Sigma 600mm f/8 Mirror Telephoto Lens (1 Viewer)

Widowmaker · Oct 19, 2003

Has anyone had any experience with this lens or know of anyone that uses it? I am assuming it is based on the same principle as a cassegrain telescope in which case I would expect very sharp image results. I have been searching the web for image examples but have not been successfull.

I am debating on this lens, which goes for around $300 and then possible a good macro lens in the $300 range or one Sigma 50-500 lens that cost around $700.

Any help appreciated.

mcdowella · Oct 19, 2003

Can't speak for this lens in particular. In general Mirror lenses are compact and provide sharp images BUT
1/As you have seen, maximum aperture is not usually large: f8 is fairly common. Minimum aperture may not be too far away from this: to allow some degree of exposure control, some make it easy to insert neutral density filters instead of stopping down. You REQUIRE an exposure of 1/600 second or less if handheld, and even with a tripod you probably want a fairly short shutter speed, which won't mix too well with a maximum aperture of f8.
2/Out of focus light sources appear as characteristic doughnut-shaped highlights, which can be distracting. Sometimes you will see this used as a special effect.

(Hence when you see sports photographers etc. they don't use mirror lenses, but monster telephotos that cost about 10 times as much).

Widowmaker · Oct 19, 2003

mcdowella said:
Can't speak for this lens in particular. In general Mirror lenses are compact and provide sharp images BUT
1/As you have seen, maximum aperture is not usually large: f8 is fairly common. Minimum aperture may not be too far away from this: to allow some degree of exposure control, some make it easy to insert neutral density filters instead of stopping down. You REQUIRE an exposure of 1/600 second or less if handheld, and even with a tripod you probably want a fairly short shutter speed, which won't mix too well with a maximum aperture of f8.
2/Out of focus light sources appear as characteristic doughnut-shaped highlights, which can be distracting. Sometimes you will see this used as a special effect.

(Hence when you see sports photographers etc. they don't use mirror lenses, but monster telephotos that cost about 10 times as much).

Thanks for the reply. Im not too concerned with the f8 or the light source effect. I used an ETX-90, which was 1250mm and I believe
somewhere around 10 aperture or more. I got what I feel were excellent results with the meade etx-90 and that was with the camera looking through an eyepiece. I would think that the mirror lens would give the same, if not better results. Am I wrong in assuming that?

Doug Greenberg · Dec 28, 2003

Widowmaker said:
Has anyone had any experience with this lens or know of anyone that uses it? I am assuming it is based on the same principle as a cassegrain telescope in which case I would expect very sharp image results. I have been searching the web for image examples but have not been successfull.

I am debating on this lens, which goes for around $300 and then possible a good macro lens in the $300 range or one Sigma 50-500 lens that cost around $700.

Any help appreciated.

I have owned a Sigma 600mm. mirror lens for quite a while, and while I was shooting film (slides) I often swore that there was something wrong with the lens, since I got sharp pictures so rarely. When I got my dslr, however, this changed. With the dslr (in my case, a Nikon D100) I have been able to use faster ISO speeds (1000 or even higher) and this makes it possible to shoot the photos at shutter speeds of 1/1250 or faster. For me, the mirror lens has always been very prone to vibration, so using a very fast shutter eliminated the "shake" problem. As a result, I have obtained some exceedingly sharp bird photos using this old Sigma mirror lens. Some expert photographers have expressed amazement that such cheap equipment could produce such good results. However, one thing to keep in mind is that while the lens is set to focus at "macro" range, very close, the results from less than about 25 or 30 feet are inevitably disappointing. The best results are when I photograph something VERY far away. At close range, clearly the optics are not optimal.

This actually is not the only lens I use, but I have found myself using this mirror lens quite a lot, as it is powerful and quite portable.

If you still are interested (this is several months after your initial post) I would be happy to email you some reduced-in-size bird images shot with this lens.

canadianbacon · Feb 5, 2004

Doug,

I am considering geting a mirror lens as well. i have reaseached all the pros and cons of them but have never actually seen any photos taken by them. It would be greatly aprreciated if you could email me one at [email protected]

evan

cspratt · Apr 2, 2004

A couple of months has passed since this thread was started but I would like to see some of your shots.

Thanks.

ejdeltoro · Apr 2, 2004

Check out these shots using the mirror lens:

http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/600mmf80

There's also a pic in today's gallery (it's a small yellow bird. Can't remember name).

I'm also considering this lens. I just bought the Sigma D-SLR (SD9) and with the 1.7X magnification factor of the camera the 600mm will be just great (1020mm for under $400!).

dainisjg · Apr 7, 2004

This is a photo of a Pacific Baza or Crested Hawk taken by David Nelson with a Tamron 500/8.

http://davidavid.whatsbeef.net/baza.jpg

The out of focus highlights (or bokeh as it is called) are typical of the mirror lens. Sometimes it is more pronounced than other times but when it is more pronounced, as in this example, it is rather distracting.
Even with a less busy, darker background, the characteristic "doughtnuts" still appear:

http://davidavid.whatsbeef.net/baza2.jpg

cspratt · May 22, 2004

Great shot. The background (brokeh) doesn't bother me. Just got my Sigma 600 F/8 and can hardly wait for it to stop raining!

debiek · Aug 2, 2004

How to switch to a digital body? and witch one?

ejdeltoro said:
Check out these shots using the mirror lens:

http://www.pbase.com/cameras/sigma/600mmf80

There's also a pic in today's gallery (it's a small yellow bird. Can't remember name).

I'm also considering this lens. I just bought the Sigma D-SLR (SD9) and with the 1.7X magnification factor of the camera the 600mm will be just great (1020mm for under $400!).

Hello everybody,

A few minutes a go I signed up as a new member. As you all I'm a birdlover. Since 1997 I've been using the sigma 600mm mirror and I'm very content about the result. As body I use the minolta dynax 3xi. Since last year I'm making the switch to the digital world and the question for me is on what digital body I can fit my current lens? Is there anybody among you specialists who can help me? Specially since Minolta can't provide me with a digital body.

Kris.

By the way a "wonderfull" birdsite is the least I can say and I look forward to communicate with you all on the forum.

IanF · Aug 2, 2004

Doug, why not post a few photos in this thread?

I'd certainly be intersted in comparing the results as it's somethng I am still considering too. I used to have a 500mm fixed f8 mirror lens myself from my 35 mm days. Results were a bit mixed.

Looks like a few other members are interested in this too.

IanF · Aug 2, 2004

Great site ejdeltoro and shots dainisjg :t:

RAH · Aug 2, 2004

Less expensive option

You can get a less expensive 500mm alternative at Adorama for about $100:

http://www.adorama.com/SY5008XX.html

These inexpensive mirror lenses are usually pretty high-quality optically, and since there are no moving parts in a mirror lens, they are a pretty good deal.

cspratt · Aug 3, 2004

This is taken with a Canon 10D and a Sigma F/8 600 mirror lens handheld. I prefer my Canon 100-400 IS lens but in a pinch the Sigma will do.

Doug Greenberg · Aug 4, 2004

IanF said:
Doug, why not post a few photos in this thread?

I'd certainly be intersted in comparing the results as it's somethng I am still considering too. I used to have a 500mm fixed f8 mirror lens myself from my 35 mm days. Results were a bit mixed.

Looks like a few other members are interested in this too.

I've attached a Sigma mirror lens bird photo here; there are others in my gallery here in the Birdforums. The main thing to keep in mind is that given the high magnification and the slow aperture of a mirror lens, it's advisable to use a high ISO (1000 or 1250) and to shoot in good light. If you can brace the camera/lens somehow on a tripod or even a fence post, this is helpful, as well. But handheld photos are possible, as this example shows.

photo-cool · Oct 5, 2004

about minolta's new slr

debiek said:
Hello everybody,

A few minutes a go I signed up as a new member. As you all I'm a birdlover. Since 1997 I've been using the sigma 600mm mirror and I'm very content about the result. As body I use the minolta dynax 3xi. Since last year I'm making the switch to the digital world and the question for me is on what digital body I can fit my current lens? Is there anybody among you specialists who can help me? Specially since Minolta can't provide me with a digital body.

Kris.

By the way a "wonderfull" birdsite is the least I can say and I look forward to communicate with you all on the forum.

Lucky for us all, Minolta is coming out with the maxxum 7 D! digital with antishake built in to the camera. You can use all your old lenses on it with increased telephoto of about 150% I think.

gufaro · Jun 14, 2005

how to use the 600 mm on a Nikon D-100

Hi, can you tell me how to use the 600mm lens on my Nikon D-100
how to get control of the exposure
if the camera read the light
Thanks
Gustavo

citrinella · Jun 14, 2005

gufaro said:
Hi, can you tell me how to use the 600mm lens on my Nikon D-100
how to get control of the exposure
if the camera read the light
Thanks
Gustavo

I'm using a Tamron on a Canon 300D, but I think the same principles will hold. I use AV mode (aperture priority). This is good if the subject fills a good proportion of the frame or light intensity is relatively even because there is no spot metering in this mode. In case it isn't, I always have automatic exposure bracketing (AEB) set.

Biggest problem is shake. I use high ISO and shutter speeds, but have to use a brace of some sort to get really sharp shots. I suspect that shutter vibration may be part of the problem. The lens is really light, so this will not be damped to the same extent as with a conventional lens. Using AEB probably doesn't help - extra shots = extra vibration.

Mike.

Doug Greenberg · Jun 23, 2005

gufaro said:
Hi, can you tell me how to use the 600mm lens on my Nikon D-100
how to get control of the exposure
if the camera read the light
Thanks
Gustavo

I have used this same combination, so I can comment here. You do NOT get any kind of TTL metering with the D100 and a non-CPU lens like the Sigma 600mm. mirror lens. This might seem like bad news, but it's really not so bad. You can, if you wish, use an "old-fashioned" hand-held light meter, but the truth is, you can quickly learn to make a best-guess estimate of your lighting, or else do a quick test shot. In either case, keep in mind that with a DSLR you can immediately check your test exposure or, better still, look at the associated histogram. You then make whatever adjustment you need to make, and away you go. It's a slight inconvenience and there is a short learning curve involved, but really, getting the exposure you want becomes pretty straightforward in a very short amount of time.

The only Nikon DSLR's that would allow TTL metering in this situation are the professional-level ones, including the D1 and D2 series, including the new D2X.

adrianf · Jun 28, 2005

I had a Sigma 600mm and I can only say that the results were inconsistent. Most of the time the images were soft, even on a good tripod, but occasionally a pic came out really sharp. It's a bit confusing really but I've read elsewhere on the web of other people having the same experience of this lens. I moved onto the Sigma 50-500 zoom - now the problem is the photographer, not the lens!

Sigma 600mm f/8 Mirror Telephoto Lens (1 Viewer)

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