To Suppress or not to surpress ? (2 Viewers)

[eyeball kid]

You find a flock of 200 finches and buntings in the winter during 2 weeks of sub zero temperatures, its an open field and you watch them undisturbed from a distance.
You want to share the experience with your fellow birders because this amount of flocking finches is unusual and there are some interesting species like brambling and corn bunting with the potential that they may attract a vagrant.

However you know that somre local photographers are selfish and will probably disturbed these birds while they fight for survival, the same applies to a local ringing group who think its ok to net birds in these sort of weather conditions.

During times like this birds lives are on a knife edge, they have to spend every minute of the short days feeding, drinking, preening, resting and avoiding predators if they dont and thier performance drops by as little as 5% they're dead !
So what are you going to do ? put the news out for your fellow birders or Surpress it for the sake of the birds ?

IN THE LAND OF THE BLIND THE ONE EYED MAN IS KING

 

[Barry Hunt]

An interesting scenario and one that I've thought about too, whilst many photographers would use their own judgement as to how their activities would cause unreasonable disturbance to the flock of birds in question, we also have the "must get a shot at all costs" types, who, probably do still care about the birds' welfare but will still go in anyway regardless but if the flock did contain a rarity the frequent visits from them would really effect the flock for the worse I feel.

I think that this subject may well lead to more birds being suppressed in the future?

In the end it's your own decision but never feel pressured into putting news out of any bird!

As for me I'd say nowt!

 

[DMW]

If the situation is as you describe, then the right decision doesn't seem to be especially difficult: keep the whereabouts of the flock to yourself, and let the birds feed in peace.

People who supress for genuine reasons (e.g. bird welfare or access issues) don't get flak from reasonable birders; what winds people up is supression of rarities on spurious grounds by birders who get a kick out of denying enjoyment for others.

 

[Tideliner]

The birds welfare must always come first. I only ever give out bird information if the site is well wardened or until well after the event , but on the other hand I do not follow the twitching crowds or have a pager. I can never understand the need to see a bird that someone else has already found, better to plan your bird watching according to the weather and habitat and see what you can find and then enjoy birds you find yourself. Following the twitching hoards is a bit like going to a football match when you already know the score. Where is the excitement in that?

 

[eddy the eagle]

What would you have done before the advent of the mobile phone and the internet?Probably told someone about it the next day! Eddy.

 

[Mysticete]

I would probably check up on the finch flock once it warmed up some and then report it. Although I question how much in danger they are from either...would ringers be active in subzero temperatures, and how the hell are they catching birds in an open field? Would most photographers be that disruptive? I am assuming a flock of finches in an open field would not be difficult to photograph.

Plus if I was a photographer and wanted some good shots, I would just lay out seed in a good viewing area and bingo...you feed the birds and are not running around a snowy (possibly private)

Kind of sounds like the OP has already made up his mind...

 

[Mike Crawley]

invest in a big bag of seed, spread liberally pre-dawn, then invite folk along.
Police the snappers, either yourself or via your birding buddies.

 

[eyeball kid]

Eddy, yes that just what I would of done but I wouldn't have worried about a deluge of selfish photographers or for that matter ringers. Indeed it's those technologies which have brought so many more players to the field for good and bad.

Mysticete, 'would ringers be active in sub zero temperatures' ,well I don't know how ringers operate in the states but I've seen them do it here with redpolls when daytime temps didn't get above zero for a week ! And yes some photographers here can be very disruptive they appear to be out for their own gratification and have no field craft whatsoever, again I've seen them do it with GG Shrike and waxwings and when they've got lenses as long as your arm ? Mmmmmm 'lay out seed and bingo ' if only life and people were so simple,I wish.

Now Mike, I like your approach, no messin.

 

[eyeball kid]

Thanks to everyone who replied to this today,very informative and appreciated

 

[Mike Crawley]

eyeball - just common sense

 

[Egret]

[ I can never understand the need to see a bird that someone else has already found, better to plan your bird watching according to the weather and habitat and see what you can find and then enjoy birds you find yourself. Following the twitching hoards is a bit like going to a football match when you already know the score. Where is the excitement in that?[/QUOTE]

Really? You honestly cannot understand the excitement of seeing a bird you have never seen before? Of course it's great to find your own birds but I love it when someone can put me on a bird I haven't seen. In fact I think one of the best aspects of birdwatching is the shared experience. I also love it when I can point a birder in the right direction.
Birdwatchers get enough flak so it would be nice if we could be a bit more supportive of each other.
There is more than one way to enjoy birds. Mind you, I would say that; I have watched football matches where I know the score; plays and films where I know the outcome; read books more than once; watched "Friends" till I know the script.

 

[Zheljko]

Here the most likely scenario would be that everyone who wanted to visit the particular area (and did not have other obligations at the time) would be part of the group of birdwatchers that observed the bird flock at the first ocasion (it is always advisable to go around in groups in unfavorable weather so you can help each other). They would take pictures and share them with the rest of us, and we would oh and ah and share our pictures from somewhere else.

The other scenario would be that birds are in an easily approachable place in (sub)urban area where people regularly pass by on foot all day long (a public park), and then the birdwatchers would be just a few out of many persons potentially disturbing the birds (and birds would probably fly away if they felt threatened). Right now there is a flock of about 200 Waxwings in a public park of an University campus in another city. Students walk by, other citizens from the neighborhood walk by on their way to work or grocery store, people may just go for a walk in the park* etc.
*many persons purposefully go out in subzero conditions in order to feed the swans at Danube.

 

[Tideliner]

Egret , I never go to see a bird that someone else has found and would rather not see the bird than join the twitching hoards. Indeed when bird watching I usualy walk the other way if i see a crowd gathering around to see some rareity. I get little excitement seeing a bird i have never seen before interest yes , but not excitement. For me the sight of of the first returning autumn pink feet or calling wild swans under the moon sends a shiver down my spine or watching at close quarters the antics of a breeding group of dunnocks is far more exciting.

For me bird watching is a solitary sport , just me the landscape and the birds , the presence of another human is just a distraction. Great if you have to to let the county recorded know later if wise , but otherwise i keep my sightings to myself and as I live on the Norfolk coast and bird watch most days of the year I see a hell of a lot of stuff some of it very rare to say the least including a couple of races of passerines only recorded a handful of times in the UK. ie all 3 races of willow warbler photographed in the hand and ringed on the same day and Neumanni spotted flycatcher also ringed and photographed with its ID confirmed 6 months later in a closed meeting of Norfolk Ringers Group.

If you cant find the birds yourself you need to ask how good you are at this hobby. Anyone can follow the crowd but it takes a knowledge of weather , habitat and the birds requirements to find your own birds. A month ago i wanted to watch and take notes on Taga bean geese. I searched a grassland 20 miles away from their normal site often used by pink feet. In the recent cold snap it was one of the only snow free areas localy. As dawn broke the pink feet started to arrive , about 3,000 of them and within an hour sure enough there was a group of 8 bean geese with them which in time fed within 20m of my hide giving me splended views in sparkling sunlight. After four hours I crept away bent double wading through a ditch ( I had come prepared with cheast waders ) with the geese unaware I had even been there. Only to have the whole lot scared off by some idiot walking across the marsh looking for a reported RL buzzard which he never saw despite it having been sitting on a gate post for the past hour a few hundred yards off. ( An hour earlier i had called it almost overhead ) . I planed my trip with a pretty good knowlege of what the bean geese would do in a given set of weather looked at the right area with the right type of grazing and lack of snow and found what i was looking for , plus a few bonus birds. The excitement of being so close to so many wary birds is what gives me the buzzz in bird watching , not shouting to the heavens to bring hoards of other birdwathers to the marsh.

 

[viator]

For me bird watching is a solitary sport , just me the landscape and the birds , the presence of another human is just a distraction...

Well said. Don't understand why someone wants to join a crowd and nothing more pleasing than spending hours/days looking for something in the right habitat and then succeeding in seeing whatever species it might be.

 

[Tarsiger]

Whilst I'm happy that there are people like tideliner (good luck to you in your solitary birding hide!) I'm just glad that he is in a minority. I'm not interested in chasing rarities or standing in crowds but I do appreciate the more sociable aspects of birding and get more pleasure from showing birds to other people in a couple of volunteering roles than just talking to myself when I get home about which birds I've seen on my own and not shared. As for the original 'bunting flock' poser, years ago I would have shared the info; now I'd think twice with so many people with cameras ( I won't dignify them by calling them bird-photographers ). Most recently two birders flushed a GWE which I hadn't seen, wasn't twitching but would happily have had a look at and when queried they replied 'Well you've got to haven't you'!! Unbelievable!!
So, it's each to his own.
Russ
PS Definitely seed the finch/bunting flock!!

 

[birdboybowley]

Whilst I'm happy that there are people like tideliner (good luck to you in your solitary birding hide!) I'm just glad that he is in a minority.

Me too!

 

[Sangahyando]

For me bird watching is a solitary sport , just me the landscape and the birds , the presence of another human is just a distraction.

What's wrong with taking one or two friends with you, provided they're interested in the subject, of course? Surely most people will find that there is a middle ground between going out alone and being part of a twitcher horde.

 

[Andy Hurley]

What's wrong with taking one or two friends with you, provided they're interested in the subject, of course? Surely most people will find that there is a middle ground between going out alone and being part of a twitcher horde.

especially if they are more experienced and willing to share their knowledge.
Bird books only get you so far. six eyes are better than two and if you are quiet you are less likely to disturb your target bird

 

[tittletattler]

Well said. Don't understand why someone wants to join a crowd and nothing more pleasing than spending hours/days looking for something in the right habitat and then succeeding in seeing whatever species it might be.

I like both. Sometimes I prefer to go birding on my own. Do what I want etc. Sometimes I want a laugh and a joke with some fellow birders whilst learning something by studying someone elses bird.

I love it all. I'm not going to ignore any aspect of this hobby at all! But I'm not tideliner and I respect his approach and views.
Cheers, Andy.

 

[dantheman]

Egret , I never go to see a bird that someone else has found and would rather not ... not shouting to the heavens to bring hoards of other birdwathers to the marsh.

Hopefully you aren't looking down on/judging those who do twitch/share the company of others? If everyone were to want to bird in your fashion and move up to Norfolk for the peace and quiet ... ? You'd then have to move to Alaska or somewhere ...

Birding in an over-inhabited planet is never going to be ideal. Although agree, something has to be said for hoping for some improvements in fieldcraft (bring back the apprenticeships ... ? )