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How precise are rangefinder binoculars / monoculars? (2 Viewers)

Canip

Well-known member
How precise are rangefinder binoculars / monoculars?

Measuring distances up to a mile and more within a fraction of a second and with an error margin of 2 yards or less - that‘s what the specs of many common rangefinders promise.
Have you ever wondered whether the performance of these devices delivers results within the specs? I myself have wondered many times, and so last Sunday afternoon, I thought I try to find. Let's look at some results from a comparison of 6 instruments, 3 binoculars and 3 monoculars (see table).

First, I chose 8 well defined targets between around 18m and about 970m, all large enough and well defined and positioned to allow the testing of rangefinder equipment.

On targets at a distance below 100m, I measured the exact distance with a Bosch GM high precision laser, using up to 2 digits after the comma, and confirmed these measurements at least twice.

On targets further away, I used two tools: a 1:10’000 scale electronic map for a initial distance measurement, and then GPS data at the target and home locations to confirm. With this, I found what I call a „best estimate“ (since this is not a really precise way of establishing distance) by taking the median value between the two results. To my surprise, all instruments (with one exception) later displayed a target distance within 0.5 percent or less of that „best estimate“ distance, so my estimate seems to have been useable, and the instruments generally performed quite well at long range.

All measurements occurred on the same day within one hour and under identical lighting (sunshine) and atmospheric conditions (clear view), with one instrument after the other mounted on a fixed tripod before the measurements.

All target distances were well within the maximum range specified by manufacturers for all instruments.

All measurements were repeated at least once (or more, since target acquisition did not always occur reliably)

The results can be seen in the attached table.

The following comments from my side:

  • Overall, longe range measurements seemed to fulfill manufacturer specs better than measurements at shorter distances. The “spread” of measured distances was relatively larger on near targets than on far away targets
  • Only 2 instruments fulfilled the specs 100% of the time: the Zeiss Victory RF and Maven RF.1
  • While the Nikon Monarch worked very well at shorter distances, it had more trouble acquiring long range targets
  • Both Leica Rangemaster and Geovid performed only 75% within the specs (and exceeded specs on shorter, but not on the long range targets)
  • According to its specs, the Swarovski EL-Range does not acquire any target under 30m, but it had also a bit of trouble acquiring the one at 36m. Moreover, it exceeded specs on 1 target
  • Don't expect that your rangefinder will immediately and reliably give you results all the time. Many of the tested instruments failed to acquire targets once or even several times, so I sometimes had to repeat measurements, sometimes more than once
  • But overall, the rangefinders delivered performance within or almost within manufacturer's specs.
Based on the above „Saturday afternoon passe-time“ exercise, the instruments with the best rangefinder results were the Zeiss RF and the Maven RF.1 (the latter is new on the market, costs $ 400 and impressed also with its excellent optics, good build quality and intuitive handling).

But why would someone like me, with no interest whatsoever in hunting or shooting, be interested in using binoculars and monoculars with range-finding capability?
Not only can distance measurements be useful when documenting bird or wildlife sightings; the rangefinders measure not only distance, but also angles (many can do even much more). Remember high-school math? Right-angled triangles etc? With distance and angle established, you can easily calculate altitudes of hills or mountains if you know the altitude of your own position, you can generally calculate altitude differences, the height of buildings, the depth of a depression, etc. No high precision results, of course, but still quite useful in many situations.

fwiw
Canip
 

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Thank you for the tests.

My short range Leica laser does not agree with my long range Leica laser at shorter distances.

Over many years the long range Leica gives the same 124m distance to a chimney pot.
It measures to about 1000 metres, but I haven't checked the accuracy here.

Maps are often not very accurate.
I think that high quality French maps started earlier than British maps.
There are ordnance survey accurate posts in the U.K. but not that many are maintained to the highest standards.

My low price GPS is accurate to about 3 metres.
Surveyors get higher accuracy.

Regards,
B.
 
Related to this is height measurement.

My Minox 10x25 altimeter binoculars, three of them, all read to 2ft height changes.
Unfortunately I have no means of setting them.
The barometer readings are given to 1 hPa or 28ft, giving 14ft accuracy.

During the recent US President's visit the barometer reading was also given in inches.
1/100 inch is about 10ft or 5ft accuracy, which is much better.

My GPS is only accurate to about 10ft, and maps are inconsistent.

The Leica laser shorter version measures inclination to about 0.2 degrees and seems fairly accurate.

Compass binoculars aren't very accurate, nor are compasses generally.

Sea level heights are changing as the ice melts., although sea height changes are measured to about 1mm from memory.
Britain has very large tidal changes, perhaps 30ft or so.

I am pleased that the laser rangefinder measurements given in the table are so accurate.
I wouldn't have thought they would be that good.

The Swiss Vektronic? long distance laser rangefinders would be interesting.
As would long baseline visual rangefinders.

Regards,
B.
 
A bit more information about laser range finders . . .

In general discussion, it’s noted that they work best with a 'highly reflective target', and that various factors can affect the nominal maximum distance.
See a table from the current Swarovski EL Range TA manual (similar tables are also in the corresponding Leica and Zeiss manuals).


John
 

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John puts his finger on an important point.

Objects with different surfaces, sizes, colors etc. represent more or less different targets, and different light and atmospheric conditions further complicate things. This all influences not only maximum range, but also target acquisition well below max.

What I find noteworthy, though, is that the capacity to acquire a defined target varies considerably between instruments, and it‘s not always the most expensive instruments that are the best In target acquisition. In my experience, e.g. the Geovid and the Nikon Monarch more frequently fail to give out a distance number even well below maximum range, when others easily and reliably display the measured distance.

As I wrote in my first post, of the instruments tested, I would have the highest confidence in the Zeiss and the Maven. This does not say that the others are not also good instruments.

Canip
 
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The problem as I see it is the poor accuracy of consumer GPS units, maps, electronic maps etc.

With professional survey GPS equipment with two receivers measuring simultaneously and an experienced professional, accuracies of 1 part in a million are claimed when measured over twenty minutes with the best equipment.

So 1mm in 1000 metres, up to 30km.

However, with four hand held consumer GPS I only get an accuracy of 3 metres for one position.

So accurate measures of say 800 metres are questionable.
One needs a really accurate measurement of say 800 metres to accurately evaluate the laser rangefinders.

Even using transit telescopes and the stars, positions are not accurate.

One degree of latitude is about 70 miles.
One arc minute about 6,000 ft.
One arc second about 100 ft.
Even 0.1 arcsecond is only 10 ft accuracy.

The Vektronic? units use longer wavelength lasers which may be more accurate.

Invar tape measures are not accurate over long distances.

Leveling devices for surveyors are about 1 in 4,000 accurate The best about 1 in 10,000.
But this is with skilled professionals.

Regards,
B.
 
I agree with most of what you say, B.

So for the sake of argument, let's ignore the "long range" targets for a moment and only look at the ones below 100m.
Those I measured with a Bosch GM laser which is used by surveyors in the building industry and, according to Bosch, delivers a precision of +/- 1mm up to 150 meters in one version and +/- 1mm up to 250 meters in the second version.

Is that precise enough to rate the performance of the rangefinder binoculars and monoculars, as I did? I guess so.

I had said that the long range targets were a "best estimate" and could not be used as precise distance targets, but I found it extremely interesting anyway that the spread of results on long range targets was actually smaller than on the shorter distance targets.

Rating the rangefinder performance only on the targets below 100m, ignoring the faraway targets, would not change much in my rating, would it?

Canip
 
And a post scriptum, esp. after John's post (#5 above):
shake and trembling when aiming at a target affects target acquisition negatively, so mounting rangefinders on a tripod can greatly improve performance.

Canip
 
And a second P.S.:
I have only very rarely been able to measure targets at the specified maximum range of a rangefinder - these maximum distances according to specs are for me more a theoretical value that is hardly relevant in practice.

ymmv
Canip
 
Hi Canip,

I agree the tests are valuable and useful.

I use a Leica Disto for short distances, which is specified plus or minus 1mm up to 120 metres.

The near distances are not the problem as they can be measured with an accurate tape measure, medium size optical rangefinder or triangulation.

The problem is the longer distances.
It may be that on the test day and time all the laser rangefinders are under reading or over reading.
How does one know without a true accurate measure, preferably to 0.1metre accuracy?

One needs an independent accurate measure or maybe military grade rangefinder with high accuracy.

Consumer GPS, paper or electronic maps and amateur triangulation are not good enough in my experience.

Yes, the long distances are difficult in practice.
I find the biggest problem is that the longer distance laser rangefinder hits a leaf or twig before the intended target and one gets a very wrong reading.
At least maps and consumer GPS gets a rough reading.

It would be nice to perhaps borrow a really accurate device and get known distances of around 600m, 800m and 1000m on fixed targets from a fixed position.

These laser rangefinders are great devices.
I proved a building surveyor wrong with one and we won our Council case.

Thanks again for the tests.
I am not criticising these, just wishing there was a really accurate consumer device that always gave the same reading to one part in 10,000 up to 1000 metres or more.

There is and that is a professional surveyor's measures.
If I really needed such a long distance measure I would use one.

Regards,
B
 
The short distance lasers are accurate to 1 part in 10,000 to 1 part in 100,000.
This is good accuracy.

I don't know why the longer distance lasers from 100m or 250m to 2,000m are so poor at 1 part in 200 accuracy.
A 5m error at 1000m is not good.

This level of accuracy in measurement was provided by the ancient Greeks and probably the ancient Egyptians, Babylonians, Persians and the Mayans.

In context a 1 part in 200 error on a Marathon course is a 200m error or about 30 seconds for a runner.

With a watch or clock a 1 part in 200 error is 7 minutes a day wrong or almost one hour a week.

There may be reasons why the laser rangefinders are so poor.
It may be that calibration is difficult or the modules are just not up to good accuracy.
It could be that eye safe lasers are not powerful enough for accurate measurement.

The distance to the Moon is measured to 10cm error from the laser reflectors left on the Moon.
This is 1 part in 4 billion, but mostly measured in a vacuum or near vacuum.

For terrestrial distances of 100km to 1000km or more the consumer GPS units are good at 1 part in
30,000 to 1 part in 300,000.

I doubt that someone from the top optical firms will explain why their laser rangefinders give poor results.

Regards,
B.
 
....................................................................

The Swiss Vektronic? long distance laser rangefinders would be interesting.
As would long baseline visual rangefinders.

Regards,
B.
+-5yds, but over much longer distances, according to:


HW
 
The large pyramid built in ancient Egypt has an alignment error of 3.5 arcminutes.
This is more accurate than modern compass binoculars.

The sides of the pyramid have an error of 1 part in 1,400.
This is better than the 1 part in 200 of the laser rangefinder binoculars in post #1.

If a farmer has a field 1,000 metres square, then the 1 part in 200 error in both direction measurements translates into an area accuracy of 1 part in 100 or 1%.

I am not sure if this is accurate enough for the Land Registry.

A 5 metre error in a 1000m field will lead to boundary disputes with neighbours.

I don't consider these laser rangefinder binoculars to be accurate measuring devices, although they suffice for some purposes.

I will try to read the Vektronix link although I have looked at these before and they seem to be reasonable long distance measuring devices.

Regards,
B.
 
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