Jane Turner
Well-known member
Then pester them harder.... the more people who do, the more likely they are to do something about it.
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more bad news from Bowland (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Amarillo
- Start date
Hard to disagree. Its actually unbelievable that it is still allowed when you think about it. Its not so much the hunting aspect but the release of non-native species in the case of pheasants and management of an unnatural habitat in the case of grouse. We expect the likes of Malta to give up their traditions yet we carry on with traditions that should also have no place in the 21st century.
I'm all for sustainable hunting as part of the management of the countryside, but releasing non-native birds by the million and managing huge areas of heather moorland exterminating everything except grouse is utterly bonkers.
Hello Jane,
MP's are not an asset in this fight... they're an obstacle.. It takes more than a few bird lovers harassing an MP to shift them off their fat lazy arses.. It's not the MP who should be the focus, it's the public.. Public awareness and public support is the only thing which moves an MP into action. This is why I've been critical of current wildlife protection agencies keeping the public in the dark over this issue.. They have the money, the contacts in the media to inform the public of this deliberate annihilation, deliberate extinction of a native species.. Give the hunting fraternity a real good kick in the teeth... This whispering campaign is an asset to hunters.. and a nail in the coffin for a native species...
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blueshortwing
Well-known member
I agree with all your points and i am pleased to see we are the on the same wavelength Amarillo, your right this sort of thing is straight out the Victorian era if you ask me, and is not only bonkers but downright immoral.
chris butterworth
aka The Person Named Above
Making yourself 'well known' to your MP is the only way those buggers will ever understand who employs them. Mine, the same one as Jane's, will hurriedly cross the road to get away from me ( fat chance, I'm too quick ) after a reply purporting to be from her was sent to me thanking me for 'agreeing' with her when I'd been in complete opposition. Collaring her in the street and demanding an apology ( I may have backed her into a corner ) has resulted in my other letters being promptly and correctly answered. We mustn't let them get away with anything, but constantly ( remorselessly? ) keep on at them. It doesn't work if only one person does it but collectively we can make their lives hell until they do as they are told and just sitting around whinging about it not making a difference is basically saying "We are useless and pathetic. We may as well go out and kill all the raptors now. Get it over and done with".
Chris
Chris
Chris,
The same argument could be used for those who support hunting and the control of predatory species.. He could be harassed from both sides of the argument.. You have to remember who his peers are.. (those who support hunting).. It's public opinion which changes things.. Birds and wildlife conservation is a nothing issue to an MP.. On a scale of one to ten it's not even a one... Respect of his peers is a great deal more important to him and his career than the welfare of a few birds...
The same argument could be used for those who support hunting and the control of predatory species.. He could be harassed from both sides of the argument.. You have to remember who his peers are.. (those who support hunting).. It's public opinion which changes things.. Birds and wildlife conservation is a nothing issue to an MP.. On a scale of one to ten it's not even a one... Respect of his peers is a great deal more important to him and his career than the welfare of a few birds...
angusmcoatup
Paul
The MP's and Councillors around my area of North London were noticeably uninterested in peoples opinions about the siting of a waste disposal plant on a popular bit of nicely overgrown land, until they were bombarded with letters, emails and demonstrations. All of a sudden they showed deep concern and jumped on the bandwagon with the result the plans have had to be put back and reconsidered. Although I joined the campaign I was surprised at what was achieved in the end. Its always worth making the buggers work for their votes, wages and expenses.
It only delayed the problem or moved it somewhere else.. They'll just build it in another location... That's a local issue affecting local votes.. It's not really the same as a national issue.. I still think to an MP birds are a nothing issue compared with people dying from neglect in hospital, jobs, crime and the economy.. People are screaming louder at them over other issues...
Jane Turner
Well-known member
...and so will it always be if people who see a problem, can't see any point in making a noise!
chris butterworth
aka The Person Named Above
That's it then. We're all doomed. Give up. Kowtow to the status quo. Knuckle our foreheads and say "Thank 'ee Maistre. We peasantry should get on our bellies and learn to respect our betters. Forgive me for intruding. Would you like us to shut ourselves away in boxes until you need our votes? No sooner said than done Sir." I don't give a toss for, as you so cringingly put it, "his peers". I care even less about whether an MP considers it a "nothing issue" ( and if it is such - how come they are supposed to be only listening to their "peers"?). We, the electorate, have for too long granted 'status' to those who, after running around like Yosser Hughes in the hustings, deludedly believe they are somehow special. If you truly believe that ordinary people cannot make a difference then you must also believe Starbucks decision to start paying taxes this year was akin to the conversion of Saul on the road to Tarsus.
Chris
Robin Edwards
Well-known member
Politicians don't serve their elecorate, they simply serve themselves and their masters as we see from many other walks of high public office be it NHS, Police, DEFRA, Church etc. However, self preservation is high on their agenda so if enough people stand up and complain rather than wait for the next general election, maybe, for just some of the time, this can make a difference and by turning a few MPs then this can also sway the public tide of opinion.
Just look at whats happening in Brazil right now - politicians soon changed their mind when enough people are willing to make their point and stand their ground.
I for one hope that the tide is slowly turning where social media and networks render it harder and harder for people in privileged positions of office and power are found out and made personally, far more accountable. It won't happen though if we all sit back and think that nothing can change.
So despite my MP dodging my specific questions and sending me bland, generic statements on high quality writing paper, I'm not going to stop writing to him.
Just look at whats happening in Brazil right now - politicians soon changed their mind when enough people are willing to make their point and stand their ground.
I for one hope that the tide is slowly turning where social media and networks render it harder and harder for people in privileged positions of office and power are found out and made personally, far more accountable. It won't happen though if we all sit back and think that nothing can change.
So despite my MP dodging my specific questions and sending me bland, generic statements on high quality writing paper, I'm not going to stop writing to him.
Not at all Chris.. Ordinary people can stop this, "if their told about it".. I'm saying public awareness, public backing is more important than the bird lobby all alone harassing MP's over an issue which doesn't directly effect most constituencies.. They'll ignore you... Most of the public haven't a clue about this persecution.. Wildlife organisations efforts just preach to the converted, and the public are left unaware.. To the general public bird lovers are always moaning about something.. There's a genuine issue and failure of wildlife organisations to inform the general public and get public backing to prevent this persecution..
How many years have birds lovers been harassing MP's over this persecution and things have got worse??? Yes continue to harass your MP's, but that alone has fallen on deaf ears and proven not to work.. Public opinion is what gets MP's up off their arses...
Jane... If you read my posts I'm continually saying there's not enough noise being made..... Complaining about the public and bird lovers being ill informed by wildlife organisations is not keeping quiet...
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Robin Edwards
Well-known member
Today's example Cinereous - somehow the last modified date shown is tomorrow's so maybe the RSPB server time is wrong?
http://www.rspb.org.uk/news/348375-..._source=rss&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=News
angusmcoatup
Paul
The point I was making is that if people get off their arses and take some action rather than making excuses not to do anything then it is possible to influence the elected.
If anything it appears to me that MP's respond better to niche issues (such as bird persecution) as it's a good way of looking like they are doing some work without bringing them into conflict with their seniors over the bigger issues.
That's something I welcome very much.. It's been too long coming.. But that's about the general state of British wildlife.. We're talking about specific persecution here.. The deliberate extinction of a British species just so the privileged can pursue a pleasure.. These people should be targeted and attacked very vigorously...
If MP's respond to niche issues such as this, why haven't they??? They've had years to respond...
blueshortwing
Well-known member
I cannot think of where any written protest or demonstration has made any difference to the outcome of a decision that has been already made. I beg your pardon the poll tax demonstration worked but that was about Money, we demonstrated about the Iraq war did that change the government's mind, i think you know the answer to that one. The chinless wonders of these estates know people in high places indeed some of these chinless wonders are in high places. I remember having a discussion with a member of the shooting community a while ago about Hen harriers, Hen Harriers he said are nothing but vermin they are disseminating the Grouse population up north, the sooner they are all got rid of the better. That is the kind of mindset and ignorance we are dealing with no amount of protests or demonstration will work with these kind of people and it is foolish to think it will.
wolfbirder
Well-known member
Staggered how the situation with the harriers has changed at Bowland. It was only a few years back that they were doing so well and breeding in pretty good numbers on United Utilities land.
Eagle Owls failed this year in Bowland but it is just a blip, the pairs are still there and next year may well be different. They didnt fail because of RSPB or Game keepers but because of individuals visiting nests who should have known better.Individuals who preach one thing and do the opposite.
TeePee Knot
Member
Ah yes Wildart and the worst news of all, those two halfwitted unlicenced serial nest fiddlers will not be prosecuted, a bad day for all raptors and legitimate monitoring in Bowland.
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