The-Wanderer
Well-known member
The Range Rover I owned was the most dangerous vehicle I ever had. I don't think any alpha could be as dangerous, unless looked through directly at the sun.
-
Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.
Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
New binoculars from leica (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter PIER PAOLO
- Start date
jan van daalen
Well-known member
The Ford Cortina automatic on Dunlop SP tyres almost killed me.
Those tyres were not meant for that car in the rain.
Mini Cooper S on Dunlop SP3s yes, Ford Cortina automatic no.
And a clapped out 1950s Rolls Royce at 90mph on a bend. (No speed limits then, I used to cruise on the A1 at 120mph).
The previous owner left the suspension on the town setting. I did not know you had to flick the lever for high speed.
I had it on two wheels all the way through the bend.
Getting into town I saw my boss walking along. I was doing 40mph and hit the brakes.
Nothing happened for 3 seconds, then the clapped out mechanical servo drum brakes locked on.
An MGB behind me just stopped in time.
I told my boss the car was a death trap, and a few days later he got rid of it and bought a new Silver Cloud.
An old Land Rover saved my life.
Those tyres were not meant for that car in the rain.
Mini Cooper S on Dunlop SP3s yes, Ford Cortina automatic no.
And a clapped out 1950s Rolls Royce at 90mph on a bend. (No speed limits then, I used to cruise on the A1 at 120mph).
The previous owner left the suspension on the town setting. I did not know you had to flick the lever for high speed.
I had it on two wheels all the way through the bend.
Getting into town I saw my boss walking along. I was doing 40mph and hit the brakes.
Nothing happened for 3 seconds, then the clapped out mechanical servo drum brakes locked on.
An MGB behind me just stopped in time.
I told my boss the car was a death trap, and a few days later he got rid of it and bought a new Silver Cloud.
An old Land Rover saved my life.
Last edited:
Yes and I got a non-committal reply along the lines of 'this has got to be the next step but nothing is imminent'.
Lee
Torview
Well-known member
Are we seriously going to read more posts about what a bunch of idiotic gear snobs all these useless "non" birder Alpha posers are ?
I mean spending upwards of £2000 on a binocular, strutting around the countryside hoping to bump into someone less wealthy who`ll be envious of your purchase, surely there`s easier ways to make yourself feel good.
I mean spending upwards of £2000 on a binocular, strutting around the countryside hoping to bump into someone less wealthy who`ll be envious of your purchase, surely there`s easier ways to make yourself feel good.
Nvid 3D and DoF
Hi folks
I was off-line at Bird Fair so couldn't post my impressions of Nvid or pick up on other questions.
Like TypoDavid I found the miserable weather on Friday and Saturday a hindrance and although the sun came out occasionally on Sunday I was only there for 3 hours and every time I visited the Leica stand it was impossibly crowded.
I am reluctant to make specific observations for two reasons, firstly the viewing conditions and secondly the fact that although close to production standard the units available were not considered to be full production units.
As David mentioned, on one unit when looking through the objectives for signs of black magic inside the barrels I happened to noticed the wooden floor had a distinct reddish tone through one barrel and blueish through the other. When using the bin normally I couldn't see any tint or difference in tone between the two tubes. I also looked for this effect in other units and failed to find it.
One thing I am convinced about though is that there is a 3D effect and an apparent enhanced depth of field. Getting a bit excited about this I walked a few metres to a nearby Habicht 7x42 and got a reality check. OK, now that really was 3D and DoF. But still, Nvid certainly has that quality about the view and coupled with the usual Leica colour and contrast it was a genuinely pleasurable experience. I would hesitate to call it a game-changer but for sure welcome it as a distinctlve flavour of its own.
A few people I spoke to said that it was boring but to me it looks elegant, is far more compact than an SF and feels nice in the hand if a bit on the heavy side. If you grab the barrels though, your first finger lands on the hinge not the focus wheel but there are many bins with similar layouts that are similar and still popular.
Leica appears to be somewhat apologetic about the close focus but 1.9m is good enough and the field of view at 135m (if correct) is competitive if not groundbreaking.
And Zeiss, if you are listening, the eyecups have great adjustability!
Verdict: a great view, the detailed characteristics of which still remain to be explored, an elegant appearance and a little on the heavy side.
Lee
Hi folks
I was off-line at Bird Fair so couldn't post my impressions of Nvid or pick up on other questions.
Like TypoDavid I found the miserable weather on Friday and Saturday a hindrance and although the sun came out occasionally on Sunday I was only there for 3 hours and every time I visited the Leica stand it was impossibly crowded.
I am reluctant to make specific observations for two reasons, firstly the viewing conditions and secondly the fact that although close to production standard the units available were not considered to be full production units.
As David mentioned, on one unit when looking through the objectives for signs of black magic inside the barrels I happened to noticed the wooden floor had a distinct reddish tone through one barrel and blueish through the other. When using the bin normally I couldn't see any tint or difference in tone between the two tubes. I also looked for this effect in other units and failed to find it.
One thing I am convinced about though is that there is a 3D effect and an apparent enhanced depth of field. Getting a bit excited about this I walked a few metres to a nearby Habicht 7x42 and got a reality check. OK, now that really was 3D and DoF. But still, Nvid certainly has that quality about the view and coupled with the usual Leica colour and contrast it was a genuinely pleasurable experience. I would hesitate to call it a game-changer but for sure welcome it as a distinctlve flavour of its own.
A few people I spoke to said that it was boring but to me it looks elegant, is far more compact than an SF and feels nice in the hand if a bit on the heavy side. If you grab the barrels though, your first finger lands on the hinge not the focus wheel but there are many bins with similar layouts that are similar and still popular.
Leica appears to be somewhat apologetic about the close focus but 1.9m is good enough and the field of view at 135m (if correct) is competitive if not groundbreaking.
And Zeiss, if you are listening, the eyecups have great adjustability!
Verdict: a great view, the detailed characteristics of which still remain to be explored, an elegant appearance and a little on the heavy side.
Lee
james holdsworth
Consulting Biologist
Here, here!
My circle of friends do much as I do - lead tours, consult, travel the globe birding and naturalizing, spend thousands of hours a year in the field and almost every one has an alpha - so the quality of the instrument does matter to us, regardless of cache.
And, Binastro, the newer 911's are nothing like the old widow-makers. Porsche have, over time, completely tamed the oversteering tendencies of the 911. I was able to track-drive the newest 991.2 [new turbo] recently and it can be pushed ridiculously fast without the tiniest bit of drama.
https://www.fws.gov/southeast/economicimpact/pdf/2011-birdingreport--final.pdf
Readers should look closely at page 13, Table 8, for a true breakdown of those expenditures.
Last edited:
Tom Peters made the phrase popular.
The key is to just not worry about it either way. I think the vast majority here have the brains to know that a pleasant birding experience may be achieved while using a broad array of optic brands and devices within about any budget.
I'm ALWAYS interested in what someone else is using and will many times swap binoculars. I sure don't care how much they cost or the brand.
A2GG
Beth
I think my response to John may have gotten all twisted up by some here.
I don't care what other people buy. I recognize that there are plenty of nice binos at
different price points and I have owned bins from 90 bucks and up.
I didn't purchase a Leica for status, but for my own preferences; admire the design
and quality of view and there aren't too many 7x out there. Buy what you want and be happy.
Well said GiGi. There is surely room in the world and on Bird Forum for every possible reason and motive for buying and owning optical instruments that give pleasure, that educate and enthuse, and yes, even bolster the odd ego along the way.
Some folks drive around in old bangers so they can spend their dosh on fabulous foreign holidays, others don't go abroad so they can drive around in fabulous cars. Substitute bins and scopes for the cars or the holidays and you probably describe some of us on here.
GiGi said it: buy what you want and be happy.
Lee
.... and then start looking for your next mega expensive bin. This time it'll be the one or just buy one anyway 8-P
I wonder how it compares with my Carson 8x22 Scout? Has anyone compared these two?
From the specs my Scout is lighter and has a better close focus 8-P
Not that it matters of course but it's a few grand cheaper also
and yes I'm happy with it :t:
.... and then start looking for your next mega expensive bin. This time it'll be the one or just buy one anyway 8-P
I wonder how it compares with my Carson 8x22 Scout? Has anyone compared these two?
From the specs my Scout is lighter and has a better close focus 8-P
Not that it matters of course but it's a few grand cheaper also
and yes I'm happy with it :t:
Here you are again!
Next thing you will be claiming that all three of the Corrs sisters are gorgeous and are just a bit lighter and look even better in close focus :t:
Hmm, I agree:king:
Lee
It's kind of a serious question though, not meant to rattle any delicate cages should there be any.
The other evening I compared my 8x25 Vistron with my 8x43 Hawke Sapphire which is a pretty decent bin. I wanted to see if I should use my 8x43 instead of my Vistron for casual viewing from here as this is mostly when I use a bin and wondered would it be so much better as to forget about the Vistron but basically although the 8x43 was of course better, the Vistron is perhaps the better tool as it is enough for what I can see from here and between the Vistron and the Carson I choose the Carson as my lite carry outdoor bin and it really is effective and wonderful to be so unencumbered.
It really would be interesting to see what actual factual performance enhancement you do achieve with something such as this new Leica over something like the Carson. In normal light it isn't really that much from what I can estimate with my bins.
I hope of course the new Leica is somehow revolutionary and the new owners can genuinely feel swollen chested that they have the best of the best and enjoy the corresponding views.
Still, I wonder what the next gen Carson Scout will be like? I'll start saving. 8-P
The other evening I compared my 8x25 Vistron with my 8x43 Hawke Sapphire which is a pretty decent bin. I wanted to see if I should use my 8x43 instead of my Vistron for casual viewing from here as this is mostly when I use a bin and wondered would it be so much better as to forget about the Vistron but basically although the 8x43 was of course better, the Vistron is perhaps the better tool as it is enough for what I can see from here and between the Vistron and the Carson I choose the Carson as my lite carry outdoor bin and it really is effective and wonderful to be so unencumbered.
It really would be interesting to see what actual factual performance enhancement you do achieve with something such as this new Leica over something like the Carson. In normal light it isn't really that much from what I can estimate with my bins.
I hope of course the new Leica is somehow revolutionary and the new owners can genuinely feel swollen chested that they have the best of the best and enjoy the corresponding views.
Still, I wonder what the next gen Carson Scout will be like? I'll start saving. 8-P
Last edited:
A2GG
Beth
You should get your hands on a Swaro 8x25 CL which is considered excellent and see how it stacks up against your Carson. If the Carson
is 8x25 as well then it will be a good comparison you can post here
in the forum.
I used to have a 7x21 Olympus classic reverse porro and loved it. But, once I got glasses I couldn't use it anymore, but it was a very nice little one.
elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Jeff Bouton
Well-known member
I'm the guy.
Hey all,
Jeff Bouton here, the guy with the quote in question! Yes I work for Leica so understand the skepticism, BUT for those who know me they know I'm a straight shooter.
I've always believed that no matter how hard we want to try and analyze numbers on paper the reality is that specs on paper or online just can't tell the story. There is no consistency in measured specs for technique for measuring and portraying things like Eye Relief or Close Focus as example so one manufacturers' measurement may well not (and often is not) repeatable when tested by another manufacturer using their testing methodology. Also, specs based solely on mathematics that consider objective lens and power like exit pupil, RBI, etc. are worthless for an end user because they assume every piece of glass has the same coatings & transmission... and we all know that doesn't work. So as it always has been, no matter how hard we may want to make sweeping judgements from home looking at printed specs, the reality is we can only make intelligent, accurate statements about the performance of a product by actually looking through it. There have been many instances where bins that looked fantastic on paper have been major disappointments in the field and vice versa.
Prior to my years with Leica, I spent 20+ years working in the field as a passionate (and starving) field research biologist & then as a professional bird guide spending the VAST majority of those years in the field staring through binoculars all day, every day. So it is from that perspective that I offer my WOW factor comment. Those who know me well, know I have been a die hard 7x42 user for the past 28 years. So it is no small matter that I say I've happily decided to set down my beloved 7x after using the new Noctivids for even the first full day. Now, however I've used these for 3 straight days staring at the birds across Lagoon 2 and in an afternoon of birding in Germany and am still convinced these are the best binocular I've ever looked through. Not looking for argument or a fight only saying do yourself a favor and look through them yourself.
If you're the person wanting me to go into great length on the how's and why's and talk about shapes of lenses or specific nanometers of light transmission you're definitely going to be disappointed in my post. But then again this is "BIRDforum" and not "Engineeringforum" right?!?... While on the stand I spent my time scanning across Lagoon 2, I appreciated the chromatic barring on the flanks and the black line separatring the red mandibles of a Water Rail tucked in dark cattails in stunning contrast, and I immensely enjoyed the juvenile Dunlin appreciating the amazing difference in bill shape/size between the UK & US birds. I watched in awe as a young Hobby jetted down from a starkly backlit sky, then raced over the dark reed bed quickly sweeping back up, stalling to eat the dragonfly it had just snatched (watching the wings tumble down reflecting light as they twirled to fall in the water)!
It took me half the first day to really realize what it was seeing and articulate it honestly, I just knew I enjoyed each time I lifted this bins to my eyes. These bins transmit as much light as any binocular in the market for starters so they are as bright as the next best out there.The close focus is real and I find that I easily focused to about half the distance of the comparable Ultravid model.
Despite the concerns of an increase of 2 ounces over the Ultravids these are perfectly balanced and most felt they were actually lighter when holding them up. I suffered no fatigue with these in a standard neck strap for 10+ hours over 3 straight days. The "WOW" factor I'd felt was due to all of these factors and one other that again I found hard to describe or articulate beyond "WOW". Now however, I think I can. In the product brochure, we mention the 3-dimensional "plasticity" of image but this alone does not begin to describe the reality of this situation. It does not begin to convey the unmatched depth of vision these bins provide. 3D barely begins to explain this amazing effect. All leading to a view that you quite frankly want more of. As I said before, don't take my word for it as I said before the ONLY way you can appreciate what these beauties will do is to see them for yourself. Next showing American Birding Expo, Columbus, OH, Sept 15-18 for the American market introduction! (just saying)
Hey all,
Jeff Bouton here, the guy with the quote in question! Yes I work for Leica so understand the skepticism, BUT for those who know me they know I'm a straight shooter.
I've always believed that no matter how hard we want to try and analyze numbers on paper the reality is that specs on paper or online just can't tell the story. There is no consistency in measured specs for technique for measuring and portraying things like Eye Relief or Close Focus as example so one manufacturers' measurement may well not (and often is not) repeatable when tested by another manufacturer using their testing methodology. Also, specs based solely on mathematics that consider objective lens and power like exit pupil, RBI, etc. are worthless for an end user because they assume every piece of glass has the same coatings & transmission... and we all know that doesn't work. So as it always has been, no matter how hard we may want to make sweeping judgements from home looking at printed specs, the reality is we can only make intelligent, accurate statements about the performance of a product by actually looking through it. There have been many instances where bins that looked fantastic on paper have been major disappointments in the field and vice versa.
Prior to my years with Leica, I spent 20+ years working in the field as a passionate (and starving) field research biologist & then as a professional bird guide spending the VAST majority of those years in the field staring through binoculars all day, every day. So it is from that perspective that I offer my WOW factor comment. Those who know me well, know I have been a die hard 7x42 user for the past 28 years. So it is no small matter that I say I've happily decided to set down my beloved 7x after using the new Noctivids for even the first full day. Now, however I've used these for 3 straight days staring at the birds across Lagoon 2 and in an afternoon of birding in Germany and am still convinced these are the best binocular I've ever looked through. Not looking for argument or a fight only saying do yourself a favor and look through them yourself.
If you're the person wanting me to go into great length on the how's and why's and talk about shapes of lenses or specific nanometers of light transmission you're definitely going to be disappointed in my post. But then again this is "BIRDforum" and not "Engineeringforum" right?!?... While on the stand I spent my time scanning across Lagoon 2, I appreciated the chromatic barring on the flanks and the black line separatring the red mandibles of a Water Rail tucked in dark cattails in stunning contrast, and I immensely enjoyed the juvenile Dunlin appreciating the amazing difference in bill shape/size between the UK & US birds. I watched in awe as a young Hobby jetted down from a starkly backlit sky, then raced over the dark reed bed quickly sweeping back up, stalling to eat the dragonfly it had just snatched (watching the wings tumble down reflecting light as they twirled to fall in the water)!
It took me half the first day to really realize what it was seeing and articulate it honestly, I just knew I enjoyed each time I lifted this bins to my eyes. These bins transmit as much light as any binocular in the market for starters so they are as bright as the next best out there.The close focus is real and I find that I easily focused to about half the distance of the comparable Ultravid model.
Despite the concerns of an increase of 2 ounces over the Ultravids these are perfectly balanced and most felt they were actually lighter when holding them up. I suffered no fatigue with these in a standard neck strap for 10+ hours over 3 straight days. The "WOW" factor I'd felt was due to all of these factors and one other that again I found hard to describe or articulate beyond "WOW". Now however, I think I can. In the product brochure, we mention the 3-dimensional "plasticity" of image but this alone does not begin to describe the reality of this situation. It does not begin to convey the unmatched depth of vision these bins provide. 3D barely begins to explain this amazing effect. All leading to a view that you quite frankly want more of. As I said before, don't take my word for it as I said before the ONLY way you can appreciate what these beauties will do is to see them for yourself. Next showing American Birding Expo, Columbus, OH, Sept 15-18 for the American market introduction! (just saying)
elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Ed,
I'm pretty sure :h?: you're misunderstanding me, as (I think! :brains:
I agree that the other frequencies are very important for determining "brightness", and that's what the Photopic and Scotopic Luminance Functions incorporate according to the long established CIE Standards (with only very minor recent tinkering). I think folks need to understand that all the visible frequencies are at play (as your attachment shows numerically :t: ) and that the real story goes deeper than even those functions (ie. those two curves with peak wavelengths @555nm, and 507nm, do not tell the whole story since even those functions are an amalgam of the 3 different cone types. Mesopic realms add a whole nuther area of complication and nuance).
...
Chosun :gh:
As the man said: “I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.”
:king:
Ed
Similar threads
