2011 UK Orchid season updates (2 Viewers)

[luke]

Hi all, found that 2 of the "atros" are just out today. So fingers crossed for the fulvofuscato also to return this year.

Really must apologies, I saw the first 'atrofuscus' out on sunday, have been monitoring a couple of bee orchid which weren't in flower for the last week or so and it finally poped open this weekend. Literally sat down just now to write something about it. We've so far had quite a poor year for bee's but a few now seem to be springing up which is really nice to see. As with last year, anyone who's interested in seeing them can be pointed in the right direction by poping into the visitor centre. We will be more than happy to help.

 

[Jungle Cat]

Any news on them as I may well be passing in the near future

Thanks

Mark

Hi Mark

Hope you are well.

Had about a dozen Musk Orchids at the site near Selborne last Wednesday. Also Fragrant and Pyramidals.

Good luck if you go.

Clare

 

[IJS]

Seen a large number of fragrant orchids and more importantly, some white pyramidal orchids in flower this afternoon in Buckinghamshire.

 

[Robert S J Smith]

Morning all,

I was wondering if anybody could help me with the identification of these Orchids I photographed on the North Norfolk coast yesterday…

Common Spotted?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5839876167/in/photostream

Dactylorhiza species (Maybe Early Marsh subsp. Coccinea?)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5840503688/in/photostream

Dactylorhiza hybrid? (Common Spot x ?????)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5841351599/in/photostream
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5841350483/in/photostream/

Dactylorhiza hybrid? (Common Spot x ?????)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5841352961/in/photostream

Dactylorhiza species (Southern Marsh?)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5841357531/in/photostream

Many thanks,

Rob.

 

[dampflippers]

The coralroot orchid frm Springwatch

 

[luke]

another two 'brown' bee orchids at Radipole today. One of them lacks the silvery bit on the brown (excuse the lack of technical names!), so possibly one of these fulvo something or others. Will stick a pic on later.

 

[MarkHows]

Hi Mark

Hope you are well.

Had about a dozen Musk Orchids at the site near Selborne last Wednesday. Also Fragrant and Pyramidals.

Good luck if you go.

Clare

Thanks Clare and the others on the Musk Orchids, I will be going at the weekend, just have to avoid the rain.

Thanks

Mark

 

[Lorne]

fuscus

Here is the next one that has now appeared, but is it good enough? possibly not quite 100% First pic from last year, 2nd today & the one from last weekend which is called atro.

 

[luke]

here's a shot of each of the Radipole bee's. the first is an atrofuscus, the second is the one lornes shown which was taken today, and a third plant that seems somewhere in between. Confusing little things, I think I'll stick with birds! lol

 

[leptochila]

here's a shot of each of the Radipole bee's. the first is an atrofuscus, the second is the one lornes shown which was taken today, and a third plant that seems somewhere in between. Confusing little things, I think I'll stick with birds! lol

The 2nd and 3rd just look like bicolor without the pale half of the lip.
But let's be honest, varieties are based on very subjective credentials of plants at the end of a spectrum between which there is a perfect degradation of plants on a continuum to classic plants, (especially in the case of chlorantha, atrofuscus and trollii). I'm sticking to subspecies!

Mike.

 

[James Hunter]

The 2nd and 3rd just look like bicolor without the pale half of the lip.
But let's be honest, varieties are based on very subjective credentials of plants at the end of a spectrum between which there is a perfect degradation of plants on a continuum to classic plants, (especially in the case of chlorantha, atrofuscus and trollii). I'm sticking to subspecies!

Mike.

Hi all- with orchids variation is often on a sliding scale - Mike's points are valid - just scroll back to discussion on Pyramidal var emarignata - we put plants in these convenient pockets not the plants themselves!!:t:

 

[rmielcarek]

Here is the next one that has now appeared, but is it good enough? possibly not quite 100% First pic from last year, 2nd today & the one from last weekend which is called atro.

Lorne/Luke

is todays possible fulvofusca in the same place as last years fulvofusca or is this a new plant?

I'm trying to understand whether last years fulvofusca has changed appearance this year (wouldn't be unknown) or whether similar plants are emerging but in different places this year (wouldn't be unknown either).

I agree with Mike's comments about how these things are clinal and would add that you can find odd looking plants that don't fit into any named variant. These Bees vars are funny little critters; why do some plants have different lip patterns on each flower?

Rich M

 

[IJS]

Morning all,

I was wondering if anybody could help me with the identification of these Orchids I photographed on the North Norfolk coast yesterday…

Common Spotted?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5839876167/in/photostream

Dactylorhiza species (Maybe Early Marsh subsp. Coccinea?)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5840503688/in/photostream

Dactylorhiza hybrid? (Common Spot x ?????)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5841351599/in/photostream
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5841350483/in/photostream/

Dactylorhiza hybrid? (Common Spot x ?????)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5841352961/in/photostream

Dactylorhiza species (Southern Marsh?)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertsjsmith/5841357531/in/photostream

Many thanks,

Rob.

hi Rob
1. Common spotted
2. Early marsh ssp. Coccinea
3./4. not sure!
5. common spotted
6. southern marsh

Thats what I reckon anyway!
Cheers
Ian

 

[luke]

Lorne/Luke

is todays possible fulvofusca in the same place as last years fulvofusca or is this a new plant?

I'm trying to understand whether last years fulvofusca has changed appearance this year (wouldn't be unknown) or whether similar plants are emerging but in different places this year (wouldn't be unknown either).

I agree with Mike's comments about how these things are clinal and would add that you can find odd looking plants that don't fit into any named variant. These Bees vars are funny little critters; why do some plants have different lip patterns on each flower?

Rich M

I think the yesturdays pos. fulvofusca is a new plant, its a few feet away from where i thought it came up last year. we did GPS is but its so close to last plant it was useless.

 

[Ghostly Vision]

With regard to the Radipole Bees, may I just offer a note of clarification on the names....

Fulvofusca is the correct name for the var with the dark unmarked lip. This was confirmed by Les Lewis last year after the plants became public knowledge. As such, the name atrofusca is invalid - it isn't the name for the halfway house ones.

Yes, they are clinal, but fulvofusca requires the lip to lack any silver colouration.


As such, in Luke's three photos, the first and third are techincally classified as nominate apifera (yes I know!!!!!) but the middle one looks to be a fulvofusca.

Regards

Sean

 

[MTR]

Fen Orchid

....also Fen Orchid - apparently the main area at one of the Norfolk sites is very dry this year so I wouldn't hold out much hope of flowering there this year.

cheers

James

I was at one of the Fen Orchid sites in Norfolk last Sunday 12-06-2011 and yes it was extremely dry underfoot all the small pools had completely dried up and you certainly didn’t need wellingtons to walk around.
We only managed to find 3 plants, one large plant and two very small ones in the area that we were told about. We did try other areas at this site but we drew a blank.

Once I have worked out how to upload photos to this site I will post a few Orchid photos from this year.

 

[Lorne]

fusca

My original considerations about SSP & vars was proven when I visited Cyprus in 2005. Most of the bee orchids I found there were chlorantha & bicolour with only one standard flower found on the last day. Exactly the same flowers but 12000 miles away.
The reason I post “atro” with inverted commas is because since last summer and the so called atrofuscas we found then, we have realised that there are no records of this one except from David Lang and noted by Anne & Simon Harrap.
Fulvofusca however has been recorded in Europe over sites in different countries so is actually a well established var. It had just not been recorded in the UK before.

 

[JCL]

Anyone know whether the St Catherine's Hill, Hampshire, frog and musk orchids are out?

 

[lizard orchid]

Hi we bought 40 acres of woodland in west sussex three years ago and have been working very hard to open up rides and make glades. we get quite a lot of common orchids but what was very exciting where we have an area of hard standing for tractors to turn on which is covered with wild mint, grasses and other wild flowers, very mossy in the winter- we have just spotted 9 bee orchids on it which is fantastic! but how do we support them and do we need to do anything to the area? Any help gratefully received!

It sounds like what you are doing is great especially with opening up the rides.
If you have problems with deer or rabbits it might be worth to cage the bee orchids from rabbits.
Where you have found the bee orchids it might be worth looking for the distinct bluey green rosettes between Oct and April incase of extra plants turning up. I think now you have got a few bee orchids you might get more.
One thing with the area you have found them on is if any scrub does start appearring on this area is to clear it off.
Good luck and I hope you get more orchids appearing in your woods.

Brian Laney.

 

[byronmachin]

Could anybody tell me if this is an Early Marsh Orchid? It is distinctly different to the Common Spotted and Diamond shaped Northern Marsh Orchid that i also discovered on the Derbyshire Site.