• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Review of Swarovski EL 8.5x42 vs. Leica Trinovid 8x42 BA (1 Viewer)

etc

Well-known member
Leica Trinovid 8x42 BA vs. Swarovski 8.5x42 EL. The Leica is one of the last "BA" models from 2000, while Swarovski is circa 2007.

I know it's not a fair comparison as the Trinovid is one generation behind it seems but it's a fine binocular and deserves to be tested against the latest and greatest. Furthermore it's all just my non-expert opinion.

Optical performance:
I did not find the Swaro to be that much brighter - it's barely noticeable and you have to look hard. However, Swaro EL 8.5x42 does represent colors better, very slightly. Sharpness: Leica is very, very sharp. However, Swarovski is just as fantastically sharp. If I had to use a sharpness reference standard, it would probably be Leica however, but it might be due to the many hours I spent with it. They are dead even with regards to resolution sharpness.
Chromatic abberation: I haven't seen any in Leica. I have not seen any *yet* in Swarovski.
Edge to Edge sharpness is most excellent in Leica and just as good in Swaro.
So optics-wise, it's a win for Swarovski by a slim margin. I really expected more brightness from Swaro.
The other thing to keep in mind is that Swarovski has an extra 0.5 power over Leica and it does resolve objects better albeit without increased shake as holding it is easier. I haven't been able to run tests with regard to Field of View and Depth of Field. It seems what one does - so does the other.

Weight
Leica has a reassuring weight to it. It's a bit on the heavy side. I don't mind, as I think quality optics should weight something. If you want something light, get a sub $100 commodity optics from a major retailer. When I hold Leica, I don't think - oh , how heavy. I think, this is a wonderful quality bino. Swarovski however has perfect weight - not too heavy, not too light, just perfect. So here Swarovski wins, slightly.

Ergonomics
This is where Swarovski totally dominates Leica. The EL split design is so much easier to use. One thing I find questionable in Swarovski design is some metal on the inside part of the barrel. I wonder why they choose not to put the armor around it. It does get cold if you have to hold it in the winter. However, if it's that cold, should use gloves anyway.

The eye piece cover is nicely designed and almost identical to Leica's. One huge bonus over Leica is the objective cover. It's amazing Leica doesn't come with an objective cover to protect it against rain, snow, dust and damage. It's a no-brainer. The strap is longer in Swarovski than Leica. There is but one plus in Leica over Swarovski's ergonomics - Leica is considerably shorter in length and therefore more compact. Longer length of Swaro is not necessarily a problem, it's actually easier to hold.

Ergonomics and user interface is a sound win for Swarovski.

Build quality and longer-term reliability

Build quality seems basically identical but I would have to give a slight edge to Leica. There is just something intangible about it. I haven't dived under water with either, nor have I put them in a bucket of icy water for extended periods of time. Both are supposed to be waterproof, fogproof and shock proof. I know that Leica fulfils these claims while Swaro EL is a fairly new model. Leica's armor is thicker, applied better and more damage resistant.

Focus

The focus is much smoother, lighter and without backlash in Swarovski. It's easier to dial in to the right focus without having to go back and forth like I do with Leica. Swarovski's focus seems to be slower. I always found Leica's focus just a bit too fast. Focus override past infinity: Big win for Swarovski, it can focus past infinity to -6D while Leica can only do -4D. This means if you have myopia of -5D, you won't be able to use Leica without eyeglasses, but Swarovski you can. Swaro has twist-up eyecups which stay raised. Leica has pop-up eyecups which provide just the right amount of eye relief in either position (down for glasses, up for usage without glasses.) I think Swaro's eye cups are superior as there is no possibility they will be accidently pushed down.
Eye relief is adequate in both Swaro and Leica. They both can be used with eyeglasses.

Cleaning:
SwaroDur coating on the objective and eye lense ends do help with cleaning, dirt doesn't seem to stick to it. Another bonus is that they seem harder to scratch.

Weak spots

Leica: The hindge cover is plastic and seems like it would break if hit with something at just the right angle. Lack of objective covers. Weights slightly more than it should, although not really a problem. Ergonomics. Holding 8x42 Trinovid feels like holding a shoe box. It gets better with time.

Swarovski: The hindges are metal and seems like paint will eventually come off. Leica has armored the entire surface leaving no exposed metal parts, Swarovski should have done the same. The case that it comes with is totally worthless and doesn't support the binos plus the strap, plus raised eyecups. (Leica's soft leather case is better. It actually offers next to no protection but when not in use, it can be rolled up and put in a pocket.)

Value
Swarovski is considerably more expensive than Leica Trinovid. I paid twice as much for Swaro EL as for the Trinovid. Trinovid, while optically very slightly inferior - and even then equal to Swaro resolution or contrast wise but with poorer color representation, IMO. In terms of pure value, Swarovski is a poor deal while the Trinovid is a fantastic deal.



Conclusion:
Swarovski wins but not due to optics IMO, but due to better ergonomics, better focus, having objective covers and slightly better color representation (I reserve the right to revise this view upon more tests)
The Trinovid however remains very capable even against the best, and a great buy at half the cost of Swaro. I prefer Swaro but if the Trinovid was the only binocular I had to use I would not be all that disappointed.
 

Attachments

  • swaro_leica1.jpg
    swaro_leica1.jpg
    92.4 KB · Views: 2,053
  • swaro_leica2.jpg
    swaro_leica2.jpg
    99.4 KB · Views: 1,614
Last edited:
The chief problem with the 8x42BA was its poor close focus,5.3m. This was improved with the BNs focusing to 3.1m.
 
In Leica's defense, I've never found myself in a situation where I needed something as close as 5 meters. Or even 10 meters. If it's that close, I am not going to use binoculars at all.

I would very much prefer for Leica to extend both the close-up focus distance and the past infinity focus...
Swarovski claims 2.5m close focusing distance - I think it's absurd. Whatever for, to watch fleas on a bird?
 
Biggest bunch of baloney I ever read! I have had several pair of Swarovski's and they are not built as well nor are their optics as good as Leica's. Ergonomics is a personal thing and you really can't say that Swarovski's are better for everybody than Leica's. I prefer the ergonomics of the Leica's and the Leica's to me have superior contrast which to me is the deciding factor in optics.

Dennis
 
Leica Trinovid 8x42 BA vs. Swarovski 8.5x42 EL. The Leica is one of the last "BA" models from 2000, while Swarovski is circa 2007.

I know it's not a fair comparison as the Trinovid is one generation behind it seems but it's a fine binocular and deserves to be tested against the latest and greatest. Furthermore it's all just my non-expert opinion.

Optical performance:
I did not find the Swaro to be that much brighter - it's barely noticeable and you have to look hard. However, Swaro EL 8.5x42 does represent colors better, very slightly. Sharpness: Leica is very, very sharp. However, Swarovski is just as fantastically sharp. If I had to use a sharpness reference standard, it would probably be Leica however, but it might be due to the many hours I spent with it. They are dead even with regards to resolution sharpness.
Chromatic abberation: I haven't seen any in Leica. I have not seen any *yet* in Swarovski.
Edge to Edge sharpness is most excellent in Leica and just as good in Swaro.
So optics-wise, it's a win for Swarovski by a slim margin. I really expected more brightness from Swaro.
The other thing to keep in mind is that Swarovski has an extra 0.5 power over Leica and it does resolve objects better albeit without increased shake as holding it is easier. I haven't been able to run tests with regard to Field of View and Depth of Field. It seems what one does - so does the other.

Weight
Leica has a reassuring weight to it. It's a bit on the heavy side. I don't mind, as I think quality optics should weight something. If you want something light, get a sub $100 commodity optics from a major retailer. When I hold Leica, I don't think - oh , how heavy. I think, this is a wonderful quality bino. Swarovski however has perfect weight - not too heavy, not too light, just perfect. So here Swarovski wins, slightly.

Ergonomics
This is where Swarovski totally dominates Leica. The EL split design is so much easier to use. One thing I find questionable in Swarovski design is some metal on the inside part of the barrel. I wonder why they choose not to put the armor around it. It does get cold if you have to hold it in the winter. However, if it's that cold, should use gloves anyway.

The eye piece cover is nicely designed and almost identical to Leica's. One huge bonus over Leica is the objective cover. It's amazing Leica doesn't come with an objective cover to protect it against rain, snow, dust and damage. It's a no-brainer. The strap is longer in Swarovski than Leica. There is but one plus in Leica over Swarovski's ergonomics - Leica is considerably shorter in length and therefore more compact. Longer length of Swaro is not necessarily a problem, it's actually easier to hold.

Ergonomics and user interface is a sound win for Swarovski.

Build quality and longer-term reliability

Build quality seems basically identical but I would have to give a slight edge to Leica. There is just something intangible about it. I haven't dived under water with either, nor have I put them in a bucket of icy water for extended periods of time. Both are supposed to be waterproof, fogproof and shock proof. I know that Leica fulfils these claims while Swaro EL is a fairly new model. Leica's armor is thicker, applied better and more damage resistant.

Focus

The focus is much smoother, lighter and without backlash in Swarovski. It's easier to dial in to the right focus without having to go back and forth like I do with Leica. Swarovski's focus seems to be slower. I always found Leica's focus just a bit too fast. Focus override past infinity: Big win for Swarovski, it can focus past infinity to -6D while Leica can only do -4D. This means if you have myopia of -5D, you won't be able to use Leica without eyeglasses, but Swarovski you can. Swaro has twist-up eyecups which stay raised. Leica has pop-up eyecups which provide just the right amount of eye relief in either position (down for glasses, up for usage without glasses.) I think Swaro's eye cups are superior as there is no possibility they will be accidently pushed down.
Eye relief is adequate in both Swaro and Leica. They both can be used with eyeglasses.

Cleaning:
SwaroDur coating on the objective and eye lense ends do help with cleaning, dirt doesn't seem to stick to it. Another bonus is that they seem harder to scratch.

Weak spots

Leica: The hindge cover is plastic and seems like it would break if hit with something at just the right angle. Lack of objective covers. Weights slightly more than it should, although not really a problem. Ergonomics. Holding 8x42 Trinovid feels like holding a shoe box. It gets better with time.

Swarovski: The hindges are metal and seems like paint will eventually come off. Leica has armored the entire surface leaving no exposed metal parts, Swarovski should have done the same. The case that it comes with is totally worthless and doesn't support the binos plus the strap, plus raised eyecups. (Leica's soft leather case is better. It actually offers next to no protection but when not in use, it can be rolled up and put in a pocket.)

Value
Swarovski is considerably more expensive than Leica Trinovid. I paid twice as much for Swaro EL as for the Trinovid. Trinovid, while optically very slightly inferior - and even then equal to Swaro resolution or contrast wise but with poorer color representation, IMO. In terms of pure value, Swarovski is a poor deal while the Trinovid is a fantastic deal.



Conclusion:
Swarovski wins but not due to optics IMO, but due to better ergonomics, better focus, having objective covers and slightly better color representation (I reserve the right to revise this view upon more tests)
The Trinovid however remains very capable even against the best, and a great buy at half the cost of Swaro. I prefer Swaro but if the Trinovid was the only binocular I had to use I would not be all that disappointed.

Nice effort! :t:

It's always a bit lopsided to compare a current model from one company with an older model from another. But, as prices go up and up we might all do well to consider alternatives that were at the top of their game not too long ago.

Elk
 
[email protected],

I don't think it's really the case of this versus that, rather this in addition to that. Get them both if you can..



Anyway, back to the subject, I did some astronomy viewing today, in addition to birding with both Trinovid and Swaro EL. Both showed color representation and brightness as very, very close to each other. The difference is very hard to quantify with the unaided eye. If I were to guess, just a few percentage points. Swaro is easier to hold not only due to the split barrel design but also due to the fact that it's longer, and the focus wheels turns easier and slightly slower, both advantages. I think 8.5x is the max I can comfortably hold offhand.
 
Last edited:
In Leica's defense, I've never found myself in a situation where I needed something as close as 5 meters. Or even 10 meters. If it's that close, I am not going to use binoculars at all...Swarovski claims 2.5m close focusing distance - I think it's absurd. Whatever for, to watch fleas on a bird?

I think it's a butterfly thing! I have Swaro 8x30 SLCs and often have to take a couple of paces backwards to get a look at butterflies when they settle close by. Using modern close-focusers like the Els you can get incredible close ups!
I've also had many occasions, particularly forest-birding in the tropics, when birds have come too close for my SLCs whereas ELs would have given cosmic views...
8x at 10ft gets you a LOT closer than the naked eye!
 
Last edited:
Anyway, back to the subject, I did some astronomy viewing today, in addition to birding with both Trinovid and Swaro EL. Both showed color representation and brightness as very, very close to each other. The difference is very hard to quantify with the unaided eye. If I were to guess, just a few percentage points.

Judging from the lab tests I've seen the difference is probably around 5-7%. Trinovid in the low 80's, EL in the upper 80's. Subjectively that will look slight to some people and pretty obvious to others. The brightest binoculars have transmission in the mid 90's. I think the difference between those and the Trinovids would be obvious to anybody.
 
...I've never found myself in a situation where I needed something as close as 5 meters. Or even 10 meters. If it's that close, I am not going to use binoculars at all...

Hmm...I'm guessing you don't spend much time sifting through mixed species flocks of warblers or sparrows in dense brush or weeds.

--AP
 
In Leica's defense, I've never found myself in a situation where I needed something as close as 5 meters. Or even 10 meters. If it's that close, I am not going to use binoculars at all.

You must have awesome eyesight to NOT need binoculars at plus 30'.
 
In Leica's defense, I've never found myself in a situation where I needed something as close as 5 meters. Or even 10 meters. If it's that close, I am not going to use binoculars at all.


One of the primary reasons I bought my BN's was the close focus capabilities as I enjoy a fair bit of butterfly and dragonfly/damselfly watching too - I found the Swaro' couldn't match them.
 
Upon more testing:

I thought the Trinovid (and perhaps Ultravid) had no advantages over Swarovski EL. That's not true.
I came to realize that their biggest advantage is compactness. The Trinovid is a lot shorter in length (or height depending how you look at it, the distance from the oculars to the objectives)
 
Having used good close focusing bins over the last few years (B & L Elites) I had to have this in my new one's, which I've got with my 8x32EL's (under 6 feet).
Dragons, Damsels, butterflies and stunning close-ups of familiar birds are occasions that just add to the birding day out. I can see why the Pentax Papillio's are so popular.
 
ETC try looking at a bird or simply a view where you have many colorful highly detailed objects clustered together. You will see a difference which I would desribe as the Leica having an almost electric vivid view and the Swaro's being more flat and lifeless. I had a pair of Swaro's and I spent hours comparing the two and I was amazed at the difference in contrast between the two. Once you know it's there it is hard to go back to any thing else. Low end binoculars have poor contrast in my experience. You have to look for it. It's not sharpness it's just the electric vivid view you get with the Leica. It's almost like they had an image intensifier inside them but in reality it must be the coatings. Look for it.

Dennis
 
Thanks for advice. Basically, after another couple of hours of testing yesterday, I've concluded that the two views are very, very similar. It would take an expert to see and articulate the differences. I think Swaro is very marginally better in some aspect that I cannot quite narrow down, if it's contrast, or brightness, or color saturation. Definitely not sharpness however.

It's just so marginal that it's not worth worrying about. The old Trinovids are not even close to retirement. I say this as a dedicated Leica fan (my first bino ever is in fact the Trinovid and I have this stupid my first-binos-is-best attachment to it)

The EL's focus totally dominates the Trinovid focus. Much, much smoother and effortless one-finger focus. The Trinovid is much rougher and I suspect it's not a fault but the design. I got used to it. It does have one advantage in that it's harder to knock out of your setting while I frequently change the setting on the Swaro while taking it out of the bag, etc.

The Swaro EL cost me $900 USD more than the Trinovid, and it's definitely not that much better. Awesome optical instrument worth having, no doubt. I am amazed why EL's cost what they do, and why Trinovids cost what they do, for some reason the market must prefer one over another.

I contemplated upgrading the Trinovid to an Ultravid, but now won't, as I don't see what the Ultravid will offer me that the Swaro EL doesn't already. (In fact, Swaro offers a few things Ultravid doesn't, but that's a different story) So I will keep the Trinovid, rugged piece of optical precision that it is and just use it. It's no longer in mint condition you might say so it would my choice in rough terrain.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for advice. Basically, after another couple of hours of testing yesterday, I've concluded that the two views are very, very similar. It would take an expert to see and articulate the differences. I think Swaro is very marginally better in some aspect that I cannot quite narrow down, if it's contrast, or brightness, or color saturation. Definitely not sharpness however.

It's just so marginal that it's not worth worrying about. The old Trinovids are not even close to retirement. I say this as a dedicated Leica fan (my first bino ever is in fact the Trinovid and I have this stupid my first-binos-is-best attachment to it)

The EL's focus totally tes the Trinovid focus. Much, much smoother and effortless one-finger focus. The Trinovid is much rougher and I suspect it's not a fault but the design. I got used to it. It does have one advantage in that it's harder to knock out of your setting while I frequently change the setting on the Swaro while taking it out of the bag, etc.

The Swaro EL cost me $900 USD more than the Trinovid, and it's definitely not that much better. Awesome optical instrument worth having, no doubt. I am amazed why EL's cost what they do, and why Trinovids cost what they do, for some reason the market must prefer one over another.

I contemplated upgrading the Trinovid to an Ultravid, but now won't, as I don't see what the Ultravid will offer me that the Swaro EL doesn't already. (In fact, Swaro offers a few things Ultravid doesn't, but that's a different story) So I will keep the Trinovid, rugged piece of optical precision that it is and just use it. It's no longer in mint condition you might say so it would my choice in rough terrain.

Swarovki's are expensive because the Swarovski family likes to live good and they control the price of their merchandise. Just look at the way their crystal has risen in price over the last few months. It is the best crystal in the world but overpriced for what it is just like their binoculars. I find it hard to believe you find the EL's superior in color saturation over the Leica's. That is one area I have never found any other binocular superior to the Leica in. I always found Swarovski's to give a slight yellow tint to the view probably from their coatings. I never got used to that preferring th untinted view of the Leica's. Maybe the latest models have a change in coatings though.

Dennis
 
Swarovki's are expensive because the Swarovski family likes to live good and they control the price of their merchandise. Just look at the way their crystal has risen in price over the last few months. It is the best crystal in the world but overpriced for what it is just like their binoculars. I find it hard to believe you find the EL's superior in color saturation over the Leica's. That is one area I have never found any other binocular superior to the Leica in. I always found Swarovski's to give a slight yellow tint to the view probably from their coatings. I never got used to that preferring th untinted view of the Leica's. Maybe the latest models have a change in coatings though.

Dennis

I compaired the Ultravid 8X42 to the EL 8.5X42. To me the ELs were sharper than the Leica. Maybe it was the extra .5 of power. I do not know. I do know that I definitely preferred the handling of the Els to the Ultravids. Also. If the Swarovski family likes to live well, then Leica Corp. must like to live really, really, really well, since Leica EDs cost more than Swarovski
 
Warning! This thread is more than 16 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top