Determining the date of manufacture of the Hartmann Wetzlar binoculars (1 Viewer)

[Wasabrot]

Hi,

that sounds a lot like a description of the cheap pair of Bernina 8x60 I bought in the evening... the moon looked fine, but in reality the prisms are quite hazy at one edge... still looking for a fitting tool to loosen the bridge...

Joachim

Hello Joachim,
I guess you mean loosening the screw with the two holes as in the image below. I use Needle-nose pliers (eine Spitzzange) to loosen this screw. Hartmann binoculars are very friendly for disassembling and afterwards collomating (at least contional).

Stefan

 

[jring]

Hi Stefan,

I tried with snap ring pliers (Sprengringzange) but my (not great) pair would probably break before the quite tight bridge screw would loosen.
I just found a face wrench (Stirnlochschlüssel) with 1.5mm bolts on ebay for a few euros which should do the trick...

Joachim

 

[Wasabrot]

I use another tongs to hold the pliers. It worked for me fine to loosen really tight screws.

 

[Wasabrot]

Another 8x30 Porlerim incoming - just can't keep my fingers off the "bid"-button when these pop up on eBay. #74634 without the "Leichtmetall" writing. But I don't have it in my hands yet.

And can you see an optical quality difference between the Leichtmetall and non Leichtmetall Porlerim? Also in build quality or weight? Or did they just removed the Leichtmetall Tag from the name in the 60's?

 

[Wasabrot]

Hi,

that sounds a lot like a description of the cheap pair of Bernina 8x60 I bought in the evening... the moon looked fine, but in reality the prisms are quite hazy at one edge... still looking for a fitting tool to loosen the bridge...

Joachim

Do you want to post a photo and the serial number of your Bernina? I would like to add it into my sample list. Thx

 

[jring]

Will see that I take some pictures on the weekend...

Joachim

 

[Binocollector]

And can you see an optical quality difference between the Leichtmetall and non Leichtmetall Porlerim? Also in build quality or weight? Or did they just removed the Leichtmetall Tag from the name in the 60's?

Sorry, just saw your post now.
I don't really see much of a difference. It seems that the newest model I have, according to the serial number, is maybe a tiny bit brighter. But it's hard to say because I haven't cleaned the prisms yet.

 

[pondweed]

Another one for the beancounters.... new here but I've been lurking after making up some retro digiscoping equipment for a Fieldscope3 with a x40 eyepiece, trying out some 7x50 Marine Optricrons, and enjoying my 1970 8x32 Leitz Trinovids and comparing them to my mum's 10x25 Leica.
I went to see some Porlerim - they turn out to be 9x40 which don't seem to be in any lists. 109614, Wetzlar117. Sadly broken, or rather the viewers were loose and I can see one of them has lost its key on the shaft through past forcing. I'm wondering if they have lost a washer under the inner end cap.. there was the remains of a bit of metal there, but doesnt seem things can be properly tightened. The lady gave them to me as I said I didnt really want to buy them. I now have the transferred moral obligation to do something with them!! Has anyone got stats on the 9x40? Are they worth persevering with?

 

[Wasabrot]

Hi Pondweed, welcome to this forum. 9x40 is a rare configuration for Hartmann. I have found only 15 examples in the internet from the 50's till 70's (based on serial number) all Polerims no wide angle versions.
Based on the spec for the 8x40 I would guess that with same AFOV of ~56° FOV would be around 110m/1000m.
My experience with porlerims are that they have great sharpness in the sweetspot and they are bright for beeing just single coated but on all surfaces. High quality binoculars for its time.

I can't follow your problem description, what do you mean with viewers? Maybe you can add some pictures.

 

[pondweed]

thanks - here are a couple. You can see the aluminium arm is rounded out - I can probably use some liquid metal to improve that. But am I missing a washer of some description under the bolt head from the viewer end?? You can see a scrap of metal...
These are all the parts I have. It all looks quite understandable... I can get at glass surfaces to clean too. When the bolt is tightenen up as far as I can with fingers, the arms of the eyepieces have possibility of movement. Shall I disassemble further the other end? I'm thinking not until I have this end working.

 

[Wasabrot]

Under cap you have the screw with two holes.

After removing this screw you can remove the right ocular. The left ocular has a small screw which fixes the oculars bridge arm with the focus wheel below so that bridge will be leveled up when you turn focus wheel.

Is this little screw broken at your? At least i can't see it on your pictures. I have not seen any washers between the two ocular bridge arms. The ocular bridge arms are only fixed the big screw and the two holes on its head.

Finally it looks like this when you have finish disassembling for a complete cleaning.

 

[pondweed]

thankyou. Can I disassemble to that stage without worrying about the optic 'train' when re-installed, or wil I have to be re-calibrating things? I do have the brass screw, and I see the ocular arms - or at least the lower one is just a round hole pushfit. Is the upper one meant to be the same... ? I had thought that it was on two flats, but it must just be longstanding wear on the shaft from being loose and perhaps ungreased... someone has done some real damage. I'll have to restablish the centre point although presume that won't be too crucial as they are guided by the castings on the outer part of the arm centre.

 

[pondweed]

the problem...!

 

[jan van daalen]

Do you want to post a photo and the serial number of your Bernina? I would like to add it into my sample list. Thx

 

[Wasabrot]

the problem...!

It seems that a part is broken out.
To your question above, yes you have to collimate it again. Bring prisms to middle position and check that no image is tilted while looking through each ocular. The good thing is that you can shift the prims later via the holes of the cover plates when body is closed.

 

[Gijs van Ginkel]

In the past century (around 1970-1985) I have visited the Hartmann company a couple of times and mr. Hartmann showed me the binocular production facility and he supplied me with quite a bit of information and some of the Hartmann binoculars. I have made an overview of the companiy history and the performance of the different Hartmann models in comparison with binoculars of other brands eg. Beck, Leitz etc. in a lecture for the Binocular History Society some years ago, a powerpoint with all the data can be found on the WEB-site of House of Outdoor.
Gijs van Ginkel

 

[pondweed]

I've seen the lecture already - most interesting. I have cleaned everything but the adjustable ocular (outer) arm is worn internally and is no longer parallel on either on its mating surfaces - very soft aluminium. At present, I've reassembled half as a 300g "Wetzlar 58-and-a-half" 9x monocular. I can run with it in the back of my cycling top pockets, and its super bright to use. I think it could also be a conversation starter.
I'll try building up the damaged arm with Liquid metal but the monocular is so nice to hold that... I may just keep them safe for spares. I HAVE LEARNT A LOT about the internals of binoculars today, thankyou all!

 

[Wasabrot]

Thank you Jan, from the serial number i would have expected it to be produced around 1975. Do you know if guarantie card is for second hand or initial sale?

 

[Gijs van Ginkel]

Some Hartmann data I found in my notes:
Bernina 7x50 CF=1982 serial number 150028, same binocular IF serial number 157180, Bernina 10x60 serial number 152009, Bernina 25x80 149798, Bernina 30x80 monocular 1003.
Gijs van Ginkel

 

[Wasabrot]

Some Hartmann data I found in my notes:
Bernina 7x50 CF=1982 serial number 150028, same binocular IF serial number 157180, Bernina 10x60 serial number 152009, Bernina 25x80 149798, Bernina 30x80 monocular 1003.
Gijs van Ginkel

Thank you Gijs, your 157180 Bernina is one of the last Hartmann binoculars. I have only one found with higher serial number.