Norfolk birding (10 Viewers)

[Locostella]

May I recommend that you study closely two things on the image of the fem Common Xbill you posted the link too, and on the images of the 2BXbill under discussion: (i) the relationship in both shape and position of the median and greater covert wingbars; and (ii) the exact extent and shape of the white on the tertials. This is where the important features are to be found and I think you will see the differences. Hope this helps

Willowgrouse,

Maybe you would be kind enough to elaborate on your thoughts of these features. Also, unfortunately, the female that I linked to is not in a position to be showing us any tertial pattern. There is a heavily marked skin in the British Birds paper (here) which may help for comparison with the Lynford bird. I, myself am failing to see any strong differences between the tertial markings in the Lynford bird and the skin in the paper.

Thanks for your time taken to discuss this topic Willowgrouse, it's most informative and appreciated.

Kieran

 

[willowgrouse]

Willowgrouse,

Maybe you would be kind enough to elaborate on your thoughts of these features. Also, unfortunately, the female that I linked to is not in a position to be showing us any tertial pattern. There is a heavily marked skin in the British Birds paper (here) which may help for comparison with the Lynford bird. I, myself am failing to see any strong differences between the tertial markings in the Lynford bird and the skin in the paper.

I think that the angle of the wing-barred common xbill you linked earlier would not stop you seeing the white tertial tips if present, thus suggesting they are not present, with more of a complete but indistinct pale fringe visible.

Equally as important is the shape and concentric curvature if the median and greater cov bars of this bird. 2BXbill has wingbars that do not appear concentric as a result of them being wider on the outer median covs, narrowing towards the inners, but the reverse on the greater cov bar which is narrower on the outer covs. This feature is more evident in ads than in 1w birds with retained juv wing feathers. Graham also noted earlier that the length of the xbill breeding season means that 1w birds may be as much as 4 months different in age and this has an effect on wear.

The bird in the BB paper is an enigma and a reminder that this is not always easy! The label on the bird shows it was once identified as a 2BXbill. Is it really a common? If you can't tell in the hand it's not always going to be easy in the field! I certainly wouldn't want to call that one but IMO the Lynford bird is a 2BXbill

 

[Locostella]

I think that the angle of the wing-barred common xbill you linked earlier would not stop you seeing the white tertial tips if present, thus suggesting they are not present, with more of a complete but indistinct pale fringe visible.

Equally as important is the shape and concentric curvature if the median and greater cov bars of this bird. 2BXbill has wingbars that do not appear concentric as a result of them being wider on the outer median covs, narrowing towards the inners, but the reverse on the greater cov bar which is narrower on the outer covs. This feature is more evident in ads than in 1w birds with retained juv wing feathers. Graham also noted earlier that the length of the xbill breeding season means that 1w birds may be as much as 4 months different in age and this has an effect on wear.

The bird in the BB paper is an enigma and a reminder that this is not always easy! The label on the bird shows it was once identified as a 2BXbill. Is it really a common? If you can't tell in the hand it's not always going to be easy in the field! I certainly wouldn't want to call that one but IMO the Lynford bird is a 2BXbill

Thanks Willow',

This is and will continue to be an interesting topic. I'm very much glad that we have had some real stonkers this year and not just this one individual. If anything, at least it has allowed us to discover a little bit more about both species extremes.

Cheers,

Kieran

 

[Paul Eele]

Titchwell November 7th

Today's highlights

Black necked grebe - 1 reported offshore
Red necked grebe - 1 offshore
velvet scoter - 2 offshore
Long tailed duck - 1 offshore
Sandwich tern - 3 offshore
Snow bunting - 20 on beach but mobile
Hooded crow - 1 on reserve again today but mobile
Swallow - 3 over reserve
Short eared owl - 1 hunting grazing meadow all day

Paul

 

[willowgrouse]

2BXbills

This is and will continue to be an interesting topic...

It is indeed Keiran, not least because this bird is quite possibly one of the birds that arrived at Lynford end July/early Aug and was confidently being identified in the field (and from photos) as a juv 2BXbill, but has since moulted many of its body feathers whilst retaining its juv wing feathers.

If you think xbills are confusing, wait till you start delving into the redpoll complex!

 

[Dawn Balmer]

It is indeed Keiran, not least because this bird is quite possibly one of the birds that arrived at Lynford end July/early Aug and was confidently being identified in the field (and from photos) as a juv 2BXbill, but has since moulted many of its body feathers whilst retaining its juv wing feathers.QUOTE]

There was a juvenile wing-barred Common Crossbill also present in the summer at Lynford.

 

[robinchittenden]

Crossbills

Here is a rubbish shot of some Crossbills at Lynford taken today. The contentious one with white wing bars was seen to court a female Common Crossbill.

Does that help?

Robin

 

[Jhanlon]

Here is a rubbish shot of some Crossbills at Lynford taken today. The contentious one with white wing bars was seen to court a female Common Crossbill.

Does that help?

Robin

I don't think so, of more interest is the colour comparison with male common showing the bird to be spot on (pinkish hue) for TBC.

James

 

[Archie Opteryx]

Ropey pics of Black Brant at Cley this afternoon..

Linky thing

 

[stuart white]

If it is a two barred crossbill it must be the shitest one ever seen!

 

[sacha]

I don't think so, of more interest is the colour comparison with male common showing the bird to be spot on (pinkish hue) for TBC.

James

I agree. Colour tone really stands out in that photo. Bill also looks good for TBC.
Can't see much wrong other than weak wingbars, which as has been mentioned before, is presumably due to it being a first year bird
Sacha

 

[harrier1234]

Brancaster 0700-0915

Influx of Blackbirds busily stripping berries, steady passage of Chaffinches west 300 in parties up to 30. Blackcap(f), Bearded Tit, Long Tailed Duck(2)

 

[stuart white]

Cracking day at holkham today, 20+ white fronted geese, 6 velvet scorer, 2-3 red necked grebes, 2 slavonian grebes, 2 great northern divers, a fine pair of goosander, 15 snow buntings, 7 shorelarks (thanks to Mr. D appleton) & 5 long tailed ducks including 2 drakes. Finishing at warham greens, 2 hen harriers inc male, merlin, peregrine and 2 barn owls. All good!

I never doubted Houghton for a minute!

 

[MJB]

Cracking day at holkham today, 20+ white fronted geese, 6 velvet scorer, 2-3 red necked grebes, 2 slavonian grebes, 2 great northern divers, a fine pair of goosander, 15 snow buntings, 7 shorelarks (thanks to Mr. D appleton) & 5 long tailed ducks including 2 drakes. Finishing at warham greens, 2 hen harriers inc male, merlin, peregrine and 2 barn owls. All good, shame Norwich are so rubbish!

Norwich are leading 2-1 with 20 minutes to go....
MJB

 

[Peter Dolton]

and then managed another goal to win 3-1

 

[Penny Clarke]

Found the Great Grey Shrike at Roydon Common this morning along with Jim S. Steve W. and a friend and then raced over to Waxham and got lucky with the Humpback Whale - Awesome is an understatement!!!:t:

Full update on blog.

Penny:girl:

 

[gclarke1]

Some very nice views of Short-eared Owl yesterday at Titchwell.

Cheers

Graham Clarke

http://grahamsphoto.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/neither-autumn-or-winter.html

 

[Paul Woolnough]

Short-eared owl briefly along Thornham Marsh this afternoon but the hooded crow was dipped by most including me.

Morning at a bracing Holkham Gap dunes with a choppy swell on the sea
First look in scope and a long-tailed duck flies into view.
Soon after, an initially unidentified skua close in. Flies over observers and is a pale juvenile pom! Two bonxies later.
Some guillemot and razorbills plus eider past.
Was sure there was a velvet with the common scoter. Two poor views, so never clinched ID. All forgotten when a pair of velvets flew past close in.

 

[Archie Opteryx]

Funny looking bird amongst the Brents at Cley this afternoon. Assumed leucistic?

 

[Fast Ricky]

Short-eared owl briefly along Thornham Marsh this afternoon but the hooded crow was dipped by most...

As I left Titchwell around 1 p.m. the hooded crow was seen mobbing a female marsh harrier.