Steve C
Well-known member
OK, I'll put some gloves on an see. However the diopter button has to be pushed far enough down to disengage the lock, so I'll see.
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Kruger Caldera 8x42 (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Steve C
- Start date
OK, I'll put some gloves on an see. However the diopter button has to be pushed far enough down to disengage the lock, so I'll see.
Steve C
Well-known member
Dan,
I see no particular problem with the Caldera focus/diopter and gloves. The diopter pin has to be purposefully depressed to get the diopter ring to move. I've yet to have that happen in normal use, but it can be an issue if it sits uncased behind the seat, or on the seat and something gets put on it. It is pretty difficult to push the diopter pin enough to adjust it while wearing gloves. I had to stop normal viewing and actually concentrate on using my gloved hand to change the diopter setting. The thicker the glove the harder it was. The focus knob is narrower than some of the other binoculars I have, but there is still a little more than an inch clearance, and that will accomodate a pretty big gloved finger. My hands are not huge, but I wear a large or extra large glove depending on brand and style of glove.
I see no particular problem with the Caldera focus/diopter and gloves. The diopter pin has to be purposefully depressed to get the diopter ring to move. I've yet to have that happen in normal use, but it can be an issue if it sits uncased behind the seat, or on the seat and something gets put on it. It is pretty difficult to push the diopter pin enough to adjust it while wearing gloves. I had to stop normal viewing and actually concentrate on using my gloved hand to change the diopter setting. The thicker the glove the harder it was. The focus knob is narrower than some of the other binoculars I have, but there is still a little more than an inch clearance, and that will accomodate a pretty big gloved finger. My hands are not huge, but I wear a large or extra large glove depending on brand and style of glove.
Caldera Focus Wheel
Thanks for checking Steve. Good to know the narrow appearance of the focus wheel doest present any issue.
Thanks for checking Steve. Good to know the narrow appearance of the focus wheel doest present any issue.
Steve C
Well-known member
The Caldera has a little less field curvature, the depth of field seems the same. The Caldera has less usable eye relief. The rim of the eye cup on the caldera is about 4.5 mm above the lens on the Caldera. It is about 2.8 mm on the ZEN ED 2. I put the precise measurements for the Caldera in the review.
Need help !!
Hi guys,
I'm French so I hope you will understand my wild language, but you're lucky not to hear my formidable and feared accent..
First of all let me tell you how much this forum and the different rewiews help me understanding how binoculars works, it give me very good infos to choose the binoculars I need.
I'm currently hesitate between the ZEN ray ED2 7x36 and the kruger Caldera 8x 42.
I've read that both have some issue
-ED2 has some bad glare control (difficulty to handle stray light) and softer edge and a small play with the focus wheel
-Caldera as some play in the focus knob (first model ?) the fact that the diopter moved, the rolling ball effect and that the winged eye cups which don't stay in place and maybe more issues with the regularity of the Caldera lineup.
I What I didn't understand very well is the impact of the eye relief vs blackout? Is there a relation between eye relief and perceptible blackout ? the shorter the better ?
Optical performance seems to be similare (brigthness, contrast) large fov, probably sharper edge and better glare control for the caldera ..
So here is my question:
According to the fact that I'm a total crumb in binoculars performance Is it something to put in considération (despite the more compact size of the caldera) that I didn't do ?
What about the depth of field ? If I remember Steve said that they were very similar but I'm not sure of my translation.
As far that after sales services could be very complicated and expensive (as I leave in France) which of this two models you will consider as the primary model (image quality, longevity, customer service, visual comfort, ergonomics)?
A warm and big thank you to everyone who made this forum what it is:clap:
Merci beaucoup:hi:
Take care.
Hi guys,
I'm French so I hope you will understand my wild language, but you're lucky not to hear my formidable and feared accent..
First of all let me tell you how much this forum and the different rewiews help me understanding how binoculars works, it give me very good infos to choose the binoculars I need.
I'm currently hesitate between the ZEN ray ED2 7x36 and the kruger Caldera 8x 42.
I've read that both have some issue
-ED2 has some bad glare control (difficulty to handle stray light) and softer edge and a small play with the focus wheel
-Caldera as some play in the focus knob (first model ?) the fact that the diopter moved, the rolling ball effect and that the winged eye cups which don't stay in place and maybe more issues with the regularity of the Caldera lineup.
I What I didn't understand very well is the impact of the eye relief vs blackout? Is there a relation between eye relief and perceptible blackout ? the shorter the better ?
Optical performance seems to be similare (brigthness, contrast) large fov, probably sharper edge and better glare control for the caldera ..
So here is my question:
According to the fact that I'm a total crumb in binoculars performance Is it something to put in considération (despite the more compact size of the caldera) that I didn't do ?
What about the depth of field ? If I remember Steve said that they were very similar but I'm not sure of my translation.
As far that after sales services could be very complicated and expensive (as I leave in France) which of this two models you will consider as the primary model (image quality, longevity, customer service, visual comfort, ergonomics)?
A warm and big thank you to everyone who made this forum what it is:clap:
Merci beaucoup:hi:
Take care.
Paloma_Negra
Active member
Welcome Bruce!
Why are you comparing a 7x36 with an 8x42?
The first thing most people do is pick the magnification needed and then narrow down the size of the binocular they would like to carry.
..seems a bit odd, but I'm new and still learning.
Why are you comparing a 7x36 with an 8x42?
The first thing most people do is pick the magnification needed and then narrow down the size of the binocular they would like to carry.
..seems a bit odd, but I'm new and still learning.
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Hi all,
I'm new to this forum. I may confess it's my first post |
|
I would like to thank you all for the excellent posts you wrote on this forum. The experiences, reviews you share here are very helpful. :t:
The questions Bruce is asking were already in my head since a few days and I'm happy he already opened the door on this forum with his post.
I'm also wondering which of this two models (ZEN ED2 7x36 or Kruger Caldera 8x42) you will consider as your goto model regarding their image quality, robustness, visual comfort, ergonomics and of course customer service. The magnification is a now brainier for me because the Caldera has a huge FOV for a 8x. So I'm rather looking on the overall quality of those two binos.
I've already read some excellent posts on the ED2 but bad ones too and I can say the same on the Kruger. As Bruce said, optical performance seems to be similar (brightness, contrast) large fov, probably sharper edge and better glare control for the caldera but greater FOV and depth of field for the ED2. I'm right ?:h?:
Is the glare problem really solved on the 7x36 ED2 ?
I've also read that their last production was suffering from regularity in the quality of their production lineup. Do you have some info on this too ?
Regarding the Caldera is play in the focus knob solved with their "new version" and can we trust the regularity of the Caldera lineup but their was quite some return regarding quality issues.
If someone can share is experience here, I will be very grateful to him.
Thanks to everyone. :t:
Have a nice day.
Francois
I'm new to this forum. I may confess it's my first post |
| I would like to thank you all for the excellent posts you wrote on this forum. The experiences, reviews you share here are very helpful. :t:
The questions Bruce is asking were already in my head since a few days and I'm happy he already opened the door on this forum with his post.
I'm also wondering which of this two models (ZEN ED2 7x36 or Kruger Caldera 8x42) you will consider as your goto model regarding their image quality, robustness, visual comfort, ergonomics and of course customer service. The magnification is a now brainier for me because the Caldera has a huge FOV for a 8x. So I'm rather looking on the overall quality of those two binos.
I've already read some excellent posts on the ED2 but bad ones too and I can say the same on the Kruger. As Bruce said, optical performance seems to be similar (brightness, contrast) large fov, probably sharper edge and better glare control for the caldera but greater FOV and depth of field for the ED2. I'm right ?:h?:
Is the glare problem really solved on the 7x36 ED2 ?
I've also read that their last production was suffering from regularity in the quality of their production lineup. Do you have some info on this too ?
Regarding the Caldera is play in the focus knob solved with their "new version" and can we trust the regularity of the Caldera lineup but their was quite some return regarding quality issues.
If someone can share is experience here, I will be very grateful to him.
Thanks to everyone. :t:
Have a nice day.
Francois
Paloma-Negra,
Thank you for your help. You're right the 2 models are note directly comparable..
The fact is that I was looking for a large fov with enough magnification and that this 2 binoculars are offering a large and comparable one.
The size are not the same Kruger Caldera is more compact (0,6 " shorter) but I don't think it will make a big différence for me.
The real question as more to do with overall quality and potential issue. As I live in France the perspective of returns regarding quality issues does not put a smile on my face (shipping cost + delay + risk of breakage or deterioration during the shipment )..
Any one having feedback on this bino ?
Have a nice day.
Bruce
Paloma_Negra
Active member
Bruce,
I'm hesitant to make a recommendation because I have no first hand experience comparing those two binoculars. I know that's always preferable.
BUT IF.. I was in your position and torn/undecided between those two exact models, I would not hesitate to save $100 USD! Check this sale out ---> Zen 7x36ED2
I would NOT think twice about them being Demo models.
They are in like new condition and have a LIFETIME warranty.
Also, I think there is an advantage purchasing directly from the manufacturer, NO middle men to deal with if service or a problem develops. Bon Appétit!
I'm hesitant to make a recommendation because I have no first hand experience comparing those two binoculars. I know that's always preferable.
BUT IF.. I was in your position and torn/undecided between those two exact models, I would not hesitate to save $100 USD! Check this sale out ---> Zen 7x36ED2
I would NOT think twice about them being Demo models.
They are in like new condition and have a LIFETIME warranty.
Also, I think there is an advantage purchasing directly from the manufacturer, NO middle men to deal with if service or a problem develops. Bon Appétit!
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Steve C
Well-known member
The two binoculars now in question are my two main use binoculars. So far I have not had to make the call of either one or the other.
The Caldera has against it the somewhat over sized ocular assemblies, so if you have smallish and/or closely set eyes, the Caldera may not be comfortable enough to use. They are right on the verge of too large for me, but I have no real problem with them. I eventually wound up cutting off the winged eye shields of the Caldera and replaced them with ones from Field Optics Research.
The ZEN ED 2 has in its debit column the glare question. I really have a hard time addressing this one as honestly, I just don't see it to be bothered by it. Not to say those who are bothered by it aren't seeing what they report, just not everybody will see it. In your case it is kind of hard to have to send things halfway around the globe to get it right.
The diopter mechanisms of the Caldera and ZEN are very different. The ZEN ED is a classic locking right eye mechanism. The Caldera is a center focus mount and operated by depressing a little protruding pin to unlock and move the setting. The ZEN is much more prone to stay put. In the two years plus I've had mine, I've yet to reset the diopter. The Caldera mechanism seems tough enough because I seem to have to reset the diopter every time I use it. It is kind of an automatic reaction now to feel the position of the button and adjust to the proper spot. If it was prone to diopter shift problems I think mine would have shown it by now. They live mostly in my pickup behind the seat, lens covers on out of the case, and covered by a jacket or sweatshirt, the removing the binocular from under the jacket is where the diopter movement comes from. Other than that it takes a deliberate intention and definite movement on the part of the user to move the Calder adapter.
The two binoculars have very different focus mechanisms too. The Caldera is faster and focuses counter clockwise to infinity. The ZEN ED 2 is clockwise to infinity and somewhat slower than the Caldera. Neither of mine have any focus slack.
I'd judge from whatever experience you have with binoculars. It is way too easy to over think a purchase. For example, just because somebody talks about glare, or CA or any of a dozen other, at times hot topics around here, don't assume you will see it and start off out of the box with a new binocular looking for things. They will have some issues, regardless of who made the thing or what you paid for it. So if you are wondering what they are talking about when CA is mentioned, I'd hazard a guess you maybe aren't particularly susceptible to it. If you typically see some color fringing around various parts of the image, then CA correction may be something you need to pay attention to. Look at as many binoculars as you can outside and pan under the sun. If you are susceptible to seeing glare, this will tell you. Thing is you will have to likely decide on one, accept the fact that, like many of your friends, they have some faults and you will hope to find far more positives than negatives. Sometimes it takes a year or so going through all seasons and conditions before you will really know.
Image/object performance is a wash. Both are very good. Field performance will favor the Caldera if you are really edge sharp critical, as the Caldera has a better edge than the ZEN ED 2. Neither will be good enough for the super critical edge sharpness users I'm afraid. The overall size of the relative sweet spot is about the same, and the ZEN is wider.
The depth of focus in the ZEN is a lot better than the Caldera, the ZEN being nearly as good as the several good 7x porros I have. The Caldera is about typical as regards dof in an 8x glass.
The Caldera has against it the somewhat over sized ocular assemblies, so if you have smallish and/or closely set eyes, the Caldera may not be comfortable enough to use. They are right on the verge of too large for me, but I have no real problem with them. I eventually wound up cutting off the winged eye shields of the Caldera and replaced them with ones from Field Optics Research.
The ZEN ED 2 has in its debit column the glare question. I really have a hard time addressing this one as honestly, I just don't see it to be bothered by it. Not to say those who are bothered by it aren't seeing what they report, just not everybody will see it. In your case it is kind of hard to have to send things halfway around the globe to get it right.
The diopter mechanisms of the Caldera and ZEN are very different. The ZEN ED is a classic locking right eye mechanism. The Caldera is a center focus mount and operated by depressing a little protruding pin to unlock and move the setting. The ZEN is much more prone to stay put. In the two years plus I've had mine, I've yet to reset the diopter. The Caldera mechanism seems tough enough because I seem to have to reset the diopter every time I use it. It is kind of an automatic reaction now to feel the position of the button and adjust to the proper spot. If it was prone to diopter shift problems I think mine would have shown it by now. They live mostly in my pickup behind the seat, lens covers on out of the case, and covered by a jacket or sweatshirt, the removing the binocular from under the jacket is where the diopter movement comes from. Other than that it takes a deliberate intention and definite movement on the part of the user to move the Calder adapter.
The two binoculars have very different focus mechanisms too. The Caldera is faster and focuses counter clockwise to infinity. The ZEN ED 2 is clockwise to infinity and somewhat slower than the Caldera. Neither of mine have any focus slack.
I'd judge from whatever experience you have with binoculars. It is way too easy to over think a purchase. For example, just because somebody talks about glare, or CA or any of a dozen other, at times hot topics around here, don't assume you will see it and start off out of the box with a new binocular looking for things. They will have some issues, regardless of who made the thing or what you paid for it. So if you are wondering what they are talking about when CA is mentioned, I'd hazard a guess you maybe aren't particularly susceptible to it. If you typically see some color fringing around various parts of the image, then CA correction may be something you need to pay attention to. Look at as many binoculars as you can outside and pan under the sun. If you are susceptible to seeing glare, this will tell you. Thing is you will have to likely decide on one, accept the fact that, like many of your friends, they have some faults and you will hope to find far more positives than negatives. Sometimes it takes a year or so going through all seasons and conditions before you will really know.
Image/object performance is a wash. Both are very good. Field performance will favor the Caldera if you are really edge sharp critical, as the Caldera has a better edge than the ZEN ED 2. Neither will be good enough for the super critical edge sharpness users I'm afraid. The overall size of the relative sweet spot is about the same, and the ZEN is wider.
The depth of focus in the ZEN is a lot better than the Caldera, the ZEN being nearly as good as the several good 7x porros I have. The Caldera is about typical as regards dof in an 8x glass.
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I do not have the Caldera, but I do have the Zen-Ray ED2 7X36. I purchased it a couple of months ago direct from Zen-Ray as part of the "damaged box" deal mention a couple posts above by Paloma_Negra. The binocular is definitely worth the price and there was no significant damage to the box.
Steve did a great job of summing up my impressions. My only issue is that the focus knob has about 20 degrees of free play rotation when rotating the focus knob side to side. I have seen this issue mentioned in several reviews of the series going back to the original release. I think mine is a current production model, so it looks like this issue has never been seriously addressed in the ED2. However, I have also seen reviews of the series stating there was very little free play in the focus knob.
Bottom line .... there is a realistic chance you could end up with a unit that has more than expected free play. Some people care, other do not. I do and will be contacting Zen-Ray to see if they can tighten it up. I just want to put some more wear patterns in it first.
If you decide on the Zen-Ray and free play is a problem, I would first contact them and see if they will check to make sure you are shipped a unit that has a tight focus.
Steve did a great job of summing up my impressions. My only issue is that the focus knob has about 20 degrees of free play rotation when rotating the focus knob side to side. I have seen this issue mentioned in several reviews of the series going back to the original release. I think mine is a current production model, so it looks like this issue has never been seriously addressed in the ED2. However, I have also seen reviews of the series stating there was very little free play in the focus knob.
Bottom line .... there is a realistic chance you could end up with a unit that has more than expected free play. Some people care, other do not. I do and will be contacting Zen-Ray to see if they can tighten it up. I just want to put some more wear patterns in it first.
If you decide on the Zen-Ray and free play is a problem, I would first contact them and see if they will check to make sure you are shipped a unit that has a tight focus.
Hi all,
Thank you very much for your kind answers they were very helpful for me.:t:
I've a "demo unboxed" ZR ED 2 7x36 on the way to home ... for $275 it's a good deal. I hope the will fit me well ... it's hard to buy them without having tried them.
I may order the Caldera in a few month o
Thank's to all
Have a nice day
Francois
Thank you very much for your kind answers they were very helpful for me.:t:
I've a "demo unboxed" ZR ED 2 7x36 on the way to home ... for $275 it's a good deal. I hope the will fit me well ... it's hard to buy them without having tried them.
I may order the Caldera in a few month o
Thank's to all
Have a nice day
Francois
BrightEyes
New member
I know this thread is old old old, but I thought it would be worth sharing my 2 cents. Based on what I've read here, I really, really want to check out the Caldera's. I just bought a pair of Vanguard Endeavor's, and can't deal with the CA. Sure sounds like the Caldera's might be just the ticket for me, and the field of view sounds fantastic.
Unfortunately, when I dropped by the Kruger facility today (I'm a local), I was told it wasn't possible for me to check out a pair (they had a pair in the lobby, even). Pretty disappointing, especially since others have been able to do so. I'm still interested, but a little less so. Definitely not a fan of their customer service.
Anyway, thought it was worth a share.
Unfortunately, when I dropped by the Kruger facility today (I'm a local), I was told it wasn't possible for me to check out a pair (they had a pair in the lobby, even). Pretty disappointing, especially since others have been able to do so. I'm still interested, but a little less so. Definitely not a fan of their customer service.
Anyway, thought it was worth a share.
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