Anyone else got a plan a and plan b trip? (1 Viewer)

[Andy Adcock]

I'm on plan c: Islay. I'm not going to see anything new on the wildlife front but it is an island that I've only every driven through. The last couple of years certainly not the 'Africa fest' I was hoping for.

I'm on plan C too, 'wait and C'.

There is nothing as a Brit, that can be booked with any certainty, if a country is on our green list, we may be on their red list and around we go again. Then there is there is the other factor at play, one which attempts to stymie us as every turn but at least it's predictable, 'SMM', Sturgeon, Macron and Merkel.

It really is, going to be the case that everyone needs to be vaccinated in order to be able to to what any of us want.

 

[jurek]

It really is, going to be the case that everyone needs to be vaccinated in order to be able to to what any of us want.

Don't expect that. There is already a discussion that vaccination is not sufficient. Immune response is short lived, new variants are coming, herd immunity cannot be reached etc. Classical shifting the goalposts.

Meanwhile in reality: the newest delta variant in Switzerland, despite all the travel bans and vaccinations, is already present in most sewage water. 6 months ago, the South African variant quickly spread, too, despite the travel ban which ruined my holiday. I hope governments quickly admit that travel restrictions simply don't work.

Singapore apparently given up on restrictions, and announced that covid will be treated as flu or any other endemic disease. I have some hope that example from abroad will force Western governments to admit a huge mistake.

Meanwhile, my strategy is to quickly do whatever is possible now, expect worse to come.

 

[Mysticete]

I'm on plan C too, 'wait and C'.

There is nothing as a Brit, that can be booked with any certainty, if a country is on our green list, we may be on their red list and around we go again. Then there is there is the other factor at play, one which attempts to stymie us as every turn but at least it's predictable, 'SMM', Sturgeon, Macron and Merkel.

It really is, going to be the case that everyone needs to be vaccinated in order to be able to to what any of us want.

Even the US? Might be a good time to fill holes in your NA list, given that things are basically fully open here. We've given up entirely on containment, and we will probably not reach herd immunity

 

[njlarsen]

Currently my plan is to wait for my second shot (another 4-8 weeks it seems) and then start to "C" what is possible.
Niels

 

[njlarsen]

Even the US? Might be a good time to fill holes in your NA list, given that things are basically fully open here. We've given up entirely on containment, and we will probably not reach herd immunity

I read things indicating that the states that voted in favor of Biden are likely to reach herd immunity with good vaccine uptake but that the states in favor of Trump are where the anti-vax crowds are too numerous?

Niels

 

[Andy Adcock]

Even the US? Might be a good time to fill holes in your NA list, given that things are basically fully open here. We've given up entirely on containment, and we will probably not reach herd immunity

Our Foreign and Commonwealth office advisory states....

The FCDO advises against all but essential travel to the whole of the US based on the current assessment of COVID-19 risks. However, the FCDO is not advising against all but essential travel to the Northern Mariana Islands, and the US Virgin Islands.​

The US is on our amber list which means.....................

Amber list countries and territories​

What you must do if you have been in an amber country or territory in the 10 days before you arrive in England.

You must follow these rules even if you have been vaccinated.

Before travel to England​

Before you travel to England you must:

• take a COVID-19 test
• book and pay for day 2 and day 8 COVID-19 travel tests – to be taken after arrival in England
• complete a passenger locator form

On arrival in England​

On arrival in England you must:

• quarantine at home or in the place you are staying for 10 days
• take a COVID-19 test on or before day 2 and on or after day 8

There is also the chance that any country on the amber list when you travel, could go red whilst you're there, this would lead to hotel jail on return home, for a ten day quarantine at your own expense, currently costing c£1700.

 

[Steve Babbs]

I've officially given up any hope of a foreign trip this year. Even if on the green list I couldn't face the insecurity: I had to leave France early last summer. I'm not feeling confident of any African trips next year and I feel my two gorilla permits will end up being a donation to the Uganda Wildlife Service. That might be the year for be to add bobcat and others to my list.

 

[DMW]

Even the US? Might be a good time to fill holes in your NA list, given that things are basically fully open here. We've given up entirely on containment, and we will probably not reach herd immunity

You do know that direct travel between the UK and US for British citizens has been banned since March 2020, and the ban remains in force?

 

[Andy Adcock]

You do know that direct travel between the UK and US for British citizens has been banned since March 2020, and the ban remains in force?

Indeed, I'd forgotten this, somehow assumed it to have been overturned.

Entry rules in response to coronavirus (COVID-19)​

Entry to USA​

Since 16 March 2020, it is not possible for most British nationals to enter the USA if they have been in the UK, Ireland, Schengen zone, Iran, Brazil, or China within the previous 14 days. On 30 January 2021, South Africa was added. Those arriving from outside these areas will need to get a visa or an Electronic System for Travel Authorisation (ESTA) visa waiver to enter or transit the USA as a visitor. You should consult the US State Department website to determine which you will need.

 

[Mysticete]

You do know that direct travel between the UK and US for British citizens has been banned since March 2020, and the ban remains in force?

Ahh...I assume it had lifted by now, since from the US side of things we clearly no longer give a #%$@ about COVID.

 

[Mysticete]

I read things indicating that the states that voted in favor of Biden are likely to reach herd immunity with good vaccine uptake but that the states in favor of Trump are where the anti-vax crowds are too numerous?

Niels

Well, overall vaccination rates are higher in blue areas, although at the state wide level it's more complicated. My state voted for Biden, but as a swing state our vaccination percentage we are not likely to rise much above 60% (it was 58% last I looked a few weeks ago). The silver lining is that the folks who won't vaccinate are also many of the folks who never took Covid seriously to begin with, and so potentially already have some degree of immunity from past infection. Also urban areas are more blue, and risk of spread is higher due to higher population density, so its more important that vaccination rates are higher amongst them. If the delta variant decides to weed out anti-vax folks, so be it, I just feel bad for those folks who can't get a vaccine due to health issues or age.

 

[Xenospiza]

The news I read today was that Astra-Zeneca, Pfizer and Moderna all protect for over a year. That's very good news.

The German policy is that anyone who travels to a "virus mutation zone" (i.e. UK, Portugal) must go into quarantine for 2 weeks on return, even if you are fully vaccinated. No other EU country is that strict (and the delta variant is everywhere already anyway), so I don't see how they think this is going to help with party people returning from e.g. Mallorca (no testing required).
Also, Australia shows that even a strict two week quarantine does not prevent outbreaks: only vaccination helps...

I will not travel until I am fully vaccinated (just to avoid the hassle with testing), but I fear that after the holidays more travel bans are looming. If they decide that I am suddenly in a "virus mutation zone" that would be highly annoying... (you usually have two days to scramble).

 

[DMW]

Ahh...I assume it had lifted by now, since from the US side of things we clearly no longer give a #%$@ about COVID.

Sadly not! I'd be more than happy to fill in some gaps in the US, but it's not looking like changing any time soon.

 

[lgonz1008]

Sadly not! I'd be more than happy to fill in some gaps in the US, but it's not looking like changing any time soon.

As usual the US is very "we choose what we follow and how". You can travel anywhere in the country if you're in the country with no restrictions and outside of the country it seems the airlines cares more for the negative Covid test when leaving the country over any airport test checking them.

Did a week in Montana, flew through 5 different airports, not once did they ask for vaccine cards or negative tests, they just cared you had a mask on 24/7.

 

[opisska]

I have bought tickets to Costa Rica on July 10 - the country is open and even though they have some "measures" they seem to generally not apply to foreigners so much. However I then realized I made a grave mistake by booking a flight through Germany, because they have taken the "variant scare" head on. Once per week they revise a list of "countries with variants" and if they put a country on that list, only German nationals and residents are allowed to enter from that country. Transit to a Schengen country counts as "entering Germany" and is explicitly forbidden. Top of the shelf selfish - if they declare Costa Rica "area with variants" while we will be there, we won't be able to come back. They happily rake in our money paid to Lufthansa and the airport fees for their large airports that are sucking in all transatlantic lines from smaller countries, but then they snap a finger and its "German nationals only".

Well, if this happens, I may have to live out my days in Costa Rica - looks like I could do worse, so why not.

 

[Xenospiza]

I have bought tickets to Costa Rica on July 10 - the country is open and even though they have some "measures" they seem to generally not apply to foreigners so much. However I then realized I made a grave mistake by booking a flight through Germany, because they have taken the "variant scare" head on. Once per week they revise a list of "countries with variants" and if they put a country on that list, only German nationals and residents are allowed to enter from that country. Transit to a Schengen country counts as "entering Germany" and is explicitly forbidden. Top of the shelf selfish - if they declare Costa Rica "area with variants" while we will be there, we won't be able to come back. They happily rake in our money paid to Lufthansa and the airport fees for their large airports that are sucking in all transatlantic lines from smaller countries, but then they snap a finger and its "German nationals only".

Well, if this happens, I may have to live out my days in Costa Rica - looks like I could do worse, so why not.

Yes, that's because they can (in principle) check if you are sticking to the two-week quarantine.
You should have flown through Amsterdam: the Dutch are unable to check for quarantine and have basically only advised it (which of course was completely disregarded).
Also, Schiphol is much nicer than Frankfurt.

 

[Andy Adcock]

I have bought tickets to Costa Rica on July 10 - the country is open and even though they have some "measures" they seem to generally not apply to foreigners so much. However I then realized I made a grave mistake by booking a flight through Germany, because they have taken the "variant scare" head on. Once per week they revise a list of "countries with variants" and if they put a country on that list, only German nationals and residents are allowed to enter from that country. Transit to a Schengen country counts as "entering Germany" and is explicitly forbidden. Top of the shelf selfish - if they declare Costa Rica "area with variants" while we will be there, we won't be able to come back. They happily rake in our money paid to Lufthansa and the airport fees for their large airports that are sucking in all transatlantic lines from smaller countries, but then they snap a finger and its "German nationals only".

Well, if this happens, I may have to live out my days in Costa Rica - looks like I could do worse, so why not.

Costa Rica is on the UK 'Red list', so don't transit back via the UK either.

 

[opisska]

Yes, that's because they can (in principle) check if you are sticking to the two-week quarantine.
You should have flown through Amsterdam: the Dutch are unable to check for quarantine and have basically only advised it (which of course was completely disregarded).
Also, Schiphol is much nicer than Frankfurt.

I just never expected that Germans will go even after transit passengers, it's just such a twisted abuse of power ... I have picked this connection because it was by far the fastest and I wanted to minimize our suffering through the masking obsession.

@andy: it's likely that today the Czech government will straight out ban Czech people from travelling to the UK anyway. Insanity everywhere!

 

[kb57]

The way things are heading, I don't think UK residents are going to be allowed to travel anywhere anytime soon. UK government, especially with Sajid Javid as the new health minister is determined to open up the economy despite the prevalence of the Delta variant, which is going to mean we get barred from travel to most other countries, especially those like Germany who are taking a more cautious approach. The key factor in UK has always been hospital admissions and whether NHS could cope, not infection rates or death rates - now we have high vaccination rates and few people are getting sick, they don't care how prevalent it is in the population. And if more people are forced to holiday at home then that is a positive thing for the economy.
I'm not saying this is wrong and I sympathise with Jan's point of view - once the population is largely vaccinated what is the point of restricting international travel for a virus which now appears to be no worse than a bad cold? The main problem I see is that a lot of people are still dying in parts of the world where vaccinations have yet to reach the bulk of the population, and it is in these areas that an 'epsilon' variant which may be more virulent might appear. Vaccinating the rest of the world should be top priority for richer developed nations.

 

[Jos Stratford]

I just never expected that Germans will go even after transit passengers, it's just such a twisted abuse of power ...

No abuse of power. If you are transiting at a German airport, you are not subject to the entry requirements of Germany itself, but of the destination country.

However, that is for non-Schegen transits - if you are changing flights between Schegen and non-Schegen cities, you need to leave the international transit area and thus do actually enter Germany and are therefore subject to the requirements they put in place.