The Green ghost ( Zeiss SF 8X42 ) (5 Viewers)

[A2GG]

I checked and so far there's only one SF 10x42 new on eBay, from the UK.
But they're priced very high so I think it must be somebody who hasn't read this thread.

I was hoping for more variety of Zeiss binoculars at rock bottom prices.
Can anybody confirm the FL 7x42 has very poor colour too?

Hi Mark,

Even though I just confirmed I see a slight color bias in the 8x32 FL,
i don't see it in everyday normal use. I saw it when looking through
the objective end. When looking through the bin as normal out birding
colors look true to life to me. I don't at all see a green wash or tint across the
image. The image and colors in the FL are quite nice and I've never felt it has
poor color presentation. Try one and see for yourself. From what I've learned
here most binoculars have a slight color bias. Don't let this thread turn you off
from trying out an SF or FL.

 

[Mark9473]

I think you misunderstood my post, GG (and it wasn't directly aimed at you either).
I'm not at all concerned about a "colour bias" in Zeiss bins, on the contrary. I just want more and cheaper offerings on the 2nd hand market.
I own an HT, by the way.

 

[eronald]

I dont think most people care about a green tint only a few will ever notice, 98% don’t need a 54mm IPD and will never notice its absence, most people don’t care about the balance of something they use for a few moments, rolling ball is a perceptual fiction which only a select few have reported, and whether the field is 140 or 150m is probably not exactly determinative for bird identification.

I like color, and have narrow-spaced eyes, and have noticed rolling ball occasionally, which influences MY choices. On the other hand, no one is holding a gun to my head and telling me I have to buy this, that, or any binocular at all. I could doubtless use my UV HD 7x42 for the rest of my life, to watch the gulls dancing, or the birds at our garden feeders, it never gives me a headache, has a decent wide field, and in fact *she* likes it when I take it along to pick a way and orient rather than to observe.

New alphas have to compete with old alphas, and old alphas are pretty well tuned by now to suit most folk. The risk with new models is that they don’t tick all the boxes even if they win on optics as they are newer. Look at all the love the FL8x32 is getting here.


Edmund

 

[temmie]

I have a 7x42 T*FL and only noticed a hint of yellow last year, when I went to a shopt to check out the 8x42HT.

That HT showed a white surface as white (much more than the yellowish white it was in hte T*FL), and I also checked a 8x42 SF and those were similar to the HT.

I feel that when birding, you won't see it. When comparing side by side, you can see yellowish or green hue.
I wonder if Zeiss decided that they wouldn't flatten the transmission curve as to let through more green light so at least they got the edge when comparing overall transmission.

 

[NDhunter]

It seems Zeiss has always strived for the highest in light transmission. Remember when the Victory HT models
were introduced they promoted the theme, "Designed by hunters, for hunters".

Jerry

 

[wdc]

I'm hoping somebody with an SF and a smart phone will follow your lead and try making some test photos.

Henry

so... I did experiment with this a bit more today, with a few conclusions:

1.Anyone can probably record a difference, as Henry has demonstrated, between the color through the glass of the binocular vs. a grey or white BG.

2. Once you try and duplicate the effort with different binoculars, you are at the mercy of more variables... a stable light source, as well as a fixed exposure, and an evenly illuminated background being probably the most critical.

3. Without controlling the above variables it is impossible to show accurate relative differences between binoculars, though one can see a color bias.

My attempts were too full of unknowns, that I tried to balance out digitally in photoshop, but soon realized that every 'correction' was probably inserting more artifacts. I photographed the view through 3 binoculars: An 8x42 Zeiss Victory SF, a 10x42 Leica Noctivid, and a 10x42 Nikon EDG, against a piece of white foam core lit by ambient outdoor light on a stormy, overcast day.

Eventually, I ended up in Photoshop with a set of off-white squares that somewhat resembled Tobias' tests, but felt I could not trust the relative values, so just observed the color differences. The Zeiss, unsurprisingly, showed a greener cast than the Leica or the Nikon. Side by side the Leica was more like a lemon yellow vs. a pale green. In contrast, the Nikon showed as a warm grey, and has a bit more red than the Leica. My descriptive language creates its own bias. It is important to realize that these are all tints whose differences are completely indiscernible if you squint at them collectively, with the exception that they were all warmer than the reference background color, regardless of its value.

So, yes, you can photograph it, and you can compare it on the computer, but whether it plays a significant role in one's use and enjoyment of these products is probably up to the individual. If you don't see it in everyday use, it is a complete non-issue. If it bothers you, then buy another equally good product out there.

I do encourage anyone who is interested in doing this to try it out, so you're not relying one someone else's (possibly flawed) data, and perceptions. In addition, you'll come away with a renewed appreciation for standards, and objective measurements, as well as the efforts of folks like Henry that provide examples of ways of testing/checking your own perceptions.

You're all self-isolating, yes? You've probably got time on your hands! I'm not going to post my results, because they are flawed in so many ways, and I don't wish to contribute to relentless internet foolishness. Use your own bins, and your own tools, see what you get, and then decide for yourself whether its worth spending anymore of your time thinking about.

-Bill

 

[Gijs van Ginkel]

Temmie, post 105,
The transmission spectra of the HT and the SF are almost parallel, the HT only has higher transmission values. That corresponds very well with your observations.
Gijs vna Ginkel