Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment (1 Viewer)

[Chosun Juan]

....Height of Insanity.....Insanity raised to the power of Infinity.....

Yes, well, I can't argue with that one ..... it does seem to be like a very biiig number ..... ||

.... Radical Actions are needed .... Stop Urban Work.....Close Down the Cities .... Do it Now ....

This is actually one of your more sensible proposals :t: 'cause gawd only knows - the very thing Industrial Society needs to do after decimating the environment to generate trillions upon trillions of tons of materials, resources and infrastructure - is to walk away and let it all go to waste |^|
..... actually, on second thoughts ......

.... Industrial Society has killed billions of farm animals in Slaughter Houses and billions of wild animals in forests with Industrial Activity for making consumer goods and services.....If we divide this number by total Industrial population we get per capita killing of animals ....

If only they were as noble as rural society - after all, they've trained the cockroaches, rats, lizards, baby animals, and myriad other critters to just walk right into their mouths and commit suicide! |8.|

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REPITITIOUS ILLOGICAL FLAWED ARGUEMENTS ........ HEIGHT OF IGNORANCE + FARCICAL HUBRIS

REFUSAL TO ADDRESS PERTINENT POINTS RAISED (such as Agraian <-> Industrial Continuum, and Overpopulation, etc) ......... HEIGHT OF INSULTS TO THE POWER OF INFINITY SQUARED + 1

RAMPANT INCONSISTENT SWEEPING GENERALISATIONS ....... HEIGHT OF UNPROFESSIONALISM like the height of the Moon is to a blade of grass

INABILITY TO ENGAGE AUDIENCE IN MEANINGFUL CONSTRUCTIVE WAY ....... HEIGHT OF FUTILITY + INEFFECTIVENESS

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Chosun :gh:

 

[chris butterworth]

Damn you Chosun.

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You've just proved his point.

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Unthinking, uncaring abuse of the capital letter in an industrial-society driven holocaust of infinite proportions, leading to Sushil being struck dumb due to your use of your non-pastoral / hunter-gatherer education.

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I thought I'd better start in on the emboldened letters, as that's about all that's left to exploit now .

Chris - the Destroyer of Worlds B

 

[chris butterworth]

Just to be very serious for a minute :-
A reduction in population?
A return to an agrarian society?
Turning away from modern technology?
An emptying of the cities and a return to village life?
It sounds disturbingly familiar to me. Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge? Didn't work out very well, as I recall. Is this the glorious future you envisage Sunil? If so, will you be one of the ones with the whip - or under it?

Chris

 

[sushil_yadav]

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Pol Pot was only trying to rectify the wrongs of Industrial Society.

If Industrial Society had not come into existence he would not have needed to bring about a change.

Agrarian Society sustained for 10,000 years and would have sustained for ever if it had not been replaced by Industrial Society.

Pol Pot will look like an angel if you compare his crimes with those of Industrial Society.

Millions of species were not decimated by Pol Pot.....They were decimated by Industrial Society.

Billions of tonnes of Metal waste, Plastic Waste, Chemical Waste, Gaseous waste, eWaste and Nuclear Waste were not produced by Pol Pot....They were produced by Industrial Society.

The number of people killed by Pol Pot will look very small when you compare it with millions of people killed by "Military Industrial Complex" in war and violence.
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This planet is home to millions of species, Not just man alone.

this planet is not the private property of man who can do whatever he wants.

Millions of other species destroy environment only for food.

Man has destroyed environment for thousands of consumer goods and services in addition to food, clothing and shelter.

It is crystal clear that man is the defective species, the anomaly.

There is nothing to discuss, debate or argue about this issue.

Millions of other species have already been decimated....If humans don't learn the lesson and continue with Industrial Activity then they are going to get decimated/ wiped out very soon.
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More than 99.9% destruction of this planet has already happened.....Only the end of humans is yet to happen.

Most of the Biodiversity and Ecosystems have already been destroyed.

Species are not lost when they become extinct....Species are lost when they get decimated....Species were lost when their populations dropped from billions and millions before industrialization to thousands and hundreds after industrialization.

There are(were) millions of species in this world....Most of them have already been decimated because Industrial Activity has destroyed most of the forests....Millions of Plant and Animal species have been decimated by Mining Industry, Logging Industry, Construction Industry, Manufacturing Industry, Energy Generation Industry, Oil Drilling, Oil Refining, Transportation Industry, Millions of kilometers of Rail and Road Networks, Ports and Airports..

If we calculate the decline in populations of millions of species after industrialization the combined loss will come to more than 99.9%.

Rivers, Lakes, Oceans, Atmosphere and Land have been polluted, poisoned and killed by trillions of tonnes of Metal Waste, Plastic Waste, Chemical Waste, Gaseous waste, eWaste and Nuclear Waste.....The entire planet has become a Toxic Dump.....All Solid, Liquid and Gaseous Industrial Waste that has been produced by Industrial Society in 250 years after Industrial Revolution has accumulated on earth....It has not gone out of earth.

Oceans have turned acidic and warmer and there are oxygen deprived dead zones in the oceans....Fish in the oceans have been decimated by Industrial Fishing.

Billions of acres of fertile soil that was the source of food to millions of species has been killed by Cement, Concrete and Asphalt.

More than 99.9% destruction of this planet has already happened.....Only the end of humans is yet to happen.

A society that has destroyed all the natural resources of the planet will also destroy itself.

After destroying biodiversity and ecosystems which sustained human life for millions of years man will not exist...It is only a matter of a few years now.

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[fugl]

Pol Pot was only trying to rectify the wrongs of Industrial Society.

I know, a great and tragic figure, but in the end the forces of Industrial Society were just too much for him.

Agrarian Society sustained for 10,000 years and would have sustained for ever if it had not been replaced by Industrial Society.

What caused Industrial Society to come into existence so suddenly, Sushil, any ideas about that? Ten millennia of peace and beauty and then, bang!, it's all over, just like that!.

 

[JTweedie]

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Pol Pot was only trying to rectify the wrongs of Industrial Society.


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And yet you use a product of the "Industrial Society" to communicate these messages.

 

[Jos Stratford]

Pol Pot was only trying to rectify the wrongs of Industrial Society.

Yep, you've confirmed it, you're a total fruit cake.

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There is nothing to discuss, debate or argue about this issue.

Which probably explains your infliction to regurgitate the same baloney time after time. Lucky industrial society invented cut and paste, eh?

 

[chris butterworth]

Your true colours are beginning to show Sunil. It's not 'industrial society', or anything else you rant about, that you hate. It's a hatred for a single species, but do you include yourself in that hatred? I very much doubt it. Could you, in all honesty, answer the question I posed in my last post? With, or under the whip? I've a got a feeling I know what the true answer is, although, if you do answer, it'll probably be with another tirade, to try and deflect the question.

Chris

 

[chris butterworth]

While you're winding yourself up for another round of cut and paste Sunil, some facts ( albeit the product of industrial societies education system, which gave us archeology).

Mining industry :- Grimes Graves, Suffolk, UK. 8000 year old 'industrial' mining of flint. Copper mines that go back almost as far in places as far apart as Wales, Romania and Afghanistan.

Manufacturing ( on a large scale ) :- Possibly as far back as 50, 000 years ago ( and there are signs that pre-humans were moving in that direction).

Mass extinction by humans :- Large mammal species in North America by the first humans to cross from Asia possibly 60, 000 years ago. The same in northern Australia at about the same time, and the pre-industrial societies in the Caribbean and Polynesia did a damn good job of exterminating anything edible as well.

Destruction of the ecology of an area :- I suggest you look at the latest research into why so many Central and South American cultures vanished.

These are a few of the effects caused by pre-industrial, agrarian and hunter/gatherer societies and are all deeply embedded in the 'Golden Age' you want us to return to. It's not 'industrial society', it's not Homo sapiens (both are here to stay, for the foreseeable future ) that are the problem. It's people who aren't prepared to get off their arse and do something but merely sit around pontificating.

Chris

 

[sushil_yadav]

What caused Industrial Society to come into existence so suddenly, Sushil, any ideas about that? Ten millennia of peace and beauty and then, bang!, it's all over, just like that!.

The cause was western civilization.

Progress, Growth and Development (of the material kind) are / were primarily western concepts which were forced upon rest of the world.

Today the entire world is collectively involved in destruction of environment but the biggest role in this process of destruction was played by Western Civilization.

The West was the first to start Industrial Revolution and travel on the destructive path of Industrialization and Consumerism.......It then forced western lifestyle on its colonies in Asia, Africa and America whose cultures it had already destroyed during the era of Colonization.

The West took the entire world on the wrong path of Industrialization, Consumerism, Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP that has led to destruction of most of the Biodiversity and Ecosystems.

The West did not have the foresight to know that a lifestyle based on loot, plunder and exploitation of natural resources would destroy the very things that created and sustained all life on earth for millions of years and ultimately lead to total destruction of biodiversity and ecosystems.

The West started Industrial Revolution and promoted Materialism because it focused on "Reason"......The East had focused on "Subjective Experience" for thousands of years which led to "Spiritual Development".

The West spent its time and energy on "reason" which led to Science, Technology and Industrialization / Material Development....The West has got very little knowledge of Spiritual Development.....Very little concept of peaceful states of mind / peaceful subjective experience.

The Aborigines of Australia would not have started the Industrial Revolution.

Red Indians / Native Americans would not have started the Industrial Revolution.

The Africans are very unlikely to have started the Industrial Revolution.

These cultures were quite happy and content with their Rituals and Spiritual Practices.

In India people had made efforts for Spiritual Development for thousands of years.....They developed methods and techniques for making the mind quiet, tranquil and peaceful......The knowledge of subjective experience led to the fields of yoga, meditation and pranayam [breath control].......Material Development has destroyed the planet, If any kind of development was needed it was Spiritual Development.

Human work should fulfill the basic needs of food, clothing and shelter.....It should not turn into overwork or destructive work.....If extra time is available to people and society after basic needs have been fulfilled it should be used for Spiritual Practices, Art and Culture.

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[Mono]

Here's a book for you to read Sushil

http://www.junglee.com/Guns-Germs-S...70598826&sr=8-1&keywords=guns+germs+and+steel

 

[angusmcoatup]

On behalf of the West, I apologise. Now what do you suggest we do?

 

[Sangahyando]

The cause was western civilization.

Yes, it's easy to blame everything on other cultures, and underline it with half-truths, factoids ripped from context, or even outright fabrications. History is a delicate subject just like other sciences, however you and like-minded people prefer to mistreat it as a weapon with which to beat other people. It's a despicable tactic, really.

 

[Liz1400]

The cause was western civilization.

Progress, Growth and Development (of the material kind) are / were primarily western concepts which were forced upon rest of the world.

Today the entire world is collectively involved in destruction of environment but the biggest role in this process of destruction was played by Western Civilization.

The West was the first to start Industrial Revolution and travel on the destructive path of Industrialization and Consumerism.......It then forced western lifestyle on its colonies in Asia, Africa and America whose cultures it had already destroyed during the era of Colonization.

The West took the entire world on the wrong path of Industrialization, Consumerism, Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP that has led to destruction of most of the Biodiversity and Ecosystems.

The West did not have the foresight to know that a lifestyle based on loot, plunder and exploitation of natural resources would destroy the very things that created and sustained all life on earth for millions of years and ultimately lead to total destruction of biodiversity and ecosystems.

The West started Industrial Revolution and promoted Materialism because it focused on "Reason"......The East had focused on "Subjective Experience" for thousands of years which led to "Spiritual Development".

The West spent its time and energy on "reason" which led to Science, Technology and Industrialization / Material Development....The West has got very little knowledge of Spiritual Development.....Very little concept of peaceful states of mind / peaceful subjective experience.

The Aborigines of Australia would not have started the Industrial Revolution.

Red Indians / Native Americans would not have started the Industrial Revolution.

The Africans are very unlikely to have started the Industrial Revolution.

These cultures were quite happy and content with their Rituals and Spiritual Practices.

In India people had made efforts for Spiritual Development for thousands of years.....They developed methods and techniques for making the mind quiet, tranquil and peaceful......The knowledge of subjective experience led to the fields of yoga, meditation and pranayam [breath control].......Material Development has destroyed the planet, If any kind of development was needed it was Spiritual Development.

Human work should fulfill the basic needs of food, clothing and shelter.....It should not turn into overwork or destructive work.....If extra time is available to people and society after basic needs have been fulfilled it should be used for Spiritual Practices, Art and Culture.

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One look at your rants shows that you, clearly, have not mastered the spiritual, peaceful mind. While many of your ideas on conservation are well intended, your words are dripping with hatred and spite. You lump all westerners together as one wasteful, belligerent and ignorant entity, living in a concrete wasteland. Have you ever been anywhere in the United States? I grew up in New England, and it is almost entirely forest. I played in the woods as a kid, that was my entertainment. We visited the shores of Lake Michigan every year, where you can hike for miles along the beach and not see one man made structure. We have cities in the US, but we also still have a lot of untouched wilderness. I am also a practicing Catholic, with a deep respect for God's creatures and the world he created. Again, not every American thinks this way, but we are not all completely without a sense of spirituality. Do not put your country on a spiritual high horse. When you completely eliminate murder, theft and rape from your country, THEN you can lecture Westerners on how they are always wrong, and you are always right. You are choosing to attack individuals in this forum, most of whom, joined because they love birds and want to see them be happy and successful. Many have created a mini, bird sanctuary in their own back yards. I agree with you that, in many cases, the exploitation and contamination of industry has gone too far. Unfortunately, you raving like a hateful lunatic has dissolved much of your credibility. I would have expected a more thoughtful and less judgmental response from a peaceful minded, spiritual person such as yourself.

 

[sushil_yadav]

I grew up in New England, and it is almost entirely forest. I played in the woods as a kid, that was my entertainment. We visited the shores of Lake Michigan every year, where you can hike for miles along the beach and not see one man made structure. We have cities in the US, but we also still have a lot of untouched wilderness. .... Do not put your country on a spiritual high horse. When you completely eliminate murder, theft and rape from your country, THEN you can lecture Westerners on how they are always wrong, and you are always right.

First of all I would like to inform you that the title of this thread is "Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment"....Here "Industrial Society" refers to all countries of the world not just western countries.
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So you grew up in New England and it is almost entirely forest.

Does that mean there is no environmental destruction in America???

Kindly do a search on the following to know the truth:

"Toxic America"

"Industrial Pollution in America"

"Environmental destruction in America"

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Large scale environmental destruction in America has been happening for centuries since colonization.

When the Europeans colonized America they started the loot, plunder and exploitation of natural resources disregarding any advice from Native Americans.

"only after the last tree has been cut down

only after the last river has been poisoned

only after the last fish has been caught

only then will you realize that you cannot eat money"

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America has 5% of world population and is consuming 25 - 40% of world resources.

Do you know how many millions of acres of forests have been destroyed in South/ Central America to produce grains and grazing grounds for feeding billions of cattle which are then slaughtered in Industrial Slaughter Houses and imported by America and Europe to feed their population, half to two-thirds of which has grown obese due to overeating???

Do you know how many millions of acres of rain forests have been destroyed to produce bio fuel for America and Europe???

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[sushil_yadav]

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The recent Floods and Land Slides in Uttarakhand in India are more of an Industrial Disaster than a Natural Disaster.

This catastrophe is a consequence of World Bank funded Dam Industry.....Hundreds of Dams and Hydro Electric Projects are being constructed in the fragile mountain range.

This calamity is a consequence of unchecked activities of Construction Industry, Logging Industry, Mining Industry and Tourism Industry.

**Development is Destruction.....Development is Destruction.**

**Growth Rate** - **Economy Rate** - **GDP**....These are figures of Ecocide....These are figures of "Crimes against Nature"....These are figures of "Destruction of Ecosystems".....These are figures of "Insanity, Abnormality and Criminality".

Politicians who promote Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP are Eco Killers, Eco Murderers and Eco Terrorists.

Economists who promote Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP are Eco Killers, Eco Murderers and Eco Terrorists.

IMF and World Bank which promote Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP are Eco Killers, Eco Murderers and Eco Terrorists.

Rating Agencies which promote Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP are Eco Killers, Eco Murderers and Eco Terrorists.

Industrialists who promote Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP are Eco Killers, Eco Murderers and Eco Terrorists.

All people and Institutions that promote Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP are Eco Killers, Eco Murderers and Eco Terrorists.

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Industrial Nations are used to threatening their adversaries with Military Might and Nuclear Weapons.

How are they going to deal with Climate which is getting more and more extreme day by day???

Are they going to nuke Hurricanes and Tornadoes too???

Are they going to nuke Droughts and Floods too???

The west used to think droughts and floods are problems of Asia, Africa and poor countries of the world....They are now occurring in the west too.

The day is not far when Agriculture will collapse worldwide due to extreme and irregular weather.

What is man going to eat???.....He has already decimated fish in the oceans.

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Progress, Growth, Development.....This is terminology for all unnecessary and destructive work being done by Urban Population.

Growth Rate - Economy Rate - GDP......These are figures for all unnecessary and destructive work being done by Urban Population.

If Urban Society stops its supplies to Rural Society it will live forever.

If Rural Society stops its supplies to Urban Society it will die within a month.

That is the worth of Urban Work, Consumer Goods, Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP in this world.
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The planet is dying.....It is gasping for last breath.

Radical Actions are needed.

Industrial Activity for production of thousands of consumer goods and services must stop immediately.

Cities are the Graveyards of Nature, Urban Dwellers the Executioners.
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Stop Education.....Close Down Universities.

Stop Urban Work.....Close Down the Cities.

Do it Now.

A few years later would be too late.
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[fugl]

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The planet is dying.....It is gasping for last breath.

Radical Actions are needed.

Industrial Activity for production of thousands of consumer goods and services must stop immediately.

Cities are the Graveyards of Nature, Urban Dwellers the Executioners.
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Stop Education.....Close Down Universities.

Stop Urban Work.....Close Down the Cities.

Do it Now.

A few years later would be too late.
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I'm kind of busy at the moment, Sushil. Can I get back to you on this?

 

[chris butterworth]

I can't help but notice you've never addressed the points I raised Sushil. If 'industrial society' and only that, is the sole cause of ecological destruction then what about the extinction of the mega-fauna of North America, of Australia by pre-industrial, hunter-gatherer societies? What is your view of the pre-industrial societies of Central and Southern America that destroyed themselves by over exploitation of their environment? Your narrow, simplistic and, frankly childish view that 'industrial society', and only 'industrial society' is the sole cause of the world's ills may be shaken if you weren't so consumed with a hatred bordering on a phobia. I also asked if, in this 'golden age' of agricultural societies and pastoralism that you envisage as the 'ideal' society ( albeit without educated doctors etc. ) if you would be one of the ones toiling for hours in the fields , or would you be one of the ones 'directing their efforts'? Any answers forthcoming Sunil?

Chris

 

[Mono]

I can't help but notice you've never addressed the points I raised Sushil.

Sushil never answers anyone's points. He is akin to the Jehovah's Witnesses but instead of door knocking he visits an extensive array of web forums and spreads "the word". He is a believer and like all believers he just wants you to believe too. And just like the Jehovah's Witnesses it can be fun for one to take down their assertions but one must do so in the certain knowledge that it will change nought.

Edit: Thought this might help. http://atheismresource.com/wp-content/uploads/Debate-Flow-Chart1.jpg

 

[birdboybowley]

Exactly....stop baiting the troll. He's just a sorry whack-job and should not be addressed. It was amusing to start with but now it's kinda pathetic