How long before a premium Chinese binocular? (2 Viewers)

[opticoholic]

Alot of stuff is MADE in China but the brain power and engineering comes from the USA. The Ipad and Ipod are are designed by Apple in California. That's where the brains are located. Not in China. The only thing that happens in China is a bunch of $2.00 an hour drones put them together doing something that anybody off the street could do. It doesn't take a mental giant to design a torch either like it does to design an operating system for an Ipad . The technology comes from the USA and the low payed labor is supplied by China.

My goodness Dennis. That statement suggests that you think the Chinese are a bunch of dolts! Don't forget the Chinese are smart enough to consistently score way higher on tests than students in the United States, and they are the dummies to whom the United States owes a considerable share of our national debt. If millions of Chinese work in low wage jobs, I for one do not conclude it is because they lack brains. A little respect, please.

--Dave

 

[eddy the eagle]

Low wages are all relative,when you earn as little as 10$ a week and can survive quite happily as a subsistance farmer earning 2$ an hour in a factory is like a godsend.It is the cost of living that determines how much you need to earn.That is nothing to do with brains and don´t forget that the chinese invented nearly everything long before the Americas were populated.

 

[Newbflat]

That is nothing to do with brains and don´t forget that the chinese invented nearly everything long before the Americas were populated.

:t:

 

[Dennis Mau]

My goodness Dennis. That statement suggests that you think the Chinese are a bunch of dolts! Don't forget the Chinese are smart enough to consistently score way higher on tests than students in the United States, and they are the dummies to whom the United States owes a considerable share of our national debt. If millions of Chinese work in low wage jobs, I for one do not conclude it is because they lack brains. A little respect, please.

--Dave

True. I am not saying the Chinese are not smart people I just resent the fact that they are given the credit for the Ipod and the Ipad. All they do is put them together. The PC was invented in the USA even though most are built elsewhere now. The USA was built by innovation. Who build the first automobiles with the first assembly line? Henry Ford. The list goes on and on. We have always been the innovators but sadly that is where we are starting to slip. That is a big reason our economy is in the dumper. We owe most of our national debt to China because they produce everything.

 

[Leif]

Alot of stuff is MADE in China but the brain power and engineering comes from the USA for the Ipad. The Ipad and Ipod are are designed by Apple in California. That's where the brains for the Ipad are located. Not in China. The only thing that happens in China with the Ipad is a bunch of $2.00 an hour drones put them together doing something that anybody off the street could do. It doesn't take a mental giant to design a torch either like it does to design an operating system for an Ipad . The technology comes from the USA and the low payed labor is supplied by China on alot of things.

You sound like a chauvinist, to put it politely.

"China registered the most patent applications globally last year, leading the world in an indicator that the United Nations intellectual property (IP) agency uses to measure innovation."

http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=43744&Cr=intellectual+property&Cr1=#.UPkU0_JrQaM

 

[Binastro]

I don't think the U.S. built the first automobile, maybe it was German or French? and for the population size the British probably have more firsts than the U.S, except idiotically we gave much of it free to the U.S., who then claimed they invented it.

The U.S. did however capitalise on mass production, although some of this was initiated in Britain.

China has until recently pinched a lot of technology from others but are now at the stage where they can innovate.

 

[Troubador]

True. I am not saying the Chinese are not smart people I just resent the fact that they are given the credit for the Ipod and the Ipad. All they do is put them together. The PC was invented in the USA even though most are built elsewhere now. The USA was built by innovation. Who build the first automobiles with the first assembly line? Henry Ford. The list goes on and on. We have always been the innovators but sadly that is where we are starting to slip. That is a big reason our economy is in the dumper. We owe most of our national debt to China because they produce everything.

Denis

When do you think the USA will design and build an alpha pair of bins?

Lee

 

[Giorgio]

Alot of stuff is MADE in China but the brain power and engineering comes from the USA for the Ipad. The Ipad and Ipod are are designed by Apple in California. That's where the brains for the Ipad are located. Not in China. The only thing that happens in China with the Ipad is a bunch of $2.00 an hour drones put them together doing something that anybody off the street could do. It doesn't take a mental giant to design a torch either like it does to design an operating system for an Ipad . The technology comes from the USA and the low payed labor is supplied by China on alot of things.

What about China strategy would be to only copy what the US do?
As they know that US create loads of profitable ideas, and as they also know that they can copy very fast these ideas, why would they try to create ideas, as it's much more profitable and fast to only copy ideas and sell stuff?
That could be their main strategy, and i assume it is.
China does not create that much because their economy rests upon copying, making and selling + stealing projects.

 

[Troubador]

Denis

When do you think the USA will design and build an alpha pair of bins?

Lee

Hello Denis, where are you??????

Lee

 

[joe101]

Hello Denis, where are you??????

Lee

Are you kidding you actually want him to reply ?
I would have thought that question was rhetorical , I think most people here know that the US cannot produce a Bin that willl be able to complete which the Germans or the Japs. They do not really produce precision optics other than the aerospace industry.
And guys please do not bring up the leupold gold rings, their view maybe alpha but the weight and size for the x32 are almost a x42 , they do not count.

 

[Chosun Juan]

What about China strategy would be to only copy what the US do?
As they know that US create loads of profitable ideas, and as they also know that they can copy very fast these ideas, why would they try to create ideas, as it's much more profitable and fast to only copy ideas and sell stuff?
That could be their main strategy, and i assume it is.
China does not create that much because their economy rests upon copying, making and selling + stealing projects.

Giorgio Trust the French! to just come right out and say it :t:


Chosun :gh:

 

[jan van daalen]

Are you kidding you actually want him to reply ?
I would have thought that question was rhetorical , I think most people here know that the US cannot produce a Bin that willl be able to complete which the Germans or the Japs. They do not really produce precision optics other than the aerospace industry.
And guys please do not bring up the leupold gold rings, their view maybe alpha but the weight and size for the x32 are almost a x42 , they do not count.

I was in the US two years ago on a binocular convention and thought it would be wise to take the opportunity to visit the Leupold plant, since the Dutch Leupold rep. tried to get us to sell that brand and I wanted to see with my own eyes how they are made. Only, I wasn't welcome at the plant.
Later on (on the convention) I found out, they only assemble from different Chinese/Japanese made optics, so there was not so much to see.
But some models are quite good. If an Chinese optic factory should buy that brand and would only produce Leupold brand optics, in time we could experience a Chinese alpha.

Jan

 

[ceasar]

It has been common knowledge here (on this particular internet site anyway) for many years that Leupold only did assembly (and repairs) in their US plant. I don't understand why the Leupold rep didn't make that clear to you.

Bob

 

[jan van daalen]

Bob,

To be frank, most optic reps don't even know what a phase coating is, or the difference between a porro and a roof design.
So, no. He didn't tell me and at that time I thought they made some models back home because of the Proudly Made in the USA label.
Jan

 

[Dennis Mau]

Hello Denis, where are you??????

Lee

China can't build an alpha binocular for the same reason they can't build a Ferrari, Mercedes, or Porsche. They have no history like Swarovski or Zeiss or Leica. Swarovski and Zeiss have been making binoculars for 80 years! The big three have way more experience than China. All China does is copy. The USA has never been big on binoculars. We do make some nice optics in telescopes like Astrophysics but not a lot. A Swarovski is like a Ferrari and a Chinese binocular is like a Hyundai. I will take the Ferrari. The ONLY reason people buy Chinese is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. They don't have enough to buy alpha.

 

[Steve C]

Dennis, that is only partly true. Sure some do buy only on price. I have been able several times to purchase an alpha. I did not, only because I personally could not see where the gain justified the cost. Certainly there are those who disagree with me and I'm fine with that. I was raised to make $$ go as far as they could. I will probably always be that way.

I started in my binocular searching seeking to find if I was going Leica or Zeiss. Wound up looking at a Pentax DCF WP and swerved into the bang for the buck binoculars.

I do not like or recommend things such as Zen Ray because they are Chinese. I am drawn there due to the degree of value they offer. They have gone from Toys R Us level to the ZEN Prime HD. They will advance past this point too.

The ZEN Prime HD is damned close to premium now. I'd like to see what Charles could come up with if he decided to produce a binocular that was targeted to sell at $1,200. He'd have a premium Chinese binocular that nobody would buy because of the perception people have of things Chinese.

 

[Giorgio]

Dennis, that is only partly true. Sure some do buy only on price. I have been able several times to purchase an alpha. I did not, only because I personally could not see where the gain justified the cost.

I totally agree with what you say.
Although my funds allow me to get alphas, i never could see the need of having a 2500$ pair of bins. I'm not an avid birder, my job or activities do not recquire having a monster pair, that's why i'm plenty satisfied with an habicht with its old design cons, and with some Nikon action VII and EX.
When you get an alpha, the pros are more the finitions, solid housings, warranties. You can find in some chinese almost the same optics, with a 5% difference only. But the mecanics could fail at any moment.
Dennis, you are right that chinese roofs can help some people who don't have deep pockets getting a decent optical quality.

 

[Dennis Mau]

Dennis, that is only partly true. Sure some do buy only on price. I have been able several times to purchase an alpha. I did not, only because I personally could not see where the gain justified the cost. Certainly there are those who disagree with me and I'm fine with that. I was raised to make $$ go as far as they could. I will probably always be that way.

I started in my binocular searching seeking to find if I was going Leica or Zeiss. Wound up looking at a Pentax DCF WP and swerved into the bang for the buck binoculars.

I do not like or recommend things such as Zen Ray because they are Chinese. I am drawn there due to the degree of value they offer. They have gone from Toys R Us level to the ZEN Prime HD. They will advance past this point too.

The ZEN Prime HD is damned close to premium now. I'd like to see what Charles could come up with if he decided to produce a binocular that was targeted to sell at $1,200. He'd have a premium Chinese binocular that nobody would buy because of the perception people have of things Chinese.

The ZEN Prime HD is a "Poor Man's Swarovision". If Swarvoski suddenly said we have a new trade in program for Zen Prime HD owners. You can send your ZEN Prime HD into us and we will send you a brand new Swarovision at no cost to you. How many do you think would do it? Right 100%. The Chinese binoculars are all about price. People buy them because they are CHEAPER! Everybody knows a Swarovision is better they just can't afford them and saying you don't WANT to spend that much is the same thing. Oh I just don't use them enough to warrant a Swarovision. If you use them at ALL and you have the money why not have the BEST when you use them IF you can afford them.

 

[Leif]

The ZEN Prime HD is a "Poor Man's Swarovision". If Swarvoski suddenly said we have a new trade in program for Zen Prime HD owners. You can send your ZEN Prime HD into us and we will send you a brand new Swarovision at no cost to you. How many do you think would do it? Right 100%. The Chinese binoculars are all about price. People buy them because they are CHEAPER! Everybody knows a Swarovision is better they just can't afford them and saying you don't WANT to spend that much is the same thing. Oh I just don't use them enough to warrant a Swarovision. If you use them at ALL and you have the money why not have the BEST when you use them IF you can afford them.

I suggest we rename you as Sherlock. |=)|

 

[Giorgio]

The ZEN Prime HD is a "Poor Man's Swarovision". If Swarvoski suddenly said we have a new trade in program for Zen Prime HD owners. You can send your ZEN Prime HD into us and we will send you a brand new Swarovision at no cost to you. How many do you think would do it? Right 100%. The Chinese binoculars are all about price. People buy them because they are CHEAPER! Everybody knows a Swarovision is better they just can't afford them and saying you don't WANT to spend that much is the same thing. Oh I just don't use them enough to warrant a Swarovision. If you use them at ALL and you have the money why not have the BEST when you use them IF you can afford them.

Dennis,

You need to understand that not everybody reacts like you with optics.
You are an opticolic and want (and need) the best. Ok with this.
Not everyone needs the absolute best if they use the binoculars once per week during 1 hour.
What about my month paycheques allow me buying 3 Swarovisions / month if i spend my whole wages in optics, and my top bin is a 700 € Habicht?
You'll never know about my wages, but imagine, if it would be the case.
Not everyone want to put 2500$ in a pair of binoculars.
All is about life objects priorities, i prefer to spend my $ with other stuff maybe. Perhaps having an alpha car + an alpha house is better than having an alpha pair of bins? ^^

Gio