Garden warbler? Veluwe Netherlands (1 Viewer)

[MaxesTaxes]

Hi everyone,
I saw this bird last week in the National Park of the Hoge Veluwe (Netherlands), more specifically in the outdoor sculpture museum (in the photos it is actually standing on a sculpture). The lack of any distinct features makes me think this is a garden warbler; however I haven't photographed them before, and for previous sightings I was able to get a sound ID as well whereas I didn't get one here, so I wanted to make sure I'm not mistaken before labelling it as such.
Sorry for the poor photos.
Best,
Max

 

[moose1991]

I thought it was a Spotted flycatcher.

 

[aeshna5]

I thought it was a Spotted flycatcher.

It is!

 

[MaxesTaxes]

I thought it was a Spotted flycatcher.

@aeshna5
I did think of that too, but I feel like its perch pose is not upright enough to be spotted flycatcher, I don't see any streaks in its plumage, and the color of my bird seems more yellowy than flycatcher.
Also, spotted flycatchers are (according to my books) less common than garden warblers...
But if you guys are certain that this is a flycatcher then that would be great news, as that would be an entirely new bird for me!

 

[aeshna5]

@aeshna5
I did think of that too, but I feel like its perch pose is not upright enough to be spotted flycatcher, I don't see any streaks in its plumage, and the color of my bird seems more yellowy than flycatcher.
Also, spotted flycatchers are (according to my books) less common than garden warblers...
But if you guys are certain that this is a flycatcher then that would be great news, as that would be an entirely new bird for me!

They are migrating through at the moment. I don't see them as breeding birds anymore but regular on passage.

 

[MaxesTaxes]

Also, could this potentially be the same species? It was seen in the same area (I've attached the normal and edited versions of the photos - note that the edit is obviously not artistic, but just to help see the features as the photos are very dark)

 

[KenM]

Looks like a Lesser Whitethroat.

Cheers

 

[MaxesTaxes]

Looks like a Lesser Whitethroat.

Cheers

And another species in the mix
This does look like a possibility, but I still feel like garden warbler fits better. Can I ask which features made you lean towards lesser whitethroat?

 

[THE_FERN]

And another species in the mix
This does look like a possibility, but I still feel like garden warbler fits better. Can I ask which features made you lean towards lesser whitethroat?

For me the 2 species you posted are (in order) spotted flycatcher and lesser whitethroat. The latter is more difficult to be sure of because of the heavy shadow but I'm certain it's not a garden warbler. In 806cc we can see evidence of a face mask. Garden warbler would not be as "rangy" / slim as this, and we would probably see some evidence of its bicoloured bill

 

[KenM]

And another species in the mix
This does look like a possibility, but I still feel like garden warbler fits better. Can I ask which features made you lean towards lesser whitethroat?

Grey crown, darker contrasting ear coverts, even allowing for less than perfect images, clean white under-parts with a relatively fine bill, quite unlike Garden Warbler which has a more robust bill and a rather bland head pattern.

Cheers

 

[Mark Lew1s]

Isn’t the second one a pied flycatcher?

 

[kuzeycem]

Bird in post #6 is a Ficedula flycatcher.

 

[KenM]

Agreed, the wings are too long for Lesser Whitethroat an oversight, this would only realistically leave Ficedula in the frame!

 

[MaxesTaxes]

Okay, I'm regretting adding the second bird to this thread as it seems to have confused the issue even more... it seems like people are giving slightly different answers, but after looking at what the majority are saying and looking at the different flycatcher species that actually occur in the Netherlands, I have narrowed it down to this:


^ This is a lesser whitethroat, Curruca curruca ^
=================================

^ This is a young/female collared flycatcher, Ficedula albicollis ^

Would you guys agree with this verdict?
@KenM @kuzeycem @Mark Lew1s @THE_FERN

 

[Butty]

Nobody has said that the first one is a lesser whitethroat. It's a spotted flycatcher. See above. Note very long primaries, bill shape, obscurely-streaked forecrown.

 

[KenM]

First image is a Spotted Flycatcher, 2nd is a Ficedula flycatcher.

Cheers

 

[MaxesTaxes]

First image is a Spotted Flycatcher, 2nd is a Ficedula flycatcher.

Cheers

Right okay, my bad. Thanks a lot for your help, you and everyone else!

Do you think the second one is IDable to species level? I believe there are only 3 Ficedula species (commonly) reported from the Netherlands: Pied flycatcher (Ficedula hypoleuca), collared flycatcher (F. albicollis), and red-breasted flycatcher (F. parva).

 

[Xenospiza]

Right okay, my bad. Thanks a lot for your help, you and everyone else!

Do you think the second one is IDable to species level? I believe there are only 3 Ficedula species (commonly) reported from the Netherlands: Pied flycatcher (Ficedula hypoleuca), collared flycatcher (F. albicollis), and red-breasted flycatcher (F. parva).

Only Pied Flycatcher is commonly reported from the Netherlands. Collared is extremely rare, Red-breasted is very rare (and does not have white in the wing).
So Pied is a safe bet.

 

[MaxesTaxes]

Only Pied Flycatcher is commonly reported from the Netherlands. Collared is extremely rare, Red-breasted is very rare (and does not have white in the wing).
So Pied is a safe bet.

Great, thank you!

 

[Alexander Stöhr]

Hello,

I agree with all, the choice is between Pied, Collared and (the ultrarare, first for the Netherlands?) Semicollared Flycatcher.

It isnt a Red-breasted Flycatcher, as said by the others.
Please note:

• white patch near the wing bend
• just visible=ghosted indication of and a broad triangular malar stripe, a good pattern for the mentioned species, but very rare/out of variation (???) in RB Flycatcher
• would the distinct eye-ring of many RB Flycatcher be visible here. Err, I think yes

Identifying those three very similar species, especially in autumn basic plumage, is extremly difficult and requires good pictures of the upperwing and tail.
I am confident this answer is true even for the most experienced experts of this difficult group.
But I agree with all: I cant see anything wrong for the default species, a Pied Flycatcher. So you can lay your mind to rest, I assume/hope.