What to upgrade from Opticron MM4 60 : Leica, Swaro, Kowa? (1 Viewer)

[jring]

Hi,

my general advice would be to test an example and buy exactly that example, if to your taste - either in a brick and mortar store, online with a no questions asked return policy or used in a face to face transaction. Either take an artificial star (DIY or bought), observe at 20-30m and do a star test or at the very least, check if it is able to deliver a crisp image with an easy to find point of best focus at the maximum magnification - in good seeing, so in the morning on an overcast day, for example.

Sample variation does unfortunately exist, even for alpha scopes.

If you have an SDLv3, a good or better used TSN-3 might be a cheap addition. It is light (around 1,4kg with the SDLv3), the SDLv3 fits with an o-ring as spacer and a good example will work nicely up to th 54x max magnification of this combo. On the flip side, the body is not waterproof...

Joachim, who has a cherry TSN-3 with an SDLv2 and this combo does not need to hide in a row of current alphas.

 

[lmans66]

Have you considered keeping the Opticron MM4, and adding a new scope in the 80-88mm range? This would expand your tools and opportunities.

We have an Opticron MM4 60mm with the SDLv3, and also a Kowa TSN-883. Each provides different features that we find beneficial under different circumstances.

The Opticron is about 1/3 the cost of the Swarovski, Kowa, and Leica. Yes the Alpha scopes outperform it at the higher end of magnification. The Opticron gets darker above 40x (as expected) compared to an Alpha scope with better coatings. This can make it seem as if the Opticron is not as crisp.

The Opticron has an advantage over those scopes in terms of lighter weight, smaller overall size, and a lower magnification power available on the zoom. There are times 20x and 25X is still too much magnification.

If you are able to, consider keeping the Opticron MM4 60mm and adding an 80-88mm scope.

I think this is a viable option. The Opticron MM4 is just a unique scope and to keep it, if you can....would add versatility to your line-up. How much could you realistically get for the Opticron too? Not much $ I am sure so little going to the actual purchase of a larger scope. Just a thought that I agree with by CMB..

 

[LucaPCP]

Have you considered keeping the Opticron MM4, and adding a new scope in the 80-88mm range? This would expand your tools and opportunities.

We have an Opticron MM4 60mm with the SDLv3, and also a Kowa TSN-883. Each provides different features that we find beneficial under different circumstances.

The Opticron is about 1/3 the cost of the Swarovski, Kowa, and Leica. Yes the Alpha scopes outperform it at the higher end of magnification. The Opticron gets darker above 40x (as expected) compared to an Alpha scope with better coatings. This can make it seem as if the Opticron is not as crisp.

The Opticron has an advantage over those scopes in terms of lighter weight, smaller overall size, and a lower magnification power available on the zoom. There are times 20x and 25X is still too much magnification.

If you are able to, consider keeping the Opticron MM4 60mm and adding an 80-88mm scope.

This is a very interesting suggestion. I could, for example, get the Opticron body in 77mm, and then use my good zoom objective from the 60mm on it as well -- this would be a cost effective way to gain more reach when necessary. Thank you; I may go this way.

 

[Grando]

Well, if you have plenty of cash burning a hole in your pocket then the new Kowa 66mm is apparently amazing. I have a cherry version of the old model and that’s excellent, so I’m sure the new one must be something special.

 

[LucaPCP]

Well, if you have plenty of cash burning a hole in your pocket then the new Kowa 66mm is apparently amazing. I have a cherry version of the old model and that’s excellent, so I’m sure the new one must be something special.

My Opticron MM4 60mm is very good till 30x, or a 2mm exit pupil. I am starting to wonder: perhaps the brightness, more than the theoretical sharpness, is what I find missing at 40 or 45x. So perhaps an Opticron 77mm, which can be had (minus the ocular, which I have) for less than $1,000, could in practice be better than the Kowa 66?

Is the optical quality of the Kowa 66 so much better than the Opticron MM4 77 that the Kowa looks better at high magnification?

 

[Boogieshrew]

I think that's a sensible solution.
You get more light but spend way less money.
You don't need alpas to enjoy birding. I have and have had alphas but my favourite scope is the MM4.

 

[Grando]

My Opticron MM4 60mm is very good till 30x, or a 2mm exit pupil. I am starting to wonder: perhaps the brightness, more than the theoretical sharpness, is what I find missing at 40 or 45x. So perhaps an Opticron 77mm, which can be had (minus the ocular, which I have) for less than $1,000, could in practice be better than the Kowa 66?

Is the optical quality of the Kowa 66 so much better than the Opticron MM4 77 that the Kowa looks better at high magnification?

I don't really know, but here is a link to Mike Alibone's review of the 66 for Birdwatch magazine (Mike's an excellent optics reviewer):

Kowa TSN-66 Prominar telescope - BirdGuides

Kowa has transformed a significant slot in its popular TSN Prominar range in line with current demand for low weight and portability. Mike Alibone investigates.

www.birdguides.com

I guess the only real way to answer your question would be to try and compare both side by side, which might be easier said than done, depending on your location.