Gull in Madeira: presumed very pale atlantis (1 Viewer)

[screaming piha]

I think this is 'just' a very pale atlantis Yellow-legged Gull, but it stood out from the crowd. I thought some of the gullophiles might like a look.

Any comments?

 

[JANJ]

Hi jdj.

Interesting gull, wonder if taken recently? Taken in Madeira is not necessarily atlantis and this one looks perhaps to pale, although depending if bleached., maybe the so called 'Cantábrican' (L. michahellis lusitanius, north-western Spain, from the Bascue - Cantásbrican region and possible to Asturias) which is more Herring Gull like in structure.
It further looks like a late 2cy, or if taken recently (which I guess it is due to the state of the worn and bleached primaries) a 3cy with retained juvenile primaries, that is to say it looks like an advanced 2cy if taken recently. Moult is highly variable in YLG and some are more advanced than others and there might be some differences in moult pace between michahellis and atlantis and other possible ssp of YLG.

Check some of Dick Newells gulls from Portugal here:

http://www.magikbirds.com/image.asp?title_id=175&show_thumbnails=False

and these - known ages:

http://www.mallorcaweb.net/gavines/edat gavines_conjunt.htm

Reasons to get back to this, but lets see what others might say.
Any more images?

JanJ

 

[Hugo Romano]

Hi Jdj,
When was taken your photo? In Madeira we get a some variatey in subpecies. Most of the time it presumed that all YLG are atlantis, thought this is not standard. All close look may reveal interesting records.

This winter we had some interesting Gull records, have a look:
http://www.madeirabirds.com/last_week_visitors_madeira_nature
http://www.madeirabirds.com/birds_visit_madeira_new_years

Regards

Hugo
--
Madeira Birds

 

[DEREK CHARLES]

Hello everyone,
While in Maderia July two years ago i only had one pale mantled YLG among 500 or so "Atlantis" types at Funchal harbour. It was considerably paler than the other birds present and similar to birds i have seen in Southern Spian. It was in heavy moult so may have just been a pale Atlantis.

Derek

 

[screaming piha]

I took the photos two weeks ago. I first thought Herring Gull because of the pale colour, but the structure and patterning (including bill pattern) matched the typical local birds so closely that it seemed on second look to be an extremely pale atlantis. I don't know of any difference between the feather pattern of mainland Yellow-legged and atlantis.

I have other photos of the bird, but I don't think they add anything (no open winged shots). I missed the bird flying as I was taking photos of a Ring-billed Gull.

Hugo: I also saw Ring-billed Gull and Greater Black-backed Gull.

John

 

[JANJ]

It has been recomended that only those from Azores are true atlantis and that many of the ones from Madeira and Canary Island are paler and closer to michahellis, perhaps like Dereks gulls, with some individuals looking darker (like LBBG graellsii) - those showing characters of atlantis, such as darker upperparts in adults, with more black on wing tip, and the more or less Lesser Black-backed look alike juveniles, first winters and older birds. More restricted post juvenile covert moult in atlantis.

Some examples here:

http://www.pbase.com/dophoto/grealeatlantis&page=all

http://www.martinreid.com/Gull website/atlainx.html

Note the short legs:

http://www.netfugl.dk/pictures.php?id=showpicture&picture_id=5327

JanJ