Are Zen Rays 8x43 ED's really that good? (1 Viewer)

[falcondude]

dang it... I was hoping you also had an experience of the proverbial "self combustion" on those magnesium alloy binoculars, moondog. sorry, could not resist.

Having owned both alpha and the new ED glass, I feel like I am at this crossroad. My left brain told me that the alphas are way too expensive to justify the marginal gain, if any. But my right brain is telling me that I probably will get really upset if they ever lower the price, which means automatic depreciation of my alpha collections over the years. Sorry, for being a little selfish here.

 

[Veracocha]

Not the Zen-Ray's but Chinese all the same, I went out with my Hawke Frontier ED's today and.., well, I'll just copy what I posted earlier in another thread:-

I just came back from a local reserve where a company called in-focus were in attendance with a wide array of bins. I thought this was a chance to see whether my Frontier ED's were a decent purchase by putting them alongside some other marques. I heard a lot about Opticron BGA's which were on offer at £299. I have to say that they were a country mile form my Frontiers so my confidence grew a bit. I tried a few other Opticrons slightly less expensive and they were much the same. I plucked up the courage to look at a pair of Svarowski (sp) at around £1200 expecting to get the Hawke's spanked and I had to laugh , I could not tell the pair apart image-wise. I exagerate not, I came away with a massive smile thinking what quality can you get for £280 ?, well it seems quite a lot. I hope warranty doesn't become an issue but it seems I can afford another three pairs on top of these if it does!

 

[vkalia]

Erm, not to be the fly in the ointment/sand in vaseline, but... 2.5 turns to go from close to infinity? That's a lot and sounds like this would be a pretty painful bino to use when trying to follow various birds in a hunting party or searching for warblers in foliage.

Anyone use them in thick forest-type conditions and/or on fast-moving skulkers? How does that 2.5 turn focus hold up then?

Vandit

 

[rjwims]

Erm, not to be the fly in the ointment/sand in vaseline, but... 2.5 turns to go from close to infinity? That's a lot and sounds like this would be a pretty painful bino to use when trying to follow various birds in a hunting party or searching for warblers in foliage.

Anyone use them in thick forest-type conditions and/or on fast-moving skulkers? How does that 2.5 turn focus hold up then?

Vandit

I think that all the focus info spread throughout numerous threads needs to be consolidated and put into better perspective.

I just happened to be out looking at the wildlife in my 1.25 acre backyard, and I really do not mind the apparent slow focus of my ZR ED's.

First of all, whether it be the nice weather or that I have a very recently purchased set, the focus knob works VERY smoothly.

Secondly, I can change focus between 20 or 30' and 200 to 300' with around 1/4 turn of the focus knob.

Going from the 20' to full close up is a bit of a pain, but 30 to 300' with 1/4 turn seems very acceptable to my personal taste.

I watched a squirrel that was in a tree, about 20' away making a bunch of noise. It ran up and down the limbs, jumped thru 3 or 4 trees and ended up around 150 to 200' away. All the while , I could follow fairly easily and without ever having to reposition my index finger on the focus dial.

Plus, in my case, there is 1/2 turn or more beyond infinity that I can not use.

Very close up focus requires a lot more dial movement, but as stated above, 1/4 turn from 30 to 300' seems almost effortless and much quicker might be a bit too finicky, at least for me.

I suppose that if you need to change focus from 6' to 50', quick, fast and in a hurry, then these would seem quite slow

Richard

 

[Steve C]

Vandit,

The focus rate is something I'm pretty sure Zen Ray will change. But while 2 1/2 turns sounds horrendously slow, it is in reality not as bad as it sounds. You use up at least 1 3/4 turns going from close focus, which is about 5' out to 20'. then about 1/4 out from there to 30'. So that gives something like 1/2 turn from 30' on out. Butterfly watchers might not like it, but for birds much past 20' there does not seem to be a too slow issue. There is an excellent depth of focus when you get to 30'+, so you won't really use the wheel much.

 

[FrankD]

Ditto on the above comments. I really have not found the focusing rate to be an issue in practical use. For extreme close-up viewing maybe but most of my birding is done at 20 feet and beyond....heck, more like 60 feet and beyond. Also, as others have mentioned it isn't a full 2.5 turns from close focus to infinity. It is actually right around 2 turns which I do find to be manageable for most situations.

 

[vkalia]

Ok, great. Thanks for that. After my experience with the Razor 10x42s (great optics, lousy ergonomics), I am a bit hesitant to deal with slow-focusing binoculars. But 1/2 turn or so from 30' to infinity should be quite manageable.

I am just about to order a pair myself to replace my dearly-departed Viper. That 426' field of view is something that I am already drooling over....

Vandit "bring on the skulkers"

 

[Kevin Purcell]

Ok, great. Thanks for that. After my experience with the Razor 10x42s (great optics, lousy ergonomics), I am a bit hesitant to deal with slow-focusing binoculars. But 1/2 turn or so from 30' to infinity should be quite manageable.

I am just about to order a pair myself to replace my dearly-departed Viper. That 426' field of view is something that I am already drooling over....

Vandit "bring on the skulkers"

The 2.5 turns is the total focus range which includes both over and under-run (for hyperopes and myopes).

I found that for my standard range (3m to infinity) it took 1.25 turns. Slower than some bins I own but comparable to the Zeiss Victory 8x40 (1 turn for the same range). Others are a little quicker.

The 2m to 3m does take a lot of turning (it's slower closer too) so being in a forest or close to a target like a butterfly could get frustrating. But I've used them in temperate PNW forests and not had a problem.

So it's slower than ideal but not far off. I prefer if it was perhaps twice as quick (say 0.75 turn from 3m to infinity) with a big focus knob (about the size it has).

 

[vkalia]

Nah, I dont really look at butterflies - not with a bino anyway (macro lens is a different story). Typical viewing distances start at 3-4m, so by the sound of it, I should be good.

Just been trying to pay and the Paypal site seems to be down. Grrrr.

Edit - Paypal seems to be working again, the binos have been ordered. Wooha.

Incidentally, I had just resigned myself to getting Leicas - about the only mix of wide FoV, high quality optics and fast focus that I can try before buying. So you guys saved me about a grand. The first round is on me!

Vandit

 

[vkalia]

Ok, I just got back from a short trip and the Zen Rays were waiting for me.

Havent had a chance to look at anything useful with them but in terms of look and feel:
- they are much bigger than any other bino I own, including a Pentax 10x43
- weight is ok, however; they balance really well in my hands and I dont think I will have any problems holding them steady
- hard case is ok - probably more practical than a soft case
- locking diopter would be nice.

And in the completely irrelevant department - in the photos, these binos actually looked pretty fugly, but in reality, they arent so bad. I could do without the big ZEN ED on the focus wheel - something a little lower key would be nice, but whatever. Who really cares what these binos look like?

Tomorrow, I will do some testing with them.

Vandit

 

[FrankD]

I look forward to hearing your comments...and I liked the fugly reference......

...you don't hear that too often on here.

 

[James Bean]

"Who really cares what these binos look like?". Actually, I do. Although optical quality is the paramount consideration, indeed the raison d'etre, of a decent binocular, 'cosmetics' can be important. Don't misunderstand me, I think the Zen (from the pictures I've seen) is quite attractive, but I prefer the looks of its cousin, the Hawke 8x43ED Frontier. It's all very subjective, I know, and I'm not looking for an argument, just giving my opinion. Some binoculars, quite frankly, are ugly, or have garish graphics/decoration/colours. On first seeing the Hawke advertised on the internet, I was apprehensive about the 'bright green' version, but when it arrived I was relieved to find it was a tasteful slate green. I don't tote a binocular as 'male jewellery' ('jewelry' USA) but I wouldn't want other people to think I have no taste. There's too much 'bling' these days in the design of all sorts of things and we seem to be losing the art of subtlety and understatement. The old svelte Leica Trinovids were probably the pinnacle of design elegance, with modest/minimal logo and graphics, maybe matched by the Zeiss Dialyt/ClassiC range, and that tradition still survives with Zeiss and Leica today and, I suppose, Swarovski (bearing in mind so many other makers have 'emulated' their styling). But I'll stop being 'grumpy', and bow out by contrasting the Zeiss Conquest (plain & simple, quietly competent) and Hawke Frontier (a good styling effort, but detailing just a mite 'fussy')... or is it me who's a mite fussy?

 

[rjwims]

I don't know if the prices have changed much in the last couple of weeks, but while I am not overly impressed with the RED letters on the ZR's, I couldn't see myself wanting to pay around $100 more for the Hawkes.

Some see the ZR's as a slight improvement over the Hawkes (optically). While I cannot comment on that, I can say that I do like my ZR's.

If they were identically priced, I would still choose the ZR's....

JMO others will disagree I'm sure....

Richard

 

[falcondude]

The images on zen-ray's website make ZEN ED look "fatter" or "bulkier" than it actually is. Why do they do that?:-C

When having it in hand, it is quite pleasing to just stare at it. Everything is perfect in proportion. I like the large focus wheel with the gray ribbed edge that is in good contrast with black background. I was initially comprehensive about the stippled pattern on the side, worrying it might hurt my palm with sharp edge. It turns out they are all rounded dots with smooth surface, doing no harm other than providing better handling. I like the packing box too, simple and elegant.

 

[vkalia]

Frank - "fugly" is one of the most useful additions to the English vocabulary, IMO: capable of expressing a depth of feeling that "very ugly" or other versions can only dream of

James - I actually agree with you that understated elegance is quite nice to have. I like the Ultravids in that department.

However, if a $350 bino offers optical performance in the alpha league, dealing with a less "classy" look is a tradeoff I am happy to make.

These binos don't look as bling as the photos make them out to be (except for the lettering on the focus wheel). The tradeoffs are exactly where I want them to be: in non-essential areas.

I leave on Sunday for a 4-day birding trip to my favorite area - the Himalayas. Will post my comments when back.

Vandit

 

[Tero]

Yes, I like the much more modest looks of the Promasters. A gray pieceof optics.

Still ugly, but nobody will notice them.

 

[falcondude]

I leave on Sunday for a 4-day birding trip to my favorite area - the Himalayas. Will post my comments when back.

Vandit

Himalaya? That's way cool. What's the elevation are we talking about? There is another thread talking about elevation impact on sealed binoculars. Maybe you can chime in on that topic.

 

[vkalia]

This time, not very high - approx 1500m or so. I'm building a little cottage in the Himalayan foothills, overlooking Corbett NP and its 530+ bird species, and a week ago, a leopard killed an old woman a few hundred meters away. It is still at large... so it will be a birding + leopard spotting trip

As for elevation impact - I've taken my binos up to 5500m while hiking & photographing, and havent had a problem... atleast none that I have noticed.

Vandit

 

[ceasar]

.............................................................

As for elevation impact - I've taken my binos up to 5500m while hiking & photographing, and havent had a problem... atleast none that I have noticed.

Vandit

Just an observation, but at 16,000 feet+ or -, I think there would be more impact on the user than on the binocular!:eek!:
Bob

 

[vkalia]

Just an observation, but at 16,000 feet+ or -, I think there would be more impact on the user than on the binocular!:eek!:
Bob

Maybe that's why I havent noticed... too busy gasping for air

Vandit