Can anyone identify these (2 Viewers)

[Rudegar]

They were on a beach near Llanelli in South Wales. Sorry for the poor photo.

 

[WalterRayle]

Look like Redshank

 

[Rudegar]

Don't think a redshank they were actually swimming

 

[Richard Dale]

Redshank can and do swim - just like these ones are.

 

[Rudegar]

Thanks. But we are lucky here to have lots of redshank on our shore and I know them well. These were so different in their looks and their attitude that they stood out. Especially the black masks covering their faces which perhaps don't stand out well in the photos. But thanks anyway.

 

[Richard Dale]

So different in their looks and attitude that when photographed they look just like redshank? What else do you suppose they might be? They appear to be waders with white underparts and dark upperparts as well as a straight bill which is about 1.5 times the length of the head (exactly like a redshank). Their posture is typical of a swimming redshank, with neck extended and a high rear end. It's pretty hard to draw any other conclusion other than that they are indeed redshank. Excluding things like breeding plumaged plovers, no UK wader has a black mask covering its face, which means this is likely to have been an artefact of lighting or mud staining.

 

[THE_FERN]

Looks like shadow on the face of the right hand bird especially [shadow from angle on left most]. These are common redshank

 

[Thijsdekruif]

no UK wader has a black mask covering its face

Avocet

The birds are still redshanks, however.

 

[Welsh Peregrine]

They are certainly Redshank; if the original poster has any other suggestions, please post them so they can be considered.

 

[Rudegar]

With all due respect these were not redshank, I've seen enough redshank and know them well. There were a group of 4 walking several paces ahead of me on the beach, very friendly. When I stopped they stopped, when I walked on they walked on. This happened for several minutes before they finally walked into the sea and swam off. They were shades of grey and white with black faces, with a dark bill, no brown at all, no orange legs and no orange bill. So they didn't look like redshank or act like redshank, which would have flown away screaming the minute they saw you.


I have been in touch with a former RSPB warden, who was the RSPB warden for the Orkney Islands for many years and knew the birds there intimately. She says these were “definitely” red-knecked phalarope, not even suspect grey phalarope. She was surprised herself. Strange but there we are.

 

[Mark Lew1s]

They are definitely not red-necked phalarope. They are definitely redshank.

 

[THE_FERN]

I have been in touch with a former RSPB warden, who was the RSPB warden for the Orkney Islands for many years and knew the birds there intimately. She says these were “definitely” red-knecked phalarope, not even suspect grey phalarope. She was surprised herself. Strange but there we are.

Phalaropes actually don't look much like this. Apart from the pattern, their bills would be shorter and more needle-like. These are common redshanks as everyone has said.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

She says these were “definitely” red-knecked phalarope, not even suspect grey phalarope.

Sorry, but in my humble opinion she is wrong. In my view the birds are not Red-necked Phalarope (and I am sorry to say, I agree with the Redshank ID). I have seen many Red-necked Phalarope as I used to live in Hong Kong and Guangdong, where they are a relatively common passage migrant. The plumage is wrong - Red-necked Phalarope in winter plumage is rather pale grey and white, with a black hind crown and mask that contrasts strongly with the white face - not at all like the birds in the photos. In summer plumage the birds have pale fringes to back feathers, with a thicker buffy line along the edge of the mantle, the lower throat and neck sides are rufous (even in the duller males), contrasting with a white throat. The bill is also needle like in Red-necked Phalarope, straight and proportionately shorter than the birds in the photos, which show too heavy a bill.

We can then add in the fact that Red-necked Phalarope winters along way away - European birds have been GPS tracked to the Pacific off Peru. They are quite late migrants, so to get birds in Britain in early April would would be remarkable, and as far as I am aware unheard of.

 

[Mark Lew1s]

In addition to what Jon has mentioned above, there were only 2 records of red-necked phalarope in Carmarthenshire between 1984 and 2007. Both single birds in October. So a record of 4 together in April would be astonishing.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

Found this on the British Trust for Ornithology ‘BirdTrack’ website relating to Red-necked Phalarope.


Weekly occurrence patterns (shaded cells) and reporting rates (vertical bars) based on BirdTrack data. Reporting rates give the likelihood of encountering the species each week.

There are apparently 6.5k records in their database - and apparently not one in April.

 

[stevo]

Redshank.