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Swift 820 ED, I am new to bird watching (1 Viewer)

T

tom1946

New member
Can anyone tell me about the build quality of the Swift Audubon 8.5 X44 BWCF 820ED.

I am new to bird watching, and have been using JB era Yashica 8X30 binoculars to date I am now ready to buy a better quality optic. From my reading, I know the Swift Audubon 8.5 X44 (804 model) had a devoted following, and were rated very highly optically. More recent comments about the newer 820 model while continuing to praise the optical quality (especially the ED model) soom have expressed concern for the quality of the design of the bridge and other parts of the binocular.

I would be interested in hearing from anyone with field experience with the 820. The durability question, as well as all other comments and thoughts will be appreciated.

Any advice on other binoculars in the price category would also be welcome.
 
tom1946 said:
Can anyone tell me about the build quality of the Swift Audubon 8.5 X44 BWCF 820ED.

I am new to bird watching, and have been using JB era Yashica 8X30 binoculars to date I am now ready to buy a better quality optic. From my reading, I know the Swift Audubon 8.5 X44 (804 model) had a devoted following, and were rated very highly optically. More recent comments about the newer 820 model while continuing to praise the optical quality (especially the ED model) soom have expressed concern for the quality of the design of the bridge and other parts of the binocular.

I would be interested in hearing from anyone with field experience with the 820. The durability question, as well as all other comments and thoughts will be appreciated.

Any advice on other binoculars in the price category would also be welcome.
Click to expand...

Tom, I will let you know soon, as I am awaiting delivery of the said bins any day now. Having splashed out for a Swarovski ATS65 ED scope bundle, I refuse to shell out the same amount for a pair of the same manufacturer's bins (or Zeiss or Leica for that matter). Wishing to update (dare I say upgrade?) my ageing Zeiss Dialyt 10x42 (ca. 1992) with its painfully narrow grooved and stiff focusing wheel, I read a number of reviews of contemporary models. The Swift 820 ED seems almost too good to be true given its price, especially boasting ED lenses, a feature currently only available on a handful of other highly priced binoculars. I was a bit reluctant at first to revert from the Zeiss roof prism to a porro model, but have to admit now that the former are a tad awkward to hold very still, and am looking forward to the new experience.
Rich
 
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I've had the ED versions of both the 804 and 820 (two different examples of the latter), and they are of course very similar. The 804ED, which is now almost impossible to find, has that built-like-a-tank feel, where the 820 is sleeker and lighter. The 820 is a very fine glass--it points naturally and the sweet spot is large, bright and very sharp. The color purity was everything I would have expected from an ED glass, simply natural. Edge sharpness is not great, but frankly I think tack-sharp edges are overrated--anything I want to see the details of goes involuntarily to the center of the FOV anyway. I would still own them if I had not begun to need glasses for distance astigmatism. Their eye relief is too short for comfortable use by eyeglass wearers and they have metal parts of the ocular mounts exposed which make me fear scratching my glasses. Also the 820 eyecup twists up but does not lock in place, which means it is forever collapsing down to the lens. A minor aggravation and one that could be remedied nicely with a couple of o-rings or some similar kludge.
 
Got 'em

Tom,
The 820EDs arrived just before I left home for a chemo cycle in a London hosptal, and they are a delight to use certainly from panning around the capital skyline. They have really cheered me up and are so much easier to hold and use than the old but more upmarket Zeiss roof prisms. Build quality seems fine for me......I need reading glasses but don't need specs for distance and so I don't use them for bins and therefore don't have the issues the previous poster highlighted. So if you are short sighted and need specs for bins it's obviously advisable for you to try them out before buying rather than take a chance like I did. Re the bridge durability issue, obviously too early to comment other than to say once you have them set right there's no need to move them except occasionally for another user. At this price (even cheaper for you in the States) you can't go wrong. Far better to me than spending 4x as much on a pair of non ED Swarovskis......you could buy an up market scope with the saving!
Rich
 
I bought a pair of Swift Audubon 8.5x44 ED a few weeks ago. While the optical quality is great, I found that they strained my eyes - I eventually worked out that my eyes are too far apart for these binoculars; they just don't open wide enough & I have to squint to see through them. I didn't realise that I had an abnormally wide eye base, although my older bins do have to be opened to their widest extent. The shop won't take them back, so now I have a pair of excellent quality bins that I can't use.
Anyone else have such problems, or is my head just too big?
David
 
Well, from your avatar's picture I would say your eyes are actually on either side of your head which my be a problem for using binoculars.

But on the off chance you are a human and not a Black-headed Gull (?) I would think this would be unlikely. The usual problem is IPD (interpupillary distance) is too small rather than too big.

So what is your IPD?

http://www.eyeglasslenses.com/content/knowledgebase/kb_framemeasurements.asp

You can measure it with a ruler and either a mirror or a digital camera (the latter is easier ... hold a ruler flat to your forehead and take a picture of your eyes then you can easily figure out how far apart your eyes are when viewing the image on a computer).

The best way is not to try to measure the centers (which aren't clearly marked) but to measure say leftmost edge of the left eye to leftmost edge of the right eye. If your eyes are dilated the same (i.e. uniform light, not a window on one side!) this will give the same number.

Alternatively if you wear prescription eyeglasses get your old prescription (or better itemized recipit) or call your optician and ask him.

I suspect you have some setup incorrect (focusing correctly? diopter set correctly? IPD set too wide or too narrow?) or perhaps the bins are exacerbating a small vision problem that perhaps needs correcting or the bins have a problem: out of collimation or have a focusing error in one barrel.
 
I would go back to the shop and try to work out a deal for some other model. Pay them a little extra. I do not know what you will find, as most porros and roof prisms in full size, 42mm, will go to 75mm ipd. My ipd is somewhere less than that, so never had a problem.

If the match is a problem the other way, your ipd is actually too small as Kevin suggests, there are a few models available.
 
Thanks for your replies - you are quite right, my inter-pupil distance is a modest 68mm. The problem does not lie there, but on the "clearance" between the two eyepieces. If I set the binoculars to my IPD, I can't get them anywhere near my eyes - there is a nose in the way. The distance between the eyepieces is 28mm maximum, while my previous Opticrons have about 30mm clearance and my old faithful Swift Ospreys were 31mm. The 2 or 3 mm makes all the difference. So, now I know that I don't have widely-spaced eyes...just a big nose ;)
I did take them back to the shop, they offered to buy then back from me at 66% of the price I paid them 3 weeks ago. I politely declined this less than generous offer. I wonder if there is a way to retro-fit narrower eyepieces...
David
 
Right. At an IPD setting of 68 mm the nose clearance is only 27 mm on the 820. Also, it's made of hard plastic that doesn't give a mm.

My strong suggestion is to abandon the dealer (as he has abandoned you) and appeal to the company directly. Swift products used to be distributed through Swift-Pyser, but I don't know if that's the case any longer. Either try to get your money back, or see of they will swap for another model that meets your needs.

From the Internet, look up Swift Optics International. The UK importer is (Voila!):

Pyser-SGI Limited
Fircroft Way Edenbridge Kent, TN8 6HA
Great Britain
Phone: 01732 864111
FAX: 01732 865544
www.pyser-sgi.com

Let's hear how it turns out.

Ed
PS. Be sure to put in a plug for your dealer (in the head) ;)
 
skatebirder said:
Thanks for your replies - you are quite right, my inter-pupil distance is a modest 68mm. The problem does not lie there, but on the "clearance" between the two eyepieces. If I set the binoculars to my IPD, I can't get them anywhere near my eyes - there is a nose in the way. The distance between the eyepieces is 28mm maximum, while my previous Opticrons have about 30mm clearance and my old faithful Swift Ospreys were 31mm. The 2 or 3 mm makes all the difference. So, now I know that I don't have widely-spaced eyes...just a big nose ;)
I did take them back to the shop, they offered to buy then back from me at 66% of the price I paid them 3 weeks ago. I politely declined this less than generous offer. I wonder if there is a way to retro-fit narrower eyepieces...
David
Click to expand...

So it's the beak not the eyes.

I think you suffer from the same problem Brocknroller suffers. If you search the forum for "Brocknroller swift" I think you'll find his story too.

http://birdforum.net/showpost.php?p=1232781&postcount=6

He also has a detailed post at cloudynights.com on the 820 and his facial features (and an avatar picture where you can see those features ;) ).

I suspect I might be a borderline suffer to ... I'm usually find the end of my nose collides with my thumb on some bins. But it's not hit the bridge yet.

That 33% restocking fee is pretty ungenerous of them. Do you care to say who it is so we can avoid them in the future?

I'm out of ideas though. You might get a better deal selling here. Or perhaps a private sale through a local birding club. Or you might get better trade in value elsewhere. Or try Swift's importers.

Bummer. Don't forget to mention the forum ... it might help.
 
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Thanks again. I had already emailed Pyser on Saturday - I hope for a response today. The dealer in question was London Camera Exchange - not a dealer I had expected to be in dispute with. I suppose I can see their point - they do not stock Swift normally, they ordered this pair for me, so their refunding policy may be much better on items they hold in stock.

I'll let you know what happens (maybe dad gets a nice pair of bins for Christmas!)

David
 
There are a few 8x28 models out there and quite a lot of 8x32s. The diameter of the eye cup is a little smaller on those.

Then there are the old porros, some still have rubber eye cups. I think, once you figure out the pair to sell or trade, you really need to see the bins in a store and try them out. Many stores carry lots of brands.
 
I've got some of the old porros - a pair of Swift Ospreys which are still optically superb, but a bit heavy and not waterproof. I went for the Audubons because I assumed that, being from the same manufacturer, they would be similar. You are right - I should have tried them out before buying - but I couldn't find any shops close by which had them in stock. I will know next time.
 
FWIW

The Vortex Fury series of binoculars has very thin eyepieces. I have no idea how they might be to locate where you are, but I'd about bet they'd work for you.
 
A happy ending

Steve C said:
FWIW

The Vortex Fury series of binoculars has very thin eyepieces. I have no idea how they might be to locate where you are, but I'd about bet they'd work for you.
Click to expand...

I returned my Swift Audubons to the shop again after asserting my consumer rights & they refunded 90% of the purchase price, which I was happy with. I traded them for a pair of Opticron Imagic BGA SE 8x42s, which I hope to try out later today. All the pairs I tried in the shop had a wider "nose-clearance" than the Audubons - I'm surprised that Swift haven't found this to be a problem before.

David
 
skatebirder said:
I returned my Swift Audubons to the shop again after asserting my consumer rights & they refunded 90% of the purchase price, which I was happy with. I traded them for a pair of Opticron Imagic BGA SE 8x42s, which I hope to try out later today. All the pairs I tried in the shop had a wider "nose-clearance" than the Audubons - I'm surprised that Swift haven't found this to be a problem before.

David
Click to expand...

David,

Did Pyser respond?

Ed
 
I have an opposite problem to skatebirder, who has eyes on either side of his head (LOL). I already have a pair of Vortex Stokes DLS 8X42 that I love, but I'm looking for something that both my girlfriend and I can use, and she has a rather narrow IPD of 54-55mm (I'm in the midrange at 61mm). I like the 820ED's for the wide FOV and claimed depth of field, and Swift says minimum IPD is 54.6mm, which would probably be close enough for her, but I wonder if this spec is realistic, especially in light of skatebirder's comments. I think I read elswhere in these pages that the 820's have large (sometimes referred to as HUGE) eyecups, and it sounds like this might be skatebirder's problem, and am afraid it might become her problem. Even if she did have a big nose, that doesn't seem like a good thing to say about your girlfriend, but in fact, she doesn't. But still, I wonder if with the 820's at minimum IPD (54.6mm), the eyecups would be so close as to leave no room even for her delicate little nose. I can't find a local dealer to try them on her nose. Any thoughts?
 
The one thing I did not like about the 820 I had was the enormus size of the ocular assembly. the objective covers for the x30mm Leupold Yosemite fit them fine. I have an average sort of face and have an IPD of 64mm or so. I found the ocular size annoying.
 
Kevin Purcell said:
So it's the beak not the eyes.

I think you suffer from the same problem Brocknroller suffers. If you search the forum for "Brocknroller swift" I think you'll find his story too.

http://birdforum.net/showpost.php?p=1232781&postcount=6

He also has a detailed post at cloudynights.com on the 820 and his facial features (and an avatar picture where you can see those features ;) ).

I suspect I might be a borderline suffer to ... I'm usually find the end of my nose collides with my thumb on some bins. But it's not hit the bridge yet.

That 33% restocking fee is pretty ungenerous of them. Do you care to say who it is so we can avoid them in the future?

I'm out of ideas though. You might get a better deal selling here. Or perhaps a private sale through a local birding club. Or you might get better trade in value elsewhere. Or try Swift's importers.

Bummer. Don't forget to mention the forum ... it might help.
Click to expand...

As Kevin pointed out, we Klingons have high-bridged noses, which prevent us from using human-made binoculars with very wide eyecups, but this same feature provides us with the advantage of stopping the back of a batliff from hitting our eyes (Klingons have some redundant organs, but eyes are not among them).

I wrote Swift and asked if they could take off the new, hard plastic cups and attach the old 804 fold down rubber eyecups, which fit my face splendidly, but this was beyond their ability to do.

The focuser rack also flexed a bit. It's not as sturdy as the older 804's.

Some quibbles about fit and finish, but the optics were fine.

"Try before you buy" is always wise advice, but with the Swift 820s, with their oversized, hard eyecups and short ER, this is mandatory if you have a high-bridged nose or deep-set eyes.

Barring the ability to try one, look for a store with a good return policy such as Eagle Optics.

If you find them unsuitable, consider a Promaster/Hawke/Zen Ray ED. You don't get the dramatic 3-D effect of porros, but the view is otherwise similar.

RICHAT - Sorry that you need chemo, but happy to hear that the 820 cheered you up. If you can get passed the eyecups (literally), the optics are a joy to behold.

Qapla'!

B'rock
 
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