KnockerNorton
Well-known member
You queried the rate at which raptors dropped primaries during moult.
erm, I didn't actually.
You queried the rate at which raptors dropped primaries during moult.
Balls. If they're on the web then they are uploaded with the knowledge that they're accessible by anyone.
They may well be but that doesn't constitute a decision to waive copyright. I'm also not convinced that the various exemptions mentioned apply. Even if they do - its still a courtesy to ask permission. Its certainly just rude to respond in the way that has happened when the issue is raised.
I doubt that body feathers should be ripped out if anyone is using best practice in their ringing.
Body feathers are often lost. When you're manipulating the bird, either in the net or the hand, they can come out very easily - some birds apparently drop them as an anti-predator response. It's virtually impossible to avoid with thrushes etc., but we're talking around 5-10 feathers here - nothing the bird would miss. But, obviously, you try to avoid it.
Again though, I can see no reason for this pic of the nightjar. Why was it taken? Is it informative or educational in any way? No, it's another trophy pic. "look, I caught a nightjar!" It does nobody any favours and tarnishes ringing...if that photo wasn't taken then the bird possibly wouldn't have been held in that grip at all and there wouldn't be 'photo evidence' appearing as a smear on BirdForum. I do wish ringers would think before they get snap happy and posting this kind of thing. It's getting like bloody twitching.
One other small question for the ringers using pots to weigh birds... How do you hold the bird prior to putting them in the pot? Some ringers that i have seen use pretty much the same method of 'posting' the bird into the pot by holding the wings against the body- especially with the larger birds. Presumablely this does not damage the birds feathers in a similar manner suggested by the original poster, FalconBirder?
He is, technically, quoting the website, which is perfectly free of copyright.
people have been talking about various handling techniques on this thread, but i seriuosly question the need to ring birds at all? we know enough about most species for the need to ring to be unnessessary! certainly some species particularly the reintroduction ones could possably benefit by it. but most birds regularly "rung" in the uk are done by hobby ringers who produce limited or no new statistics of any worth to justify the wholesale trapping of wild birds! i am a falconer and if i caught a single raptor i would face at least a very large fine, at worst a 5yr jail sentence and a ban from keeping birds for 5yrs, which is fair enough, but these ringers are licensed to trap birds legally for what? an incredibly low return rate on birds rung, then the few returns they get tell them exactlly what? that swallows migrate to africa? nothing that we didnt know allready. it should be stopped unless there is a really credable concervation reason for it.
keithmills61; said:people have been talking about various handling techniques on this thread, but i seriuosly question the need to ring birds at all? we know enough about most species for the need to ring to be unnessessary! certainly some species particularly the reintroduction ones could possably benefit by it. but most birds regularly "rung" in the uk are done by hobby ringers who produce limited or no new statistics of any worth to justify the wholesale trapping of wild birds! i am a falconer and if i caught a single raptor i would face at least a very large fine, at worst a 5yr jail sentence and a ban from keeping birds for 5yrs, which is fair enough, but these ringers are licensed to trap birds legally for what? an incredibly low return rate on birds rung, then the few returns they get tell them exactlly what? that swallows migrate to africa? nothing that we didnt know allready. it should be stopped unless there is a really credable concervation reason for it.
Keith, did you read my reply to you the last time you posted this? Or the other papers I also posted for your enlightenment?
http://www.birdforum.net/showpost.php?p=&postcount=112
joannechattaway; said:Link doesn't work.
I think you will find all pictures are quotes as being copyright of myself or AuBO.
the question remains that there are bad ways of doing things and good ways,
people have been talking about various handling techniques on this thread, but i seriuosly question the need to ring birds at all? we know enough about most species for the need to ring to be unnessessary! certainly some species particularly the reintroduction ones could possably benefit by it. but most birds regularly "rung" in the uk are done by hobby ringers who produce limited or no new statistics of any worth to justify the wholesale trapping of wild birds! i am a falconer and if i caught a single raptor i would face at least a very large fine, at worst a 5yr jail sentence and a ban from keeping birds for 5yrs, which is fair enough, but these ringers are licensed to trap birds legally for what? an incredibly low return rate on birds rung, then the few returns they get tell them exactlly what? that swallows migrate to africa? nothing that we didnt know allready. it should be stopped unless there is a really credable concervation reason for it.
people have been talking about various handling techniques on this thread, but i seriuosly question the need to ring birds at all? we know enough about most species for the need to ring to be unnessessary! certainly some species particularly the reintroduction ones could possably benefit by it. but most birds regularly "rung" in the uk are done by hobby ringers who produce limited or no new statistics of any worth to justify the wholesale trapping of wild birds! i am a falconer and if i caught a single raptor i would face at least a very large fine, at worst a 5yr jail sentence and a ban from keeping birds for 5yrs, which is fair enough, but these ringers are licensed to trap birds legally for what? an incredibly low return rate on birds rung, then the few returns they get tell them exactlly what? that swallows migrate to africa? nothing that we didnt know allready. it should be stopped unless there is a really credable concervation reason for it.
I have a little sympathy in that I hate these 'trophy shots', which is what the first 2 pics appear to be.