Peregrine or Hobby ? You Decide. (1 Viewer)

[London Birder]

Sorry, below the belt. :flowers:

Pale nape mark is no obstacle to immature peregrine GV.

Rob

true...in some variants, however a pale nape mark on a juvenile Peregrine wouldnt be this white

 

[salty]

hobby.



or possibly an eleonora's falcon, not wanting to confuse things even more!

 

[Woody]

This is all very entertaining I must say!

The photo shows a hobby, in my humble opinion. The head has that very flat topped look which I always associate with hobby, it's not nearly chunky enough to be a peregrine based on the size of the foot. Having said that, I make no claim to being an expert. (I always thought it was a kestrel BTW).

Woody

 

[Richard D]

Gut feeling is Hobby, but I wouldn't want to put any money on it not being a juv Peregrine...

 

[lou salomon]

hi there,
for steve: the bird was photographed on 5th aug. 2004 by Frank Neijts in southern netherlands.

for londonbirder: concerning the cere D.Forsman says about peregrine: "cere, eye-ring and feet greenish in late nestling period but turning yellowish during fledgling period, deep yellow in adult." in some depicted juvs admittedly they look greyish, in others yellowish.
in our pic its real colour is hard to discern!

i opt for a very hobbyish lookin' young peregrin: too fine streaking on breast for hobby, wide, rounded moustatial stripe, quite big bill.
in addition: in the original website (have a look at http://www.vogelsindekempen.nl/ - go to Multimedia Identificatiehoek and then on the third "Slechtfalk") it says it is a juvenile female. females are so big that i can't imagine any ringer would confuse them just by size!!!
cheerio,

 

[postcardcv]

It would be interesting to see the measurements taken when the bird was rung, surely this should remove any doubt either way.

 

[JANJ]

Surely looks like a Hobby (shape), with a trifle larger looking bill, a broader, than usual, moustache (which is not darker than the crown, as on many peregrines) lack of thin supercilium and finley streaked breast.
What is the age of the bird? Since juveniles are buffish, not white below, and this one seems whitish, it´s possibly older, notice the white-tipped tail, lacking in adults.
Checking the under tail barring it seems as the pale bars are almost as wide as the dark ones, typically pale bars are narrower than the dark ones in juv/1st.w. in peregrines.
Consider variation, lack of an obvious supercilium is no "danger", the fine breast streaking is hard to find, the broad moustache.. hmm, a little to broad for HY.
The bill size could in fact be an effect of slight overexposure!?
So if I would to go on immediate impression I´d say Hobby.
JanJ

 

[jforgham]

Well, if the photo was taken very recently then it's more likely to be a Peregrine as surely Hobby's would have left the country by now. Also, the broad moustache would also indicate Peregrine.

However, that white mark behind the "ear" is a bit Hobby-esque isn't it?

Steve

Hi,
Have had hobby twice in the last 7 days at Amwell gravel pits, Hertfordshire. My latest ever records of this species within Herts. No more reports since. In my humble view this looks to be a hobby to me.
Jono
PS If this turns out to be a peregrine, then the bird I saw at Amwell remains a hobby due to red trouser id.

 

[Ghostly Vision]

hi there,
for steve: the bird was photographed on 5th aug. 2004 by Frank Neijts in southern netherlands.

for londonbirder: concerning the cere D.Forsman says about peregrine: "cere, eye-ring and feet greenish in late nestling period but turning yellowish during fledgling period, deep yellow in adult." in some depicted juvs admittedly they look greyish, in others yellowish.
in our pic its real colour is hard to discern!

i opt for a very hobbyish lookin' young peregrin: too fine streaking on breast for hobby, wide, rounded moustatial stripe, quite big bill.
in addition: in the original website (have a look at http://www.vogelsindekempen.nl/ - go to Multimedia Identificatiehoek and then on the third "Slechtfalk") it says it is a juvenile female. females are so big that i can't imagine any ringer would confuse them just by size!!!
cheerio,

Neither can I. But I can't find the Slechtfalk on that page. Help?

GV

 

[robinm]

Neither can I. But I can't find the Slechtfalk on that page. Help?

GV

You have to scroll down quite a bit, but it is there.

 

[wolfbirder]

I cannot claim to have the level of knowledge others posses on here, but to me its a juv Peregrine. The streaking seems to narrow, and it tapers off to the neck. If you squint it almost looks like there is no striping towards the upper chest/throat - an impression you often get of Peregrine at distance. Hobby streaking always appears uniformly bold from top to bottom. The jiz and shape is difficult to determine from this picture.

 

[JANJ]

Missed the ringing, and as Lou say´s, can´t imagine that ringers would confuse them by size.
JanJ

 

[yorkshire83]

This bird seems to have quite a long tail, and quite visible barring underneath which would indicate peregrine (correct me if im wrong- a hobby's would be less obvious, more uniform in colour.)

I also think the moustacial stripe is rather thick, and the spotting which appears above the dark bar on the shoulder - also indicate peregrine.

I am no expert on either of these species though! But like Jan says i would be amazed if the ringers got this wrong!!!

 

[lou salomon]

hey guys,
i've googled a bit about frank neijts and he doesn't seem to be an unexperienced birder. and he has posted this juvenile hobby on the same website.

 

[JANJ]

Yorkshire83,
Maybe Juvenile Hobby has a less obvious barring on upper tail, the middle
feathers being unbarred, than a PF (adult certainly has), but not on the under tail. The mentioned of this in #27 could be subject to variation. If anything, the under tail pattern on the subject bird could indicate a Hobby.
JanJ

 

[JANJ]

Of course Lou, that´s what we want them to look like.
JanJ

 

[lou salomon]

i have mailed to the author of the pics. maybe he can tell us something about the hot debated bird.

 

[London Birder]

lets hope so

 

[Ian Bell]

Its a Hobby for me.

 

[London Birder]

if it was rung as a Peregrine, do other shots exist?