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Confused: Swarovski, Zeiss, 8x, 10x (5 Viewers)

K

KeesJ

Well-known member
Netherlands
I do own a Vortex Diamondback 10x42 and am still happy with it. But now that I can afford it, the idea of buying a top class binoculars is starting to take shape.
For example the NL Pure 10x42. I thought dat I needed a 10x42.

But the Swarovski and Zeiss 10x42 seems too heavy. So I tried the NL 10x32, as well as the SF 10x32 and the SFL 10x40. In and outside the store I've had these in my hands for at least half an hour each.
The SFL immediately fell off because the so-called wow factor was missing and because the focus wheel was not in the right place for me.
The NL and SF both suited me well. The ergonomics of the SF might be a bit better, but I think the NL too could get used to. Blackouts were avoidable.

The shopkeeper insisted that I also should try the NL 8x32 and SF 8x32. I always felt it had to be at least 10x but thought, I'm here anyway, so let's see. What struck me: the slight difference in magnification!
And I observed a slightly quieter image and easier positioning.

So I have had 4 devices in my hands, and I absolutely do not know which one is or could become my favorite.
 
After years of 10X42 glass, and the inevitable increase in my age, I switched to 8X32 two years ago.

Good luck with your decision ……. no one can make it for you.

You will get all kinds of advice here, some of it sound and some of it completely off-the-wall.

It is up to you to pick the seeds out of all the rest of that stuff.
 
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Maljunulo said:
You will get all kinds of advice here, some of it sound and some of it completely off-the-wall
Click to expand...
Yes, I have noticed already. I saw for example that you do like the SF 8x32.
About this bino, how do you handle the lens covers, do you use them?
 
Welcome to Birdforum, Kees! I’m sure you will receive many recommendations from the binocular-savvy members here. First, I’ll congratulate you for being in a place (physical and financially) where you can try top tier optics and can afford to get the best. My recommendation would be to seriously consider the type of use you are likely to subject the binoculars to, and try to imagine how you will use them over the next 20 years or more. Once you decide on weight/size and power that suits your activity level and likely usage, then compare the best brands in whatever format is best suited. Let your eyes tell you which is best, and then, don’t worry about new models or lens coating upgrades or new strap-hanger systems or whatever – all that stuff tends to get in the way of enjoying the binoculars you have.

I myself have three birding optics: A small compact for everyday carry, a mid-sized (8x32) for when birding or nature watching is likely, and a smallish spotting scope (15-45x65) for shore and sea birds. I’ve obviously prioritized smaller and lighter optics and have been happy with these three for about 20 years.

But also remember, a lot of people get enjoyment simply by owning nice things. If you can afford it, there is no harm in having many binoculars that suit different specific uses.
 
Thank you for the additional details. If you don’t mind me speculating a bit on your situation, I would comment that your current three optics cover most if not all birding situations pretty well. As you are still happy with your 10x42s, the question seems to be: Replace the Vortex with a top-end brand of the same format, or (as your local shop-keeper seemed to infer) consider adding a mid-sized binocular to your collection. Of course, is 10x your magnification “sweet spot?” Would 8x or even 7x be a valuable addition?

I guess my main point is that form ought to follow function. If 10x works as your primary binocular now, maybe the smart idea is to get the best 10x model available. Your Vortex is fairly light for its size; the top-end binoculars tend to be heavier because of all the glass used to get those stellar views. Maybe a 32mm binocular, even one with less than 10x, might be a nice addition to what you already have. I think most of the top European 32 mm binoculars weigh about the same as your Vortex (give or take an ounce or two).

It's smart to do a bit of research and to take advantage of communities like this one to help refine your decision. It’s a really nice quandary to have!
 
If you're open to consider more options, and haven't completely ruled out high power options, perhaps take a look at the 12x42 NL, too.

Its probably the best 12x in the world, and many agree that it handles like a lower power bino in terms of AFOV and stability. For me, there was no real competition from any other model currently available. It has the 'wow factor' in spades.

It is the one model in the NL line which will really give you something that Zeiss (and Leica) can't match, at the moment.
 
Just remember that for a given objective size, as the magnification goes up the exit pupil diameter goes down.

A smaller exit pupil makes the glass “fussier” about eye placement.

Don’t jump and put down your money until you have considered all the factors.

Again, the signal to noise ratio may not be very high, as what is important to one is trivial to another.

That’s why what you are doing can be difficult. We’ll try to help, but ultimately it’s up to you.
 
KeesJ said:
I do own a Vortex Diamondback 10x42 and am still happy with it. But now that I can afford it, the idea of buying a top class binoculars is starting to take shape.
For example the NL Pure 10x42. I thought dat I needed a 10x42.

But the Swarovski and Zeiss 10x42 seems too heavy. So I tried the NL 10x32, as well as the SF 10x32 and the SFL 10x40. In and outside the store I've had these in my hands for at least half an hour each.
The SFL immediately fell off because the so-called wow factor was missing and because the focus wheel was not in the right place for me.
The NL and SF both suited me well. The ergonomics of the SF might be a bit better, but I think the NL too could get used to. Blackouts were avoidable.

The shopkeeper insisted that I also should try the NL 8x32 and SF 8x32. I always felt it had to be at least 10x but thought, I'm here anyway, so let's see. What struck me: the slight difference in magnification!
And I observed a slightly quieter image and easier positioning.

So I have had 4 devices in my hands, and I absolutely do not know which one is or could become my favorite.
Click to expand...
If you can only have one binocular, I would get the NL 8x32 or SF 8x32. It is hard to beat an 8x32 for all around use, and both of these binoculars are less than 22 oz. and you will appreciate the light weight when hiking. An 8x is easier to hold steady, has better DOF, easy eye positioning and has a bigger FOV. The choice between the SF and NL comes down to personal preference. I chose the NL because I felt it had sharper edges and a slightly more transparent view, but you might like the SF for other reasons like ergonomics. The choice is yours. Have fun choosing. You can't go wrong with either one!
 
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There's no perfect binocular for all conditions. If you're only going for one size it's very much going for the best compromise. I mainly bird over open marsh land where I like the extra reach a 10 gives me, but if I take an 8 or a 7 I don't think I miss much, just the odd bird here and there, and it's probably more often than not failing to pick out a distant bird in a scattered group in the grass than failing to identify a bird. If I'm birding in light woodland I prefer the depth of field a 7 or 8 gives me, but again I don't think I miss much if I have 10s with me... There are also a couple of spots where 15s come into their own, but whilst they let me pick out distant birds I could only spot with those or a scope I probably miss the odd bird closer to. Typically a birding session for me is probably around 3 hours so weight isn't a big issue - If I'm birding for a day I take it into account. If I'm birding into dusk or getting up to watch owls at dawn then I ignore the 32s (great day time binoculars but...).

Have you considered going used?

How and when you bird is probably the most important consideration - it will set the best magnification and objective size. In terms of brand there's not a big difference in overall quality between Swarovski, Zeiss and Leica, it's largely personal preferences as to how they do things, and it's probably also worth considering the top end Nikon's and Meoptas. Central resolution on all of them is excellent - and whether one is neglibly better looking at a test chart through a magnifier whilst tripod mounted is pretty unimportant when you're going to be using them handheld. I've got flat-field and non flat-field binoculars and fine the practical difference neglible, others may disagree. Extreme FoV isn't high on my list of essentials, nor is exceptional close focus, but some people love them...
 
KeesJ. post 1,
Try the Swarovski NL 8x32 (if you wallet is thick enough) and the Meopta Meostar 8x32 at a much lower price and with very good optical performance (in our test data equal to the Leica Ultravid HD+ 8x32, see our test data on the WB-site of House of Outdoor). And since you live in The Netherlands it may be worthwile to visit that store: a well equipped store with binoculars in different price ranges.
Gijs van Ginkel
 
Kees I recently bought the NL Pure 10x42 after testing 8x, 10x, and 12x Swaro, Leica and Zeiss binoculars side by side at a local Bird Reserve. All were very impressive and irrespective of the differing tints or tones of the image between marques, the Swarovski‘s had the edge from a FOV perspective. All were optically superb. Plus, and again it reinforces the oft repeated ‘try before you buy’ mantra, they suited me ergonomic and handling wise.

The 10x was the one that I felt most comfortable with, the 12x induced too much shake (for me) despite having the ludicrously expensive forehead rest attached. It then fell between the 8x and the 10x and again, with the forehead rest attached, the 10x provided the best viewing experience for me. It hit my sweet spot. I emphasise ‘for me’!

Magnification wise I felt that the extra reach of the 10x would be beneficial at times (especially when I didn’t have them with me😀) and the FOV differences twixt the 8x and 10x seemed negligible. I have not regretted my decision for a second, they are superb.

Good luck with whatever you choose as you are deciding amongst what are arguably the very best binoculars in the World.
 
Another factor that is always bubbling under the surface here, is the age of the user, and obviously their eyesight.

The first one makes light weight increasingly important, and the second makes most opinions of relatively little use for some of the subtle stuff.

“I don’t see a difference.” is not, and should be distinguished from “These two are the same.”
 
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KeesJ said:
I have no problem telling I am retired and have had two cataract operations, now only needing 1+ reading glasses.
Click to expand...
If your experience is like mine, you should be able to see like an 18 year old, assuming no other pathology.

I hope you are as delighted with your new vision as I was with mine.

Buy the best for your “new” eyes, they should be capable of seeing the difference.
 

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