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Lothian Birding (12 Viewers)

Can't answer that specific query but for the general case the large gulls always take the prime positions. At Seton if the tide is low and the Long Craig rocks are accessible the larger birds (GBB/HG) will hog them with the smaller species (CG/BHG) initially all on the shore, then on the shallows waters, though ultimately all go onto the sea at last light, I have never seen birds remaining to roost on dry land. Even within the small gulls there are sometimes zones, with the Common Gulls over the burn outflow but concentrations of BHG sometimes occurring further east over the sandy shore. The Meds prefer to associate with the latter, though of course are often first picked up when they come into the burn itself for the fresh water. All this you already know I'm sure, but I wonder if there's something similar at Musselburgh, the "prime" spot is the burn mouth (with fresh water) where the large gulls will be dominant whilst the small species have to make do with the adjacent areas then onto the sea. I do recall seeing the LWHG still concentrated nearer the Eskmouth even late on when on the sea.

What proportion of the large gulls actually stay to roost is another question worth considering, I have very rarely confirmed this at Seton, often they are apparently just pre-roost concentrations that steadily dwindle as the light fades, I believe many continue on towards the North Berwick islands; I have not checked those out much myself though I do recall seeing 200 Herrings gathered in the Bass Rock (16:30hrs, 15/11/08, i.e. 25 mins after sunset) and would be interested to know more about if this is a regular roost, or other islands used. A further point is whether those LWHG have actually gone to roost at all when you are looking, last week there were still 80 feeding in Seton harbour, using the lights, half an hour after sunset whilst the bulk of the main roost at Seton was settled long before that - and of course can be feeding well into the night or even foraging in urban areas, even in winter (Herrings still at Macdonalds, Kinnard Park well after dark back in early Jan).

I could probably ramble on some more but it will get boring, if anyone has any hard evidence of where the Edinburgh LWHGs actually go I'd also be very interested to know...

[Naturally I'm interested in your other post too but I have nothing particular to add on what these darker birds might be; given the frequency of known LBBxHG occurrence and I recall some knowledge of their typical appearance in literature do you think it is possible to definitely exclude these?]

Certainly to the west of Edinburgh large numbers of LWHG's roost on the forth islands of Inchmickery & Inchcolm. What is very interesting (to me anyway) is that at Barnbougle very few Herring Gulls roost there, although good numbers of LBB's do. These tend to keep together, along with the Common Gull's with the BH gulls keeping seperate from these two.
 
Todays highlights was GND, with a total of 6 Med Gulls at two seperate roosts, one of which had the returning pale mantled Common Gull present.
 
I noticed on an earlier post Cramond was mentioned for gulls, is there a decent landfill in the Edinburgh area? I am working in the city for the week coming up and if I have any free time would be itching to get out and have a look.

Cheers
Jason

In addition to what Calum has already said most of Edinburgh's waste goes to just outside Dunbar to a large landfill tip. You can get close to it from the old A1 that runs parallel to the new A1 from Torness-lots of gulls there

In Edinburgh Seafield sewage works near Leith attracts a lot of gulls. You can walk around the perimeter at the sea wall and get good views as well as look out to sea. Musselburgh, just to the east of Edinburgh is always worth a look at the Esk mouth and ash lagoons
 
Cheers for the info. Paid Seafield sewage works a visit, pretty much as expected lots of BH Gulls in and around the filter beds and Herring Gulls loafing on the sea. Think I may give a decent roost a visit if you can provide me info.

Cheers
Jason
 
Cheers for the info. Paid Seafield sewage works a visit, pretty much as expected lots of BH Gulls in and around the filter beds and Herring Gulls loafing on the sea. Think I may give a decent roost a visit if you can provide me info.

Cheers
Jason

Try Cramond, Musselburgh river mouth, Eastfield at Joppa, Portobello, Seton Burn, East Lothian.

The largest of these is the Portobello roost which can be accesed from the Portobello promenade, but Eastfield gives better views as birds bathe in the nearby burn (4 Meds & Iceland recent finds here); Musselburgh is also good but birds can be distant at times due to disturbance; Cramond is also good depending on state of the tide ect, but larger numbers of birds occur around 1 mile to the west in Barnbougle Bay which means a 40 minute walk into the Dalmeny estate from Cramond Brig, note very few Herring Gulls use Barnbougle as they favour the islands; Seton Burn at Port Seton in East Lothian also gives good views but this roost is generally quite small 2-4k birds.
 
Todays highlights was GND, with a total of 6 Med Gulls at two seperate roosts, one of which had the returning pale mantled Common Gull present.

Would be interested if some of these at Seton as I could see none at dusk, which is unusual! Your estimate of 2-4k birds is good, I counted 3100. I believe that pale-backed Common has been around since 2004, I first saw it at Seton in 2006 and last a year ago this week.

re your original comments on dark mantled gulls have you seen the candidate hybrid LBB X HG on Jason's blog; one Dutch collection of similar per surfbirds discussion.
 
Try Cramond, Musselburgh river mouth, Eastfield at Joppa, Portobello, Seton Burn, East Lothian.

The largest of these is the Portobello roost which can be accesed from the Portobello promenade, but Eastfield gives better views as birds bathe in the nearby burn (4 Meds & Iceland recent finds here); Musselburgh is also good but birds can be distant at times due to disturbance; Cramond is also good depending on state of the tide ect, but larger numbers of birds occur around 1 mile to the west in Barnbougle Bay which means a 40 minute walk into the Dalmeny estate from Cramond Brig, note very few Herring Gulls use Barnbougle as they favour the islands; Seton Burn at Port Seton in East Lothian also gives good views but this roost is generally quite small 2-4k birds.

I may give eastfield a go, I have looked on the map and it highlights a factory is this Joppa? If not some simple directions would be great.

Cheers
Jason
 
I may give eastfield a go, I have looked on the map and it highlights a factory is this Joppa? If not some simple directions would be great.

Cheers
Jason

Not sure were exactly you were looking but the factory might have been the Booker Cash & Carry.

Directions for Eastfield (NT328731) are as you drive along the A199 Edinburgh Rd out of Edin towards Musselburgh you will pass the Booker C&C on your left after a hundred yards or so you will see a bus stop, take the turn on your left immediatly before the stop (Edinburgh Rd), this is Eastfield.

Drive round the corner and park sensibly preferablly against the wall as the house owners have trouble with getting in and out of their drives and will soon ask you to move if you park like a numpty. You will see traffic cones so you know you are in the right area;)

Not many large gulls use this area but thousands of BH & CM's do.

Let us know how you get on and good luck.
 
Would be interested if some of these at Seton as I could see none at dusk, which is unusual! Your estimate of 2-4k birds is good, I counted 3100. I believe that pale-backed Common has been around since 2004, I first saw it at Seton in 2006 and last a year ago this week.

re your original comments on dark mantled gulls have you seen the candidate hybrid LBB X HG on Jason's blog; one Dutch collection of similar per surfbirds discussion.

Meds were Mussi & Booker. As for the Common Gull KG & I first had it years ago when we saw it in flight at Mussi, if you think it looks pale on the deck you should see it in flight!!
Interstingly KG also saw it at Gladhouse 2 weekends ago.

As for the dark mantled HG's thanks for the heads up.
 
I decided on Eastfield this afternoon tho later than I would have liked. Quite hypnotic if not slightly monotonous a roost that contains the same species. Great numbers of BH Gulls and Common Gulls with a few larger gulls mixed in and no Med's picked out. With such a large roost of Common Gulls the likelihood of a RB Gull must surely be high, have they occurred in the roost and if so how many? Another birder arrived whilst I was there but left after 20 minutes. If I get the time later in the week will definitely have another look.

Cheers
Jason
 
I decided on Eastfield this afternoon tho later than I would have liked. Quite hypnotic if not slightly monotonous a roost that contains the same species. Great numbers of BH Gulls and Common Gulls with a few larger gulls mixed in and no Med's picked out. With such a large roost of Common Gulls the likelihood of a RB Gull must surely be high, have they occurred in the roost and if so how many? Another birder arrived whilst I was there but left after 20 minutes. If I get the time later in the week will definitely have another look.

Cheers
Jason

If you think that was a big roost then I suggest you try Portobello, but yes it is a very good spot giving some excellent views.

There has never been a Ring-bill west of Musselburgh in Lothian but yes the odd one must appear once or twice in these areas. There have been 12 Lothian records with Mussi claiming 9 of these inc the last one in 2000 so you have set yourself a goal;)

If the strong winds persist then Booker (Eastfield) & Porty will be best as these areas give shelter to the wind.
 
Today's coastal walk carried along the same lines of this winter in that it produced a Bean Goose & Iceland Gull, supporting cast was Water Pipit, 6+ Scandi rockets (I like these), ad summ Med Gull and 4 smart Snobs. B :)
 
Defo been a decent Goose winter in Loth. I was both very surprised and delighted to see 60 inland Brents heading off north this morn.

Not sure but this might be a loth inland record count by a mileB :)
 
Not sure but this might be a loth inland record count by a mileB :)

Wonderful sighting. In terms of the record I think you have it - per the database 1991-2011, and LBRs back to 1979, there have been only 4 inland records in this period:

1 pale Waughton, East Fenton Dec 2011
2 pale Spittal Jan 2002
1 Muirton Nov 1987
1 pale Gladhouse Nov 1983

In same period the only counts over 60 all relate to the Dec 95 - Feb 96 flock at Belhaven/Tyninghame peaking at 113 on 2/1/96.

Have not checked before that, though LBR86 states "the flock of up to 50 seen in East Lothian in Feb-Mar is the largest in the Region since at least the 1930s". In the winter atlas period there have been no true inland records in Scotland (cf. today's Bird of the day).
 
T shirt weather at dalmeny estate this afternoon! My first Chiffchaffs of the year were dashing about and singing non stop - at least 3, probably a couple more. A pair of Long-tailed Tits going back and forth with beakfuls of feathers and lichen, all the usuals, a Peacock zooming past me down the path, countless bumblebees, verges covered in celandine and coltsfoot and a little squeaky bank vole... Spring is definitely here!
 
It was T-shirt weather here in Penicuik too yesterday. Spent a good few hours out in the garden watching the Blue Tits, and House Sparrows whilst gardening. Around about lunch time heard a Song Thrush, only the second time I've heard one round here, hope it wasn't just passing through. Another stint in the garden after lunch then went for a walk via the Cuiken Burn where I heard, Chaffinches, Robins, Great, Blue and Coal Tits and my first Chiffchaff of the year |=)|
 
Went west again to the tip, very few gulls now present (200 compared to 6K + over the winter) but a Merlin over + the usual views of Raven.

Had a look at both Cobbinshaw & A'rperrigg ressy's and saw 18 Goldeneye at Cobbinshaw, inc some displaying birds-I wonder if the introduction of some nest boxes might facilitate future breeding. Or are we too far south?

Goosander also present at Harperigg.

Finished off with a walk through the forestry plantation at West Cairns & Colzium in the hope of a shrike or black grouse but saw neither.

A Kitkat saved my life when I felt a bit weary/faint at one point but after my chocolate fix I was brand new and back to seeing...nowt, we'll not strictly true some Xbill's and Siskin, inc a smart male.
 
Had a look at both Cobbinshaw & A'rperrigg ressy's and saw 18 Goldeneye at Cobbinshaw, inc some displaying birds-I wonder if the introduction of some nest boxes might facilitate future breeding. Or are we too far south?

There have been occasional confirmed breeding further south as far as Cornwall - there's three dots down south in most recently BTO atlas map for 14/7/11 (Bird of the Day) including Northumbs where recent RBBP reports also mention a few summering. Per BS3 previously in Scotland at Loch Lomond and in Borders (1999).

Would it be interfering with nature though, even the ones we have are simply migrants attracted to stay by man's intervention?
 
A black grouse feeding on Broad Law was a Lothian first for me. The birds are clearly doing well just over in Borders region. I counted 51 on the road down to Colqhuar-also heard 2 more leks but could not see them

A second Lothian first for me was an osprey over the local park yesterday being dive bombed by gulls
 
Lothian 2012 find list

In an effort to perhaps get out and about a bit more this year and have a bit of fun, as well as try a few different spots I think I will try and go for a 2012 Lothian find list.

My rules are simple you just have to get out and about and try and find as many different species as possible within the year that I never knew anything about (that mean's no twitching somebody elses find and counting it, the clue's in the name really). However I am also able to target certain species within their breeding habitat such as Red Grouse & Ring Ouzel.

Also birds must be found by myself only, that is I cant be birding with some mates when one of them shouts out Osprey, I have to set eyes on it first.

So having counted up my list so far I am on 122 for the year with highlights so far Iceland & Glaucous Gull, Tundra Bean & Hen Harrier
 
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