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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

The new SX30 IS (1 Viewer)

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Agreed!

jogiba - any chance you could give some more details on the camera settings you are using and how you are processing the pictures.

Thanks

David
 
davids said:
Agreed!

jogiba - any chance you could give some more details on the camera settings you are using and how you are processing the pictures.

Thanks

David
Click to expand...
I have only posted my SX30 IS HD video links and the still photo links are from other SX30 IS users on the DPreview Canon forum. Many list their SX30 IS settings like in this link:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1010&message=36822747

The 35x optical power zoom works great for handheld HD video with the Canon 4.5 stop IS system:
http://vimeo.com/16040013


more SX30 IS bird shots from the Canon DPreview forum:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1010&message=36846392
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1010&message=36851957
 
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Hi guys! I breezed thru the thread and agree with much I gleaned from the posts. My history is with a Panny FZ50 & TCON-17 for about four years. I too think you need to use any camera a good while to learn for best advantage. At this point (about 3 weeks) of SX30 ownership I have a few opinions. Image quality is not as good as the FZ50. I PP everything and find the SX30's images are quite different in Photoshop and tho I feel I've got good results from some they still don't match the best I've done on FZ50 stuff. Experience is also needed for best PP results too. But, to me image quality is NOT all I value from a birder camera.

The SX30 with it's long reach is helping me ID birds much better than the Panny did. I use it with a red dot sight and shoot at fast flitting birds like a gunslinger. I whip the camera up put the dot on the spot in the bush I think the bird is half press the shutter wait til I feel it's auto focused finish the shutter push, hope I got lucky, and check the EVF to see what I got. Even if the bird is out of focus I usually have enough clues to ID it. Attached is an example of the elusive red crested kinglet that doesn't seem to sit still for a second. This is my third sighting. Now that I know they are around maybe someday I'll get a good photo of one ... with it's red crest displayed.

I gotta run now but will return with more examples and opinions.

Mark .... also known as Eagle_I on DPReview forums

Oh I got LUCKY on a BIF with it. Also attached is an American Crow
 

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Viddyog said:
I use it with a red dot sight and shoot at fast flitting birds like a gunslinger.
Click to expand...

Mark,

Could you post details / pics of your red dot sight setup? - sounds intriguing - I've never seen one on a bridge - I guess you're using the hot shoe as the base?

John
 
SX30 with Red dot sight

John

This is what I've been fairly successful with for BIF's. It still takes a LOT of luck, but the FZ50 does much better quickly locking focus. Sometimes (well many times) it's not correct focus, but when it is the rewards can be quite impressive. I modified the old style Photosolve mount for thumbscrew tightening and a no sharp edge custom fit ... put the sight to the front of the mount to help accommodate the baseball cap I frequently wear.

RDS on Panny FZ50 with TCON-17C 714mm equiv
http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/4623/fz50tcon17rds191du9.jpg


This link is to a post in DP Review showing the RDS on the SX30. I have yet to follow-up on the post mainly due to lack of success with it for BIF's The SX30 is too slow or indecisive and by the time it locks-in the bird is either long gone or all I get is a blur of it. I still value it highly for birds in the bush, fast moving boats, and the trout catching action photos I shoot of fishermen on the lake.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1010&message=36683864

Here's another link with some SX30 photos and comments about RDS.
Birds & Beasts Part 2
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1010&message=36824195
 
First RDS & home made mount

I'm going to put the RDS back on the Panny FZ50 see if I can find some cooperative flying birds and evaluate how it focuses and has done better for me for BIFs. So far with what I've tried with the SX30 has produced very little positive results.

If you are a bit handy with tools you can try RDS with very little expense. Walmart sells a couple models of cheap plastic sights for BB and pellet rifles and they work GREAT. The mount is the most important part. The best mount would hold the sight rock solid and in the exact same alignment every time it's inserted and tightened in the hot shoe. My first mount was home made from parts I got from a old 35mm collapsible fan reflector flashbulb attachment and a dovetail grooved .22 rifle, A Ruger 10/22, scope adapter rail. It let me put the RDS on the hot show but it was prone to getting knocked out of sight-in alignment with just a small bump. For a long reach telephoto with a small center spot for autofocusing the lens the alignment of the red dot to that center point is very important.

One of the techniques if it can be called that for using the RDS is to pre-focus on something you estimate to be the same distance as your target bird. I haven't had much luck getting the SX30 to focus on flying birds within the desired range for a quality photo. Now, I'm anticipating the flight of the target and pointing the camera at something it can quickly focus on that's at the same distance as the target bird. Once focus is set with a halfway shutter press I go back to panning with the bird and let loose a continuous burst until it's out of range.

There's branch close to my seed feeder that's free of obstruction, but the dang camera can't seem to focus on it. So by a little trial & error test shooting I found a nearby leaf that's the same distance and is a good focus target. So now I put the dot on it and half press then wait for a bird to land on the limb. Actually I don't put the dot on it but a little above it to compensate for parallax error because I sighted-in on a long distance target. For close shots you've got to learn to compensate.

Anyway, is there anything else you'd like to know? I'm running out of babble right now. ;)

Mark

I found these pics of my first RDS & mount
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/913/rdsscopeoncamerans3.jpg

Here's a simulated view
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/7100/rdsandviewfindercomposivl5.jpg

Where the shoe part came from
http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/2697/oldflashvv6.jpg

From my first evening with RDS
http://img452.imageshack.us/img452/4750/rdstconcompositelq3.jpgold
 
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Focus issues on branch.

Viddyog said:
I'm going to put the RDS back on the Panny FZ50 see if I can find some cooperative flying birds and evaluate how it focuses and has done better for me for BIFs. So far with what I've tried with the SX30 has produced very little positive results.

If you are a bit handy with tools you can try RDS with very little expense. Walmart sells a couple models of cheap plastic sights for BB and pellet rifles and they work GREAT. The mount is the most important part. The best mount would hold the sight rock solid and in the exact same alignment every time it's inserted and tightened in the hot shoe. My first mount was home made from parts I got from a old 35mm collapsible fan reflector flashbulb attachment and a dovetail grooved .22 rifle, A Ruger 10/22, scope adapter rail. It let me put the RDS on the hot show but it was prone to getting knocked out of sight-in alignment with just a small bump. For a long reach telephoto with a small center spot for autofocusing the lens the alignment of the red dot to that center point is very important.

One of the techniques if it can be called that for using the RDS is to pre-focus on something you estimate to be the same distance as your target bird. I haven't had much luck getting the SX30 to focus on flying birds within the desired range for a quality photo. Now, I'm anticipating the flight of the target and pointing the camera at something it can quickly focus on that's at the same distance as the target bird. Once focus is set with a halfway shutter press I go back to panning with the bird and let loose a continuous burst until it's out of range.

There's branch close to my seed feeder that's free of obstruction, but the dang camera can't seem to focus on it. So by a little trial & error test shooting I found a nearby leaf that's the same distance and is a good focus target. So now I put the dot on it and half press then wait for a bird to land on the limb. Actually I don't put the dot on it but a little above it to compensate for parallax error because I sighted-in on a long distance target. For close shots you've got to learn to compensate.

Anyway, is there anything else you'd like to know? I'm running out of babble right now. ;)

Mark

I found these pics of my first RDS & mount
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/913/rdsscopeoncamerans3.jpg

Here's a simulated view
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/7100/rdsandviewfindercomposivl5.jpg

Where the shoe part came from
http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/2697/oldflashvv6.jpg

From my first evening with RDS
http://img452.imageshack.us/img452/4750/rdstconcompositelq3.jpgold
Click to expand...

Hi Viddyog,

With regards to focus issues on the branch, why don't you try manual focus on the branch? I have the FZ100 and have found a couple of things that for some reason it won't focus on either. I have found the auto focus FZ100 very fast sometimes and at other times it "hunts", but its been good enough to get some birds in fight.

I'm attaching some images. The gull and swallow in flight were taken using autofocus. The swallow feeding its young was taken using preset manual focus. The young one was sitting on a bar and every now and then the parents would come and feed it, so all I had to do there was focus on the stationary bird and wait. One big advantage the FZ100 has over the Canon is the highburst rate and on both swalllow pictures I was using 40 frames per second. On the downside I can't say I'm thrilled with the image quality from the FZ100. I also have an FZ18 and I have better quality images from it than my newer camera, but I'm still experimenting to see if I can get better.
 

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Revised images of birds in flight

scodgerott said:
Hi Viddyog,

With regards to focus issues on the branch, why don't you try manual focus on the branch? I have the FZ100 and have found a couple of things that for some reason it won't focus on either. I have found the auto focus FZ100 very fast sometimes and at other times it "hunts", but its been good enough to get some birds in fight.

I'm attaching some images. The gull and swallow in flight were taken using autofocus. The swallow feeding its young was taken using preset manual focus. The young one was sitting on a bar and every now and then the parents would come and feed it, so all I had to do there was focus on the stationary bird and wait. One big advantage the FZ100 has over the Canon is the highburst rate and on both swalllow pictures I was using 40 frames per second. On the downside I can't say I'm thrilled with the image quality from the FZ100. I also have an FZ18 and I have better quality images from it than my newer camera, but I'm still experimenting to see if I can get better.
Click to expand...

After posting the images in my last post I realised that a couple of them are a bit small, so I'm adding two larger images, plus a shot of a dragonfly in flight, taken with auto focus set on macro and 40 frames/sec.
 

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As for manual focus I've been successful using that only once with the camera on a tripod. On the SX30 I have a couple issues with it's manual focus. First is, "I just don't get it!" when it comes to activating the little wheel mechanism that controls the focus distance. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. From a post I read from someone who had it better figured out there is a certain sequence (for lack of better description) that activates it properly and makes it usable. I just stumble around until it works or give up in frustration when it doesn't. Then when it does work the little "wheel" that's rotated to change distance takes a special touch I don't have. The "wheel" also doubles as a four way joystick like control too. Instead of rotating I manage to press too hard and that usually does something unintended like take it out of manual focus mode! I TRY to have fun with the camera so have little patience for that.

As for BIF's with my FZ50 I got quite confident I had a chance to get a few sharply focused shots every once in awhile. If I had an opportunity shooting a BIF with the RDS I took it and was sometimes surprised with excellent results. Well ... EXCEPT for swallows! I tried, but those little suckers are FAST! Too fast for the FZ50's autofocus so I'd pre-focus on a spot at a distance I'd guess they's fly at and then just try bursts (5 in abt 4 seconds I'd guess) as they passed. The ones I was lucky enough to capture within the frame seldom came close to focused. It was fun to try one afternoon as I don't have that opportunity often.

Your gull shot looks like late afternoon light. It's a time I like to be out with my camera, but usually my results with the weak orange glow light don't satisfy me. I like your shot tho ... GREAT! Also a GREAT action shot of the feeding on the fence rail. It's got nice subject separation with the out of focus background.

My FZ50 was limited to a 5 shot burst then I had to lift the shutter finger half press to get a new focus then shoot another 5. For BIFs or other bird in bush tracking shots I didn't string many of those together so 20 shots was the most I ever had to evaluate. With the SX30 I get continuous shooting at a rate of a little better than one per second. I've used that a few times now for sets of maybe up to 60. Although I have been able to pick out a few good captures from the bunch I find it very tedious going through them. 40 frames per second I'm sure has the special benefit of capturing just the right "pose" but FUN for me is not having to pick that shot out like a needle in a haystack.

Please tell me how your FZ100 frame rate is a benefit for you and how you handle the task of burst reviewing? I feel I'm missing out with a slow camera ... but am not sure how.

Mark
 
Burst rate

Viddyog said:
As for manual focus I've been successful using that only once with the camera on a tripod. On the SX30 I have a couple issues with it's manual focus. First is, "I just don't get it!" when it comes to activating the little wheel mechanism that controls the focus distance. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. From a post I read from someone who had it better figured out there is a certain sequence (for lack of better description) that activates it properly and makes it usable. I just stumble around until it works or give up in frustration when it doesn't. Then when it does work the little "wheel" that's rotated to change distance takes a special touch I don't have. The "wheel" also doubles as a four way joystick like control too. Instead of rotating I manage to press too hard and that usually does something unintended like take it out of manual focus mode! I TRY to have fun with the camera so have little patience for that.

As for BIF's with my FZ50 I got quite confident I had a chance to get a few sharply focused shots every once in awhile. If I had an opportunity shooting a BIF with the RDS I took it and was sometimes surprised with excellent results. Well ... EXCEPT for swallows! I tried, but those little suckers are FAST! Too fast for the FZ50's autofocus so I'd pre-focus on a spot at a distance I'd guess they's fly at and then just try bursts (5 in abt 4 seconds I'd guess) as they passed. The ones I was lucky enough to capture within the frame seldom came close to focused. It was fun to try one afternoon as I don't have that opportunity often.

Your gull shot looks like late afternoon light. It's a time I like to be out with my camera, but usually my results with the weak orange glow light don't satisfy me. I like your shot tho ... GREAT! Also a GREAT action shot of the feeding on the fence rail. It's got nice subject separation with the out of focus background.

My FZ50 was limited to a 5 shot burst then I had to lift the shutter finger half press to get a new focus then shoot another 5. For BIFs or other bird in bush tracking shots I didn't string many of those together so 20 shots was the most I ever had to evaluate. With the SX30 I get continuous shooting at a rate of a little better than one per second. I've used that a few times now for sets of maybe up to 60. Although I have been able to pick out a few good captures from the bunch I find it very tedious going through them. 40 frames per second I'm sure has the special benefit of capturing just the right "pose" but FUN for me is not having to pick that shot out like a needle in a haystack.

Please tell me how your FZ100 frame rate is a benefit for you and how you handle the task of burst reviewing? I feel I'm missing out with a slow camera ... but am not sure how.

Mark
Click to expand...

Hi Mark,

To begin with, I am used to taking video and bought the camera for its video capabilities, which include full manual adjustment of shutter speed and aperture. However, after getting the camera a couple of months ago I started looking at its burst rates. First of all I used the 11 frames/sec, which gives you a full sized image and then thought why not try the 40 or 60 frames/sec. The 40/sec reduces the file to 5mp and the 60 2.5, I think. The advantage of these rates is that you can squirt off shots in rapid fire at a faster rate than video with bigger file sizes. The disadvantage over video is that you only get a seconds burst, whereas you can leave the video running. Once you get to know some birds habits you can fire away and see what you get.
Like you, I find the post shot editing can take a while, as its easy to fire off hundreds of shots in a few seconds. I don't know of any easy way around that. The reward is that you sometimes find a pleasant surprise in all those shots. Also like you I have done plenty of pre-focusing at a point where I think the birds may fly to and like you haven't really had too much success. I still think its worth a try, especially if the birds are doing repetitive things. The swallows are one of the hardest birds to get as they never fly in a straight line. I just lucked out with the one I got, there was also another shot taken 1/40 of a second before that one, but the pose wasn't quite as good. I do think that the Canon lacking the high burst rates makes it difficult for BIF, but I feel it takes a better image than my FZ100. If it had higher burst rates it would be a winner.
By the way, I reckon the FZ50 was one of the best Panasonics they made. I'm really cross that in the later models they didn't keep the rotating zoom and focus rings on the lens barrel.
I've rambled on a bit here, so I hope I have answered your initial questions.
I'm attaching another image of the young swallow being fed by a parent. I just focused on the juvenile bird and waited, when I saw the parent coming in I started firing off shots and got a number off during the very quick feeding process, which is over in less than a second. In the sequence I took about 15 shots, but only 5 or 6 had both birds in them.
 

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I had a Canon S3 in 06 and took many shots in Florida, hawaii, Ecuador etc....sun or clouds. While I really like the idea of a super zoom camera and saving me of having to carry the weight of my 40D and 150-500mm or digiscoping equipment, the difference in quality between the latter and the former is huge. The S3--- or I am sure I can equally say, the SX30 (or panasonic) just isn't there. If you are new to cameras or just want a good ID shot, these work just fine.

But it seems like in all hobbies...we can all start out with relatively cheap and effective to a point equipment, but once you get more involved, you want better quality, more reach + quality etc etc (in the case of cameras).

Given the price of these superzooms....400-500$, sorry folks...but I am just not going to bite. If anything I can always return to my S3 with 5mp and teleconverter and come up with grainy ID-like images. But for now, I am comfortable birding with more quality, hence....DSLR + Lens or even my Swaro scope + S90 Canon.
 
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