Canon 500mm F4 lens - should I get one (1 Viewer)

[Retrodaz]

It's a really difficult decision Dave, and I totally appreciated you acting so sensibly with me. Goodness knows I need it
If I was in a better financial position I'd simply buy the lens outright, no questions asked. I'm still a good 25 years away from retirement (a time when most people seem to splash out on that big lens) and I just want to get a maximum length of time out of something that gives me such immense enjoyment. It's not an easy decision and I certainly feel guilty knowing the mrs is letting me spend that much money on myself, but she is letting me. So all I need to do is make the decision

 

[Dave Williams]

It's a really difficult decision Dave, and I totally appreciated you acting so sensibly with me. Goodness knows I need it
If I was in a better financial position I'd simply buy the lens outright, no questions asked. I'm still a good 25 years away from retirement (a time when most people seem to splash out on that big lens) and I just want to get a maximum length of time out of something that gives me such immense enjoyment. It's not an easy decision and I certainly feel guilty knowing the mrs is letting me spend that much money on myself, but she is letting me. So all I need to do is make the decision

I'm one of those who waited until he'd retired before having sufficient dosh to blow on a hobby. Mind you,I didn't have time for a hobby before that.
You have to ask yourself, do you have the time to really get value for money out of the investment.
How much gain vs how much pain!
If you can swing a few contacts you might get some images in print but it's a very competitive market and you are up against some real pro togs. I wouldn't factor that in to the financial equation unless you are very confident that you can sell your shots. Even then, they don't pay that much !
Interest rates are set to rise. Don't leave yourself vulnerable. You often see equipment being sold for less than it's value as the owners can no longer afford to keep it.
I am lucky I have a 500mm f4 Mk11 lens. It's a fabulous lens but I am still drooling over a 600mm too. I can afford to buy one but I too ask the question. Do I really need it? The answer always comes back as No!

 

[Retrodaz]

I wouldn't be selling my shots professionally (they're not that good). Because I work in the company, I get asked to occasionally do tutorials and my shots get featured in those. It's not my main source of income, it's just a nice addition to my hobby. I'm certainly not buying a big L lens with the mistaken belief that it will allow me to take amazing photos that I can then sell to people

I go out every weekend weather permitting, so that's more than enough justification for me. You're always going to want more than you have, but you have to know when to draw the line. I feel there's a huge difference between spending £5,000 on kit over potentially 4 years than £18,000 in the same period for the best possible stuff.

 

[gandytron]

Retrodaz,

If I read your blog correctly it appears that you are currently using a canon 400mm f5.6, right?

The 400mm is a very lightweight lens, and seems to be very highly regarded. The 500mm that you are looking at would be an entirely different proposition in terms of weight and portability and may radically change the way that you approach birding and photography as a result. I think that it would be worthwhile hiring a 500mm lens for a few days and seeing how it works for you, before taking the plunge on such a big ticket item that you will be paying off for a few years.

Also, do you think that you are getting the absolute maximum out of your existing lens? Do you feel that you have mastered your technique and pushed your gear to the limit? I often find myself thinking that rather than buying extra reach, it might be better to work on my fieldcraft, or photo-editing skills to make the most of what gear I have (without spending a big $um of ca$h!).

If you are really set on spending some dosh on a lens, perhaps the updated Canon 100-400 is an option as it seems to work well with a 1.4 TC, gives the flexibility of a zoom, and is just as sharp as the 400 f5.6.

I was also told a little while ago that the 400mm f5.6 is going to be updated by Canon towards the end of the year, with IS, and a I guess it would have improved optics too - but I am a little unsure if my source was accurate...

Best wishes,

Dave

 

[Retrodaz]

Oooh! someone actually looks at my blog
That's right I use the canon 400 f5.6. I certainly haven't mastered my technique, but it's more reach that continues to frustrate me, I have plenty of time to work on the latter. I go to quite a lot of places with hides, blashford, arne etc and the birds are often far too way away with my 400. I'm hoping the ability to use either a 500mm f4 with 1.4 tc or a 300mm f2.8 with 2xtc would help rectify this issue. There's a lovely bloke on another forum who has invited me to try out the lens for the day, so I certainly won't be buying it blind.
I still kind of think that I should go for a canon 5dmk 3 with the sigma 150-600, but my wife has now made a complete u-turn on how much of the loan she wants, so it seems silly to not spend it on something extravagant ;P

 

[Hor Kee]

I have the 400mm 5.6 and it's a lovely lens. Easily as sharp as the great white primes at a fraction of the cost and weight. Its limitation as all of us know is its lack of IS. I recently purchased a 100-400mm II to complement it. It's a great lens that is sharp wide open at 400mm. And that lenses IS is superb - sharp images at 1/40s at 640mm in 35mm terms (400mm x 1.6 crop factor) which correspond to the advertised 4-stops of IS gain. It also gives you superb mobility without the need to lug a tripod along with you.

As for using TCs, from my experience I prefer cropping in PP as it still gives me better quality results compared to TCs. That said, I use the excellent Kenko 1.4x pPro DGX TC that allows my camera bodies (EOS 70D and 600D) to AF even at F/8.

Another way to increase reach is if you buy the 7D II, it has a crop mode in video for electronic zoom of up to 10X. That gives you an incredible 6400mm with a 400mm lens! I have used video capture software to isolate frames of videos shot in this manner and the image quality is pretty good too unless you intend to print really large prints. That would solve any occasional problem with too little reach.

My advice would be to spend less on the equipment and more on the trips to use the equipment!

 

[Retrodaz]

I've been offered a mark 1 600mm for £4000. Decisions, decisions....

 

[Dave Williams]

A 5 year old one sold for £3800 on Ebay this week. Certainly not hand holdable but a cracking lens.

 

[Robert_Scanlon]

I've had mine for sale in classifieds for a while (though I've not been in too much of a rush to sell) for 3800. I could probably be persuaded to part with it for £3500 as it is getting no use at all at the moment. Thats the mark 1 600mm IS.

 

[johnf3f]

Just a thought but do you already have a top quality tripod and head? If not they are not cheap and you will need to factor these into your budget - don't forget a suitable and COMFORTABLE backpack too!

Edit: Looking at the prices of those 600mm lenses they would leave you some room for a good tripod and head. I used to have the Canon 600 F4 L IS Mk1 for about 4 years and it is a VERY good lens. It is, however, a bit of a monster so it will restrict your mobility but for smaller birds it is second only to the Canon 600 Mk2 (pricey!) or the Canon 800 (mm nice!). A close friend now has my 600mm and is getting more than acceptable results with a Canon 1.4 Mk3 (or Mk2) extender and quite passable results with the Canon 2 x Mk3 extender - but the light must be perfect for the 2 x! He uses a Canon 1D4.

 

[nc_killie]

if you buy th e600mm lens i hope you are built like a brick sh!thouse. They weigh a ton and you need to be built like Arnie to carry it any distance. Great lens but....

 

[BillN]

If you are not going to attach a x 1.4TC - How many images do you shoot at f4

I have a 600mm f4 but would never use f4 by choice for a bird image .......

 

[Retrodaz]

I've had mine for sale in classifieds for a while (though I've not been in too much of a rush to sell) for 3800. I could probably be persuaded to part with it for £3500 as it is getting no use at all at the moment. Thats the mark 1 600mm IS.

I would certainly be tempted at £3,500. Where in the UK are you?

 

[Robert_Scanlon]

I would certainly be tempted at £3,500. Where in the UK are you?

In Norfolk, although I might be down South in the next couple of weeks as I also do some windsurfing and want to visit Portland Harbour.

 

[Retrodaz]

I'm on the south coast at Bournemouth, so not far from Portland. I'm actually going on holiday today and will be back in a week. I will also try and get to my local camera shop and judge the weight of it.

 

[Robert_Scanlon]

Its about 5kg I think, not as bad as some people make out. The "all up" weight with a decent head / tripod isn't all that much less than the 500mm, and I say that having owned both. I am 5'10 and about 80kg, so by no means a muscle man. Sure, you wouldn't want to lug it around over your shoulder all day, but to be fair even doing that with a scope can wear you down after a while on a long walk.

We'd all like the mark 2 which is apparently mre manageable, but there's such a massive difference in price at the moment...

 

[Andy Bright]

Edit: Looking at the prices of those 600mm lenses they would leave you some room for a good tripod and head.

I've just put mine up for sale and have included the big Gitzo and Wimberley as part of a package. I can't quite match Robert's price for the bare lens though.

You tend to stop wondering about 'reach' with a 600, and that always played on the mind back when I used a 500 prime. I don't find the physical weight of a 600 as bad as it's awkwardness due to size.

 

[johnf3f]

If you use a light backpack and tripod then the 600 Mk 1 is manageable.
I would suggest a backpack that is designed to carry the lens and just the essentials. Although I now use the 800 F5.6 L IS the rest of the setup is the same. I use a Lowepro Lens Trekker 600 (mine is a Mk1), the tripod is a Gitzo 3530LS, head Wimberley 2. Even as a middle aged overweight arthritic I can carry this quite happily for about 4 miles so long as there are no hills!
Yes the 600 Mk1 is a bit of a monster, but it is manageable with a little practice and will reward you with some VERY nice images if you do your part!

 

[Dave Williams]

Andy's point about the sheer volume is a very valid one. If you are intending taking a 600mm lens abroad you have to first carefully consider what size bag you can take on a plane as hand luggage or alternatively consider putting it in the hold. The same problem applies for the lighter weight MK11 as well.