Immature gulls in the Netherlands--Lauwersoog (1 Viewer)

[Tom St]

Find attached 3 photos of immature gulls photographed at Lauwersoog haven in the Netherlands on 25th September 2022.
I believe they are photos of three different individuals.
Are they Great Black-backed Gulls?
Thanks!

 

[Alexander Stöhr]

Hello Tom,

first one is a 1cy Great Black backed Gull for me too. Just by monster bill with bulbous gonys, resulting in a drooping shape of the bill. Many (?) juveniles are paler/whiter headed than your bird, but its easy within variation.

Second is a 1cy Herring Gull. Barred tailband, notches in the brown tertial-centers are not good for YLG or LBBG

Third is a 1cy Lesser Black backed Gull imo. Please note

• dark chocolate brown overall impression
• darker, more blackish primaries, although both points are enhanced by slight underexposure (... you know)
• darkish head with darkish mask around and behind the eye
• all these features coupled with the round head and the slender bill gives this bird a LBBG vibe to me

And for the confident part of my comment: there is a Turnstone in your last picture

 

[lou salomon]

1 GBBG, 2 HG
Despite the apparent lack of white primary tips and the apparent darkness of outer primaries the third bird also looks like a HG to me - on tertial and greater covert pattern. It is within the overlap zone, but usually you can't see barring/piano key pattern this clean in greater coverts down to where GC row disappears towards outers. There is also a lot of white in coverts, wings are not that long, white crescents on tertials reach or almost reach greater coverts.

 

[seawatcher]

Find attached 3 photos of immature gulls photographed at Lauwersoog haven in the Netherlands on 25th September 2022.
I believe they are photos of three different individuals.
Are they Great Black-backed Gulls?
Thanks!

left to right: Great Black-backed, Herring, Herring

 

[Brett Richards]

1 GBBG, 2 HG
Despite the apparent lack of white primary tips and the apparent darkness of outer primaries the third bird also looks like a HG to me - on tertial and greater covert pattern. It is within the overlap zone, but usually you can't see barring/piano key pattern this clean in greater coverts down to where GC row disappears towards outers. There is also a lot of white in coverts, wings are not that long, white crescents on tertials reach or almost reach greater coverts.

How unusual is it for a juvenile GBBG to have just an extensive pale bill-base?

Brett

 

[lou salomon]

How unusual is it for a juvenile GBBG to have just an extensive pale bill-base?

Brett

Not at all unusual.

 

[smiths]

I see no reason to call that first bird anything but a Herring Gull?
The "heavy bill effect" is quite often seen in gulls looking slightly away from the camera.

 

[Brett Richards]

Not at all unusual.

In my experience it's unusual for it to be so extensively pale at such a young age. I was wondering if it were a Herring Gull (although so much pale is not usual for that species either) on plumage, and I was not convinced by the bill, and I see smiths is of the same opinion
Brett

 

[Tom St]

Thanks for all the replies, you guys are a treasure trove of knowledge. Thanks especially to @Alexander Stöhr and @lou salomon for giving details on ID pointers.
Find attached my only other photo of that first individual, though I don't know if that helps.

 

[Brett Richards]

Thanks for all the replies, you guys are a treasure trove of knowledge. Thanks especially to @Alexander Stöhr and @lou salomon for giving details on ID pointers.
Find attached my only other photo of that first individual, though I don't know if that helps.

Surely a Herring Gull.
Brett