Dragonfly id please (1 Viewer)

[bristolbirder]

Can anyone identify this one please? Taken in my garden yesterday, it's probably quite a common species but my dragonfly identification skills are rather limited!

Many thanks.

 

[bristolbirder]

I'll try again!

Has the image appeared this time?

 

[CJW]

Hi Bristolbirder, it looks like a teneral male Southern Hawker. Nice photo. The large, yellow, 'nail' mark on the 1st segment is fairly diagnostic.

 

[bristolbirder]

Thanks CJW. What is their distibution in the UK? Are they only found in the south as the name implies?

 

[Karl J]

Saw one of these earlier this morning, a newly emerged one with its wings still all shiny.

According to my book they're common throughout most of England ..... the british dragonfly society website might have more

 

[Karl J]

sorry should have put this link in -- http://www.dragonflysoc.org.uk/

 

[Richard]

Hi Colin (CTW),

Why do you say that is a teneral male? I am no expert but I would have said it was a female Southern Hawker but I don't know how they differe from teneral males.

Richard

 

[Surreybirder]

I think the bluish colouration of the rear abdominal segments would only be shown by an immature male.
Nice photo, Richard... :clap:

I don't know if it helps but I've posted a female HERE
Ken

 

[cjay]

Yes I can confirm it is a fine Southern hawker. I don't think the sex really matters.

CJ

 

[Richard]

My thanks to Surreybirder and Colin,

Actually, that one wasn't mine but the one below is

I try to get pictures of both sexes as part a my local patch portfolio.

I have labelled it as female but there is a slight bluish colouration of the spots towards the end of the abdomen. Difficult to see at low res though. Is this this the only 'macro' way of telling sexes apart?

Richard

 

[cjay]

Ok lets get into the sex of this dragonfly. The blue segments & the end of the abdomen clearly identifies this as a male. But that depends as previuosly mentioned on the hues of the photgraph.

Although it does not show it on this photograph it should have a small pointed "Willy" between the claspers. A female has lime or pale green final segments & there should be a small rounded, well you know what !between her claspers.

The Dragonflies of Great Britian & Ireland by Cyril Hammond FRES shows these features clearly & I would advise anyone interested in Odonata to purchase one.

the ISBN iso-946589-14-3.
Colin.

 

[CJW]

Hi Richard, this one looks more like a Migrant Hawker to me.

 

[Surreybirder]

I'm at work (so no guide book) but I'm pretty confident it's a male southern hawker. The antehumeral stripes (on top of the thorax) are almost invisible on a migrant hawker.

 

[cjay]

I disagree. look at the thorax you can clearly see the green ovals on the top & the black tipped yellow "nose" Also the triangle reaches doen to almost the bottom of the first segment. In Migrant it is much shorter. Also the blue markings are much clearer.

Are you just playing Devils advocate?

CJ

 

[CJW]

I know what you mean (I'm in work aswell), I was just looking at the colours of the spotting - shouldn't only the last few segments be spotted blue (with the rest being greenish) and not the entire abdomen?) - and the very narrow-looking 'nail mark' on the thorax......
I think I'll give up with this dragonfly mallarky and concentrate on moths and birds!!

 

[Richard Ford]

I think I'll give up with this dragonfly mallarky and concentrate on moths and birds!!

Moths…. You have got to be kindin’. B
I know nothing about them, but the shear number of species (thousands) has to be more daunting than a few dozen possible Dragonflies….
Rich

 

[CJW]

I've been doing the moths a lot longer though Rich'. I find them fairly straightforward (there's always exceptions, like everything else). But most of them tend to sit nicely and let me i.d. them. And if they won't sit still, I bang 'em in the fridge.....

 

[cjay]

I think I have added enough now. I will be letting this thread go.

 

[Surreybirder]

None of the groups that I've looked at seem as difficult as hoverflies--to me at least! There's only about 45 Odonata in the UK (4,500 in the world?) compared with umpteen spiders, beetles, diptera, etc.

 

[steve covey]

Richard,
Your photo is definately of a female Southern Hawker. It's a Southern Hawker because each of the final pairs of spots are 'fused' together into one 'blob' - in Migrant they would be distinct pairs of dots. As for the colour, over the past couple of years there have been increased sightings of female Southerns with male blue colouration. As Colin says, a 'willy' should be visible if it was a male even on this size pic.
HTH.
Steve.