Is a good view predictable? (2 Viewers)

[Maljunulo]

You're welcome, but there is no paper. It was a too-subtle way to suggest that I've known about significant figures for decades. In my "1.633" inches, "1.63" are significant, but since I used three figures past the decimal point in 2016 and was going to subtract them I allowed a non-significant figure creep in by measuring four times and taking the mean of the figures to achieve "1.633." Pardon me - I'll stay significant after this.

I am quite dense, so subtle doesn’t work well with me.

Sorry to miss the point.

 

[pshute]

Six years ago I bought a pair of Zeiss 8x42 Victory SF with, IIRC, 18mm eye relief, and could not get a view without blackouts (or possibly other issues). I phoned either Zeiss or the retailer about the issue and they sent me a replacement set of eyepieces, longer by 3mm, that had three clicks. These are perfect; middle position with eyeglasses, fully out without eyeglasses. They are perfect for me, weight aside.

Is it possible to at least predict blackout from the specs? It seems to be mostly to do with matching eye separation, but requires more exact placement if there's too much relief for the eycup setting.

I noticed that some people mentioned preferring that the edge of the view isn't noticeable, yet I find that being able to see it clearly helps with placement and getting the separation right.

 

[Maljunulo]

Is it possible to at least predict blackout from the specs? It seems to be mostly to do with matching eye separation, but requires more exact placement if there's too much relief for the eycup setting.

I do not believe that it is.

 

[Scott98]

Is it possible to at least predict blackout from the specs? It seems to be mostly to do with matching eye separation, but requires more exact placement if there's too much relief for the eycup setting.

No, it isn't, but larger eye-relief models generally do better with eye placement - meaning lower power for a given aperture is usually better. Wider-field designs generally have more trouble. But not always! And there's absolutely no way to predict if the eyecup height will be good or not, you just have to try them.

Although reading peoples' comments is helpful, their experience may not match your own, but if you see red flags or complaints there's usually substance to them, in my experience.

 

[tenex]

Again, IIRC, there was some concern that Eagle was using the alpha yearly product briefing to retailers to help with its own product positioning

I don't understand that, can you explain? I always wondered why they closed, being very helpful to deal with.

 

[Jaywalk]

I don't understand that, can you explain? I always wondered why they closed, being very helpful to deal with.

Sorry, I can't. Anything I can add at this point without additional citations/sources would place me squarely within the aluminum foil hat brigade. In fact, I regret adding the comment at all and withdraw it.

 

[Scott98]

No, it isn't, but larger eye-relief models generally do better with eye placement - meaning lower power for a given aperture is usually better.

ooops....I meant larger "exit pupil" not eye relief.....just in case anyone actually reads this. But more eye relief is always good too....

 

[Paultricounty]

LMAO.

 

[Swedpat]

I like alpha glass but I've come to understand that my real preference is for a really good view. Can I know before buying whether any given set of bins has a great view, perhaps from just knowing eye relief or some other factor?

Six years ago I bought a pair of Zeiss 8x42 Victory SF with, IIRC, 18mm eye relief, and could not get a view without blackouts (or possibly other issues). I phoned either Zeiss or the retailer about the issue and they sent me a replacement set of eyepieces, longer by 3mm, that had three clicks. These are perfect; middle position with eyeglasses, fully out without eyeglasses. They are perfect for me, weight aside.

I don't insist on the next bins being Zeiss, but for simplicity's sake, shall I assume that in my next lighter-weight Zeiss bins that 18mm eye relief won't work for me and will have to be compensated for in some way? Can I know in advance if the next set of bins will have a "great view?" Can I also assume that 18mm eye relief in some other brand equally won't work for me?

The Zeiss SF and the Nikon 8x32 Superior E both work fine for me. A 15-year-old set of Minox roofs works okay, while a Leupold Yosemite 6x30 (similar to Kowa YF) works a little less well.

Also, I don't really understand the "view" terminology I see discussed, e.g. "great view," "fully immersive," possibly "disappearing" binoculars, etc. Perhaps as a start someone can explain them, please? I think I understand the issue but it's best to be sure.

I am late to reply in this thread and maybe I have not much important to say which is not already said. But: there are several factors included who cannot be simply be used as a direct comparison between different binoculars. The same specs for one model often cannot be compared to another model with same specs.
For example eye relief when using eyeglasses. Different binoculars can have same true ER. But the useable ER can differ depending on the eyepiece design. A certain binocular with 16mm ER works good with eyeglasses while another with 20mm ER does not work good. The latter model has an eyepiece design with the eye lens deeply recessed from the eyecup rim so several mm of ER is wasted. The first model allows the eyeglass lens to almost touch the eye lens of the ocular so almost all ER can be used. It is important that physical contact between eyeglass lens and eye lens of ocular/steel rim does not happen, though.
Apart from that, the diameter of eyecups vary, so even if two models have same height from eyecup edge to eye lens(and same theoretical useable ER) a wider eyecup allows the eyeglass to come a tiny bit closer.
Another important thing to know is that manufacturers stated ER is to be taken with a pinch of salt. They can be correct but sometimes not at all correct. It seems that manufacturers way to measure ER differ. And in some cases it's probably not measured at all. For example when every model in a series have same stated ER.
When 8x32, 10x32, 7x42, 8x42, 10x42, 10x50 and 12x50 all are claimed to have same ER, you can be pretty sure it's not true. And this is not limited to cheap binocular brands. Both Zeiss and Swarovski have presented such wrong specifications.
So : you have to try before you buy.