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Sunbird at Taita Hills south of Tsavo West/ Kenya on 13th of October (1 Viewer)

bubo_bubo

Well-known member
The image of a Sunbird, probably a female, was shot at the Lumo Community Wildlife Sanctuary near Lions Bluff Lodge in the Taita Hills south of Tsavo West in Mid October. I was thinking of Black-bellied Sunbird (Cinnyris nectarinioides). Scanning the images I'm not so sure anymore.
Thanks for ID to the experts. Sorry for the bad image.
Cheers
Johannes
 

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It is a difficult photo, and now on Sumatra, I've no much way to check details but Beautiful Sunbird doesn't occur is SW Kenya. It is something else. :)
 
Tsavo West is more South Eastern Kenya and from memory could have Beautiful Sunbird but I wouldn't make any definite calls on that photo alone.
 
It is a difficult photo, and now on Sumatra, I've no much way to check details but Beautiful Sunbird doesn't occur is SW Kenya. It is something else. :)

Stevenson and Fanshawe's map shows Beautiful Sunbird occurring in the location given by the OP. Indeed, location was part of the ID, since it was the only bird I could find which both looked like that and was found in that location.
 
I think Beautiful Sunbird is listed erroneously from SW Kenya because, long time ago, Black-bellied was considered as a subspecies of it.

You can confirm the range here or in HBW alive.

In addition, I don't think the bird has the look of Beautiful Sunbird.
 
I think Beautiful Sunbird is listed erroneously from SW Kenya because, long time ago, Black-bellied was considered as a subspecies of it.

You can confirm the range here or in HBW alive.

In addition, I don't think the bird has the look of Beautiful Sunbird.

Hi Valéry:

As a result of your post, I did some research in my Africa books and on Handbook of Birds of the World (HBW; those of you who don't have a subscription will not be able to check this, unfortuately) and Avibase.

The following remarks leave aside the identity of the OP's bird (for the time being) and focus on the distribution of Beautiful Sunbird.

I know full well that you are infinitely more knowledgeable than me on African (and all other) birds. However, from my research, it seems you are mixing up two different things in your comment.

All of my books (Stevenson and Fanshawe, Zimmerman, and Sinclair and Ryan) show the distribution of Beautiful Sunbird covering the Lumo Community Area where the OP took his photo.

The books mention that there are two sub-species, the nominate, Cinnyris pulchella pulchella, and C. p. melanogaster. Both show broad yellow patches on the sides of the chest, but the nominate has a green and black belly, while melanogster (which, of course, means dark belly) has an all black belly. C. p. melanogaster would be the sub-species which occurs in Lumo and further south.

However, Black-bellied Sunbird is another bird altogether, Cinnyris nectarinoides, with two subspecies, northern and southern. This bird looks similar to Beautiful, and may show yellow pectoral tufts, but not the large yellow patches of both sub-species of Beautiful. I think Black-bellied could also be found at Lumo, looking at distribution maps.

I wonder if the 'long time ago' you mention refers to the splitting of the genus Nectarinia when the Cinnyris genus was made?

Now, looking at HBW and Birdlife, the distribution maps for Beautiful (which you linked to) indeed do not include Lumo or south-east Kenya or Tanzania. The reason is that HBW and Birdlife - but so far as I can see from Avibase, not any other authority, including the IOC - two years ago, decided to split C. p. melanogaster as C. melanogaster with the name 'Gorgeous Sunbird' (which isn't in the books because it's a new split not widely recognised, but which is in HBW because they invented it).

And I far as I can see the females of the two (sub-)species look the same.

I attach some photos.

1. nominate male Beautiful from Bogoria (note the green belly sides)
2. melanogaster / Gorgeous male from Amboseli (note the all black belly
3. melanogaster / Gorgeous male from Ngorongoro
4. the female that was with the Bogoria male (I don't have females from the other places)

To return to the ID of the OP's bird: to my eye, the female in my photo 4 looks like a match for the OP's bird. Note the overall colour, the 'dot' not stripe above the eye, and the form of the bill.

As I said in my previous post, location was part of the ID. Looking at Stevenson and Fanshawe, I think the only female sunbirds with this basic shape (including the bill) and unstreaked underparts in this location apart from C. p. melanogaster / Gorgeous are Variable, Olive, and Eastern Double-collared. I think the colouration is slightly wrong for these others, but I'm willing to be corrected.

My main point in this post is to clarify the Beautiful / melanogaster / Black-bellied trio for myself, the OP and anyone else who might be reading.

I'm not at all insisting on C. p. melanogaster female for the OP's picture, but I've given the reasons why I would go for that ID. I don't think it's such a bad picture that it can't be identified, partly because, to repeat, there aren't that many possibilities in that location. It would be interesting if the OP could tell us any male sunbirds he saw in the Lumo area. I'd be interested to have Valéry give his best ID.
 

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Hi Valéry:

As a result of your post, I did some research in my Africa books and on Handbook of Birds of the World (HBW; those of you who don't have a subscription will not be able to check this, unfortuately) and Avibase.

The following remarks leave aside the identity of the OP's bird (for the time being) and focus on the distribution of Beautiful Sunbird.

I know full well that you are infinitely more knowledgeable than me on African (and all other) birds. However, from my research, it seems you are mixing up two different things in your comment.

All of my books (Stevenson and Fanshawe, Zimmerman, and Sinclair and Ryan) show the distribution of Beautiful Sunbird covering the Lumo Community Area where the OP took his photo.

The books mention that there are two sub-species, the nominate, Cinnyris pulchella pulchella, and C. p. melanogaster. Both show broad yellow patches on the sides of the chest, but the nominate has a green and black belly, while melanogster (which, of course, means dark belly) has an all black belly. C. p. melanogaster would be the sub-species which occurs in Lumo and further south.

However, Black-bellied Sunbird is another bird altogether, Cinnyris nectarinoides, with two subspecies, northern and southern. This bird looks similar to Beautiful, and may show yellow pectoral tufts, but not the large yellow patches of both sub-species of Beautiful. I think Black-bellied could also be found at Lumo, looking at distribution maps.

I wonder if the 'long time ago' you mention refers to the splitting of the genus Nectarinia when the Cinnyris genus was made?

Now, looking at HBW and Birdlife, the distribution maps for Beautiful (which you linked to) indeed do not include Lumo or south-east Kenya or Tanzania. The reason is that HBW and Birdlife - but so far as I can see from Avibase, not any other authority, including the IOC - two years ago, decided to split C. p. melanogaster as C. melanogaster with the name 'Gorgeous Sunbird' (which isn't in the books because it's a new split not widely recognised, but which is in HBW because they invented it).

And I far as I can see the females of the two (sub-)species look the same.

I attach some photos.

1. nominate male Beautiful from Bogoria (note the green belly sides)
2. melanogaster / Gorgeous male from Amboseli (note the all black belly
3. melanogaster / Gorgeous male from Ngorongoro
4. the female that was with the Bogoria male (I don't have females from the other places)

To return to the ID of the OP's bird: to my eye, the female in my photo 4 looks like a match for the OP's bird. Note the overall colour, the 'dot' not stripe above the eye, and the form of the bill.

As I said in my previous post, location was part of the ID. Looking at Stevenson and Fanshawe, I think the only female sunbirds with this basic shape (including the bill) and unstreaked underparts in this location apart from C. p. melanogaster / Gorgeous are Variable, Olive, and Eastern Double-collared. I think the colouration is slightly wrong for these others, but I'm willing to be corrected.

My main point in this post is to clarify the Beautiful / melanogaster / Black-bellied trio for myself, the OP and anyone else who might be reading.

I'm not at all insisting on C. p. melanogaster female for the OP's picture, but I've given the reasons why I would go for that ID. I don't think it's such a bad picture that it can't be identified, partly because, to repeat, there aren't that many possibilities in that location. It would be interesting if the OP could tell us any male sunbirds he saw in the Lumo area. I'd be interested to have Valéry give his best ID.

Hi MacNara,

I meant that, before, such when I travelled first time in Kenya first time (1994), actual Black-bellied Sunbird was often considered as a sub-species of Beautiful Sunbird : it was a new split.

However, last time I put a feet in Africa was in 2015, I travel mainly in Asia nowadays, and I'm therefore missing some of the new information, discoveries and splits. I was not aware of the split of melanogastrus and forgot even that (former) subspecies !

I now see I've photo of a male in Kenya, but I didn't find image of a female. I need to visit East Africa again... hopefully soon !

It is now birding time (I'm on Sumatra) but will read this thread again later. Thank you for the teaching :t:
 
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Hi MacNara,

I meant that, before, such when I travelled first time in Kenya first time (1994), actual Black-bellied Sunbird was often considered as a sub-species of Beautiful Sunbird : it was a new split.

However, last time I put a feet in Africa was in 2015, I travel mainly in Asia nowadays, and I'm therefore missing some of the new information, discoveries and splits. I was not aware of the split of melanogastrus and forgot even that (former) subspecies !

I now see I've photo of a male in Kenya, but I didn't find image of a female. I need to visit East Africa again... hopefully soon !

It is now birding time (I'm on Sumatra) but will read this thread again later. Thank you for the teaching :t:

Au contraire, thank you for all you have taught me over the years on Bird Forum. Without that teaching from you (and others), I would never have developed the confidence to attempt to answer (rather than just ask) African bird questions on BF. The research I did as a result of your earlier post was just for my own education (and I hope, of others following this thread), not to show 'I'm right and you're wrong'.

I wish you the best for the coming holiday season, and much happiness in the new year 2019!
 
Au contraire, thank you for all you have taught me over the years on Bird Forum. Without that teaching from you (and others), I would never have developed the confidence to attempt to answer (rather than just ask) African bird questions on BF. The research I did as a result of your earlier post was just for my own education (and I hope, of others following this thread), not to show 'I'm right and you're wrong'.

I wish you the best for the coming holiday season, and much happiness in the new year 2019!

Turned into a very educational thread. A typically civilised Birdforum discussion. Absolutely no sense of one-up-man-ship detected at all. Thanks for your efforts and your contributions to BF in general. Hope you have a relaxing holiday season and wish you good birding for 2019.:t:
 
BF is a great place to learn and share... I will probably soon need help for some obscure brown birds of the humid Sumatran forests... ;)
 
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