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springwatch (uk) bush whacking, what do you think? (1 Viewer)

bartolli

Well-known member
Just watching springwatch tonight, astonished to see them encouraging viewers to go out and hit bushes with sticks in order to find nests! ok, they said do it gently, but no mention of the illegality of disturbing nesting birds. Hughes-games (?) even said "ooh a dunnock flew off but I didn't disturb her! "
Ok for pukka nestrecorders, but encouraging the general public to whack bushes to find nests?
Quite irresponsible broadcasting, I'd say.
 
Just watching springwatch tonight, astonished to see them encouraging viewers to go out and hit bushes with sticks in order to find nests! ok, they said do it gently, but no mention of the illegality of disturbing nesting birds. Hughes-games (?) even said "ooh a dunnock flew off but I didn't disturb her! "
Ok for pukka nestrecorders, but encouraging the general public to whack bushes to find nests?
Quite irresponsible broadcasting, I'd say.
Was surprised to see it myself lets hope there aren't hundreds of people wondering through reed beds and heathlands this week looking for bittern and stone curlew nests to tell the BTO about!!
 
Not really the place for it I'd have thought. Should've targetted kids on RSPB/wildlife trust activity days rather than on national telly.
 
I must say I was a bit surprised. There's a real danger of the whole interest for kids of seeing the shiny prize in the nest and wanting the trophy after the hunt. Let's not rekindle the bad old days. Nest finding can be done from a sensible distance by watching birds.

I'm struggling to see what we are going to learn. We know where different species nest, we know the range of clutch sizes. I fail to see the merit but can see some obvious downsides.

I agree about the myth of birds deserting nests. I'm more bothered about destruction. Yomping around a heathland trying to find a Meadow Pipit's nest, probably standing on one or two, not to mention the wild flowers trampled etc. in the process.

No next time I visit Skipwith Common or any other fragile habitat I won't be tapping bushes and I'll stick to the path.
 
I should have said that this particular broadcast was in complete contrast to the wonderful Iolo WIlliams last week using proper fieldcraft to find + watch hen harriers in a completely responsible way and from a distance.
 
I am always concerned that humans approaching or touching nests leaves a scent trail for ground predators to follow.
Also sceptical some citizen science shemes are no more than recruiting/fundraising scams for the bodies concerned ?
 
I am always concerned that humans approaching or touching nests leaves a scent trail for ground predators to follow.
Also sceptical some citizen science shemes are no more than recruiting/fundraising scams for the bodies concerned ?

Certainly been proven to be the case with ground nesting birds that have had nests visited by humans....nice trail of scent left for a fox to follow. There is also the danger of leaving a nicely hidden nest inadvertently exposed after moving vegetation to observe it. Also, predatory birds are not daft, especially crows ......they watch foraging animals, including humans, from above and come down to investigate for themselves afterwards!!
 
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and this week's prize for 'BirdForum member who clearly couldn't care less about wildlife' goes to...


Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBirdGarden
I'm sure birds can cope to people whacking bushes with sticks.

A bit harsh, methinks - birds can cope, as they can't distinguish between a bloke with a stick and, say, a passing van clipping a hedge, or a walker with a dog. A brief disturbance is unlikely to cause desertion. However, a bunch of twitchers watching a rarity from a single spot all day will cause any birds nesting in the immediate vicinity to desert - it's the continued presence that's the problem.

Edit - whether or not it's actually a good idea to encourage legions of bush-whackers, well I'd say not!
 
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I seem to recall at least 2 Monty's Harrier nests predated the day after ringers went in to ring the young, birds should be left well alone untill they have fledged to minimize the chance of predation.

Mike.
 
I've just been looking at the programme on iPlayer:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b02xcbst/Springwatch_2013_Episode_10/
The relevant portion begins at 38 minutes.


The commentary indicates that the BTO has a new code of conduct on "nesting" (looking for nests). They say they're trying to dispel the myth that birds desert a nest easily - they say that the female will only desert if she's actually in fear of being predated.
The programme shows a nest being searched for by listening for the contact call of a chiffchaff.
The commentator is very excited on finding the nest and seeing the eggs inside.
The skill of "tapping up" is then detailed. This involves mimicking the passing of a large animal (like a deer) by tapping the undergrowth with a stick. Gentle tapping is shown as being the correct method, expecting that the bird will move a few inches away from the nest for a brief period.
The commentator is seen tapping a few bushes and he says "this is proper fieldcraft, this". A dunnock then flies off from the gorse he was tapping to reveal the nest. The commentator puts his hand into the nest to see if the eggs are warm.

As a result, I have written to the BTO asking the following:


have you considered how people (especially children) might become egg collectors as a result of becoming "nesters" especially seeing how excited the commentator became;
have you considered how people (especially children) might not easily differentiate between tapping and bashing, ending up with nests being destroyed;
have you considered how people (especially children) might not know how quickly a bird will desert a nest where the eggs have been handled.
the programme seemed to be openly encouraging the general public to look for and to look inside nests. Are you happy with this outcome?

May I suggest BF members write to the BTO and/or the BBC if alarmed by the messages given by the programme?

Peter
 
Playing devils advocate, a bit: given that the biggest problem facing our natural environment is apathy - people just not giving a toss one way or the other - isn't advising people, especially kids, to go out and get interested potentially a good thing?

A few nests might well get deserted, and a few might well get trodden on. But a few people might also go out and have inspirational and inspiring experiences, leading to a life of interest in birds, wildlife, conservation and so on.
 
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I see there is an item about nest recording on the home page of the BTO website, so it is definitely their project. It seems a bit strange to me.

They do include a Code of Conduct but it is hidden away and perhaps could be featured rather more prominently on the first page.

Ron
 
Johann Sebastian Bach: you have articulated my thoughts so much better than I did in my original post!

James A: "a few nests might get deserted and a few might get trodden on"!! Good job Iolo didn't adopt that attitude when he was out looking for hen harriers in the previous week's show!

I don't have a problem with experienced nest recorders using these techniques properly in order to record nests/eggs/chicks. I don't have a problem with the BTO training volunteers to do the same. What I do find astounding is an enthusiastic presenter who exhorts the general public to go poking sticks into bushes and hitting bushes with sticks in order to find nests! He then tops this by handling the eggs and proclaiming "ooh they're still warm"!

Instead of then pointing out the illegality of disturbing nesting birds and the importance of letting the birds get on with it, he then exhorts the general public to return to the old ways of "nesting" as he has just demonstrated!

This was all in complete contrast to the rest of the series, and previous series.

I was hoping Chris Packham would follow up MHG's piece with a simple clarification about it not really being that sensible (or legal) to go galumphing around whacking bushes with sticks but he didn't.

A simple question for responsible birders: If you were out birding and saw some kids hitting bushes where you knew there were nesting birds, what would you do?
 
No one's going to start bashing bushes as a result of watching the programme. even if they did they'd soon get fed up after not finding anything after a few mins.
 
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