit at a lower magnification than you would be able to use with your 664. You should also put the 50mm scope on your existing tripods. Is the whole package noticeably lighter and more compact with a 50mm scope than with your 664 ? You may find the weight and size of your tripods overwhelms any savings a 50mm scope gives you.

Yes and that's true! So as I mentioned above I am going to order an ED50. I may try another scope too. I don't see a point in trying an Opticron MM4 50mm since it's really pretty similar to the ED50. I'm thinking maybe the Vortex 56mm maybe.

And don't worry....there will be LOTS of comparisons!

Yeah I SAW that. That video and your experience steered me away from the Kowa 554.

Thanks everyone for helping with this!

 

[Mike Crawley]

I have recently purchased a second hand Viking 50 ED Pro
I’m impressed with how well it works as such a small piece of equipment

 

[MiddleRiver]

So you talked me into it(it's not really that hard!). I'm going to get an ED50. I'm pretty sure neither of you would have it if it wasn't a good scope. I KNOW Daniel has put it thru the paces!

I may try a monopod but I sure like a tripod and for exactly the reason you mentioned...shore birds/peeps and waterfowl. One of the trips is to California so....should be some of both.

Only place I can find one at a price less than retail is B&H Photo, and they will have to order it. So it will be a while.

Daniel....You should start a series, "Beer and Birds!"


Yes and that's true! So as I mentioned above I am going to order an ED50. I may try another scope too. I don't see a point in trying an Opticron MM4 50mm since it's really pretty similar to the ED50. I'm thinking maybe the Vortex 56mm maybe.

And don't worry....there will be LOTS of comparisons!


Yeah I SAW that. That video and your experience steered me away from the Kowa 554.

Thanks everyone for helping with this!

To be clear: I really like the 553. Just saying... it's one of those compromises. The ATC has more ER, but I really didn't want the extra oz's. The IQ is so good, that perhaps you should try one (B&H test drive?)?

 

[grackle314]

Consider Kowa TSN-502 without tripod as a small, inexpensive travel scope. Hard to get less expensive, less weight, and less volume elsewhere. The compromise is the optical quality. The travel-without-worries factor is great on these little guys.

 

[chill6x6]

To be clear: I really like the 553. Just saying... it's one of those compromises. The ATC has more ER, but I really didn't want the extra oz's. The IQ is so good, that perhaps you should try one (B&H test drive?)?

Yeah, I knew you liked it! My 88S Kowa....it's kinda like you say. The ER is OK...but I would be OK with a little more. I've actually been using an Opticron MM4 77 lately. It's not the equal of the S2 or the 88S BUT the ER is great. AND it's light enough to go on the GT1545 so the whole deal Is a good bit lighter than one of the others on a GT2532. Sometimes it's the little things.

I have all ready pulled the trigger for a ED50 at2 B&H, LOL! I'll see how I like it. If I don't I'll sell it and try the Kowa. I've got till the end of May before the price goes back up.

It's a shame all of us live so far away from each other! Otherwise we could try each others stuff!!

 

[chill6x6]

Consider Kowa TSN-502 without tripod as a small, inexpensive travel scope. Hard to get less expensive, less weight, and less volume elsewhere. The compromise is the optical quality. The travel-without-worries factor is great on these little guys.

I actually LOOKED at that one. The stated ER is a little on the low side for an eyeglass wearer such as myself. It's not expensive at all.

 

[etudiant]

So you talked me into it(it's not really that hard!). I'm going to get an ED50. I'm pretty sure neither of you would have it if it wasn't a good scope. I KNOW Daniel has put it thru the paces!

I may try a monopod but I sure like a tripod and for exactly the reason you mentioned...shore birds/peeps and waterfowl. One of the trips is to California so....should be some of both.

Only place I can find one at a price less than retail is B&H Photo, and they will have to order it. So it will be a while.


Thanks everyone for helping with this!

I don't know if the shipping is fast enough, but you can order the ED50 from Amazon Japan using Tenso ( Forwarding service connecting overseas customers and Japanese online stores [tenso.com] ).
I've bought stuff that way and have been pleased by the efficiency of this process of saving money.

 

[Hermann]

So you talked me into it(it's not really that hard!). I'm going to get an ED50. I'm pretty sure neither of you would have it if it wasn't a good scope. I KNOW Daniel has put it thru the paces!

I think you made a good choice - the ED50 is still the scope to get when it comes to light weight, small size and good optical quality. The only two reasons why I would have hesitated recommending it wholeheartedly are the build quality (it's nowhere near as tough as the bigger Nikon Fieldscopes) and the eyepiece problem.

The eyepiece problem is IMO the elephant in the room. The two Nikon zooms aren't really suitable for eyeglass wearers and have got a small FOV, so you really want a fixed WA eyepiece. And unfortunately there aren't many eyepieces from the once extensive Nikon line-up left. All the old WA eyepieces can only be found on the used market - if at all. That leaves the DS eyepieces which are rather large and unwieldy on such a small scope. The 27x/40x/50x etudiant uses would be my eyepiece of choice. Works really well with glasses. For more magnification - and the ED50 works reasonably well with high magnification, despite the small exit pupil - you'd need the 40x/60x/75x. Or you use the zoom and take off your glasses.

BTW, I use an old 16x/24x/30x WA eyepiece + the 27x/40x/50x (or the big zoom) on my ED50s (I've actually got three of them). I use the ED50 with the Nikon stay on case, and with it the ED50+16x/24x/30x WA works reasonably well handheld if I really want to keep the weight down.

I may try a monopod but I sure like a tripod and for exactly the reason you mentioned...shore birds/peeps and waterfowl. One of the trips is to California so....should be some of both.

Not all monopods are equal. The ones I use aren't available on the market anymore (Monostat, their big foot really makes a difference), and I find I can keep magnifications up to 30x very steady. My mother uses a Monostat with her EDII (with a 30x WA), and it even works quite well with the ED82, my big scope. The combination of a monopod+ED50 is really nice on long hikes in woodland and so on. Much faster to set up, and of course lighter than any tripod. That said, I'll take both monopod AND a tripod to Norway this summer (if we can get away, that is).

Hermann