Aluminum parabolic dishes: opinions? (1 Viewer)

I've been searching online for parabolic reflectors, and I was able to find some here

These are made of aluminum, and I'm eying the 24 inch one(so I could capture lower frequency sounds too, like frog calls): I'm wondering if these would work for sound recording, since their description mentions microphones.

I'm only wondering if aluminum would make recordings sound too 'metallic.' I can't seem to find any other sites that have just parabolas without an accompanying microphone, which I don't need since I already have a mic.

Hi,

I am lucky enough to own a Telinga parabolic reflector (second hand when the BBC closed one of it's sound departments) which is amazing but ludicrously expensive to buy new at around $1500.

You could try this american site who specialise in sports sound recording

http://www.parabs.com/

Really not sure about an aluminium reflector (handy as a wok I suppose if you barbeque after a birding trip) since I have only ever seen acrylic / plastic reflectors in use.

Hope you find the right bit of kit at the right price

I see Doug Von Gausig says on his site a new Telinga foldable dish goes for $125(according to this link: Telinga Microphone Sales I tried contacting him once, with no luck.

Parabs.com doesn't seem to have a way of ordering online, and in any case, they're a bit on the high side for me(I have an inexpensive microphone, so I assume an expensive dish wouldn't help it much ).

There's a different type of parabola on this site: Parabolic Microphone Reflector It's made of aluminum, but again, a bit pricey. I'm just looking for something basic, not necessarily professional. |;|

I have been lucky enough to use Telinga parabolas and top-of-the-line and middle-of-the-line Sennheiser shotgun microphones at work to record birds. To be quite honest, I prefer the shotgun style microphones. Here's why:
1) Good parabolas are large. They are a pain to carry around, and get caught up on branches all the time. If you ever want to take the parabola on a fieldtrip, it can be a real pain, and I even had a Telinga parabola cracked on one journey.
2) More importantly, when you turn around and wave something that large at a bird, it is more likely (in my subjective opinion) to shut-up. Shotguns are much less obtrusive.
3) I have always found controlling wind noise on parabolas more difficult than with shotguns. You can buy these fabric sheets that you pull across the front of the parabola, but if it was a bit breezy, I often found that this cover would bang into the microphone (horrible noise), and the cover made the whole apparatis catch in the wind, and move around (more noise).

I think that Telingas may possibly provide you with a louder recording than a good shotgun microphone, but to be honest, I've found the recording quality of the various set-ups I've used indistinguishable (however, I work mostly on chaffinches, which sing quite loudly!).

I think you can buy shotgun style microphones quite reasonably too, since several manufacturers make them (caveat: I've only ever used Sennheiser, but they are pretty expensive - my set up costs about $400).

lachlustre said:

I think you can buy shotgun style microphones quite reasonably too, since several manufacturers make them (caveat: I've only ever used Sennheiser, but they are pretty expensive - my set up costs about $400).

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Hi lachy,

I am thinking about upgrading my cheapo shotgun( OEM Audio Technica ATR55 ??? )/Mini Disc combo. What Sennheiser do you use a ME66 or a ME67 ?

I am considering a Telinga, but could probably only afford the one advertised by Wildsounds - a plug and play DAT/MD mono (which is ok ) version, which is £389.

My species are all 3 regular crossbill sp. in British Isles. I record flight calls and excitement calls to ID via sonogram ( though this is for "scientific" verification as can now do them by ear !! ). Just getting in to the songs, and realise that I need more quality and resolution in order to take more precise measurements.

Any thoughts ?


Cheers,

Linz

The microphone I use is a shotgun mic, an Audio Technical ATR55, like Grifin's. Yeah, it's cheap, but I'm not about to spend several hundred bucks on a microphone. Not yet, at least. If I ever get anything more expensive, it would likely be secondhand. |;|

I don't do any recording in the field, since i don't have anything like a minidisc recorder. So, a parabola would simply be on the same stand with my mic, pointed at my open window where birds are feeding.

griffin said:

Hi lachy,

I am thinking about upgrading my cheapo shotgun( OEM Audio Technica ATR55 ??? )/Mini Disc combo. What Sennheiser do you use a ME66 or a ME67 ?

I am considering a Telinga, but could probably only afford the one advertised by Wildsounds - a plug and play DAT/MD mono (which is ok ) version, which is £389.

My species are all 3 regular crossbill sp. in British Isles. I record flight calls and excitement calls to ID via sonogram ( though this is for "scientific" verification as can now do them by ear !! ). Just getting in to the songs, and realise that I need more quality and resolution in order to take more precise measurements.

Any thoughts ?


Cheers,

Linz

Click to expand...

I've got a ME67 + a k6 capsule. I record into a Marantz PMD 670 flash disk recorder which I also HIGHLY recommend for things like flight calls. The cool thing it does is a 2 second pre-record function (i.e. you can set it to constantly record into a buffer, and when you hit record, it transfers that buffer to memory). For my main project, which involves recording chaffinch song repertoires this doesn't really help me: my recordings are all around 5-10mins, and missing the first couple of seconds really doesn't matter. But on a side-project, looking at how jackdaws use their calls in social interactions, this was really invaluable. The birds tended only to call once or twice when flying up to their nest hole - really easy to miss. If you're recording flight calls, or birds that only sing infrequently, I could imagine this could really help too.

Cheers,
ROb

lachlustre said:

I've got a ME67 + a k6 capsule. I record into a Marantz PMD 670 flash disk recorder which I also HIGHLY recommend for things like flight calls. The cool thing it does is a 2 second pre-record function (i.e. you can set it to constantly record into a buffer, and when you hit record, it transfers that buffer to memory). For my main project, which involves recording chaffinch song repertoires this doesn't really help me: my recordings are all around 5-10mins, and missing the first couple of seconds really doesn't matter. But on a side-project, looking at how jackdaws use their calls in social interactions, this was really invaluable. The birds tended only to call once or twice when flying up to their nest hole - really easy to miss. If you're recording flight calls, or birds that only sing infrequently, I could imagine this could really help too.

Cheers,
ROb

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Thanks for that Rob.

I have thought about a digital recorder but other than Edirol one the cost is a bit prohibitive ! I am still toying with the Telinga Pro4 PIP or going all out and re-mortgaging the house for a Pro5W Twin Science !!!

A couple of more Q's about your set up. Crossbill flight calls are similar in strength to chaffie calls, and also the song is similar in dymamics -though Crossbills also trill, wheeze and toop while singing. So,

What is the effective and max. range of ME67 with flight calls/song in order to maintain good signal strength and detail ?

Can it take a beating eg. Piss:ing rain, snow storms, etc ?

What do you use to minimize handling noise ?

Does the K6 have a 3.5 mm jack as standard or is it XLR ?

Have found a site in Germany where I can save about £140 on UK prices and not have to pay import tax. I am tempted, but am also seriously considering the Telinga.

Thanks in advance,

Linz

PS Rob,

Have you got any Crossbill calls from your field trips on the continent ????

Linz

griffin said:

PS Rob,

Have you got any Crossbill calls from your field trips on the continent ????

Linz

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I'm afraid not: nearly all my fieldwork in recent years has been on the Atlantic Islands (Azores, Madeira, Canaries). I'm a lousy birdwatcher, but I'm pretty sure I didn't miss any crossbills

wrt recorders: we just got the smaller Marantz recorders today (pmd-660). They are fantastic little machines, and contra what I thought, they also have the 2sec pre-record function too. They can be had for around $450 in the States (you also have to shell out for a 1GB compact flash card). Don't know if that's pushing it for you.

More about the microphones: effective range. I never know exactly how to answer this because conditions matter so much more than equipment, in my experience. In perfect conditions (a bird at the top of the hedge on a beautiful cool early morning miles away from any traffic), I've made a nice recording from... ooh... more than 30m. I also have lousy recordings from within a fir plantation in a breeze at no more than 15m. I can do a test recording for you if you like, but I honestly find this difficult to answer.

We have around 5-6 k6/ME67 combinations in the lab, from 2-5 years old. Most have been abused by masters and undergraduate students, in Holland, often in wet conditions. My pair have been taken to Madeira and the Azores in cool, wet (but rarely p***ing rain) conditions; dragged around the forests etc. I'm unaware of any problems with any of them yet. I think that simply because of their form, they are more field durable than the Telingas. I have broken a Telinga parabola (I still shudder): it was easier than I thought.

The k6 has an xlr jack.

I do absolutely nothing to minimize handling noise other than stand still. We have a mount somewhere in a cupboard in the lab. It rarely gets used: I can ask around to see if anyone thought it was useful or not. A good windshield is vital, however.

If I had the budget for a Telinga, I would seriously consider a Marantz 660 + Sennheiser ME67/K6 combination... but that's just me.

lachlustre said:

If I had the budget for a Telinga, I would seriously consider a Marantz 660 + Sennheiser ME67/K6 combination... but that's just me.

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Thanks again for your comments.

I am considering the shotgun option - it is certainly much cheaper. Happy with the Mz900 MD as it allows uncompressed WAV recording, though at the mo I use a MZ710 in MONO mode and get very good results.

Common Crossbill flight calls ( or some of them )are "chippy" and a bit quieter overall hence my obsession with more gain/volume that a parabola can deliver ! Sometimes the vital diagnostic components are missing or faint at distance. It is also real easy to confuse Scotbill and Parrot flight calls where the bird is more distant ( not that I do you understand ! ). Just for the "scientific" record and validation.

Cheers,

Linz

For a fixed installation an aluminium parabola would be fine. For toting in the field it would get heavy real fast

Using low cost (read noisy) microphones a parabolic dish would give you a much better signal to noise ratio for a given bird and distance than a cheap shotgun mic, because the dish boosts the sound before it reaches the noisy microphone. Dishes need air to breathe though - they must be in the window opening or outside - a parabolic dish deosn't seem to work that well from inside a room through an open window. My dish is slightly larger than the window opening so that might be expected I suppose.

If the dish rings and colors the sound you could use damping panels available at car accessory stores to damp the back of the dish.