Genus with the most Common Names? (1 Viewer)

[TicoTyler]

Not asking for the largest genus, but rather what genus has the most variety of common names. I was thinking of this today when looking at Arremon which has three separate common names - Finch, Brushfinch, and Sparrow. Any other contenders?

 

[raymie]

Anas had ducks, pintails and teals. Plus Mallard, of course.

 

[TicoTyler]

Anas had ducks, pintails and teals. Plus Mallard, of course.

Good contender. I don't think I'll count Mallard as it's one of those one-of-a-kind names that isn't descriptive. If that makes sense. But I guess we could make it the tiebreaker since they're at 3 a piece.

 

[D Halas]

Turdus has thrush, blackbird, redwing, fieldfare, ouzel, and robin.

 

[Jeff Hopkins]

Setophaga has warbler, parula, and redstart.

Crithagra has serin, grosbeak, canary, citril, seedeater, grosbeak-canary, and siskin.

Calidris has sandpiper, dunlin, stint, sanderling, ruff, surfbird, and knot.

Tringa has greenshank, redshank, yellowlegs, willet, sandpiper, and tattler.

 

[roo.]

Tringa has sandpiper, redshank, greenshank, tattler and yellowlegs.

 

[kweetal]

Taking a short-cut: counting the last word of the "English" column of IOC 14.2; these are the genera that have more than 5 different last words:

Calidris           | Ruff         
Calidris           | Sanderling   
Calidris           | Sandpiper    
Calidris           | Dunlin       
Calidris           | Surfbird     
Calidris           | Stint        
Calidris           | Knot         

Crithagra          | Serin        
Crithagra          | Seedeater    
Crithagra          | Grosbeak-Canary
Crithagra          | Grosbeak     
Crithagra          | Citril       
Crithagra          | Canary       
Crithagra          | Siskin       

Aythya             | Hardhead     
Aythya             | Pochard      
Aythya             | Scaup        
Aythya             | Redhead      
Aythya             | Canvasback   
Aythya             | Duck         

Tringa             | Willet       
Tringa             | Sandpiper    
Tringa             | Redshank     
Tringa             | Greenshank   
Tringa             | Yellowlegs   
Tringa             | Tattler      

Turdus             | Robin        
Turdus             | Thrush       
Turdus             | Redwing      
Turdus             | Ouzel        
Turdus             | Fieldfare    
Turdus             | Blackbird

 

[TicoTyler]

Taking a short-cut: counting the last word of the "English" column of IOC 14.2; these are the genera that have more than 5 different last words:

Calidris           | Ruff        
Calidris           | Sanderling  
Calidris           | Sandpiper   
Calidris           | Dunlin      
Calidris           | Surfbird    
Calidris           | Stint       
Calidris           | Knot        

Crithagra          | Serin       
Crithagra          | Seedeater   
Crithagra          | Grosbeak-Canary
Crithagra          | Grosbeak    
Crithagra          | Citril      
Crithagra          | Canary      
Crithagra          | Siskin      

Aythya             | Hardhead    
Aythya             | Pochard     
Aythya             | Scaup       
Aythya             | Redhead     
Aythya             | Canvasback  
Aythya             | Duck        

Tringa             | Willet      
Tringa             | Sandpiper   
Tringa             | Redshank    
Tringa             | Greenshank  
Tringa             | Yellowlegs  
Tringa             | Tattler     

Turdus             | Robin       
Turdus             | Thrush      
Turdus             | Redwing     
Turdus             | Ouzel       
Turdus             | Fieldfare   
Turdus             | Blackbird

Fantastic, thanks. I wouldn't count Calidris or Tringa as highly (at least in my head) since the idea was the variety of descriptive words (type of bird) within the same genus. Birds that have unique names like Willet and Ruff are more of a "name" than a "description".

So the winner IMO is Crithagra or Turdus.

I actually briefly thought of Turdus, but didn't look it up after thinking it was limited to Thrush and Robin. I wasn't aware of all the Old World name varieties in the genus. And now that I think about it if we go with the current eBird nomenclature Turdus would also get "Island-Thrush" as they hyphenate that one.

 

[johnallcock]

Fantastic, thanks. I wouldn't count Calidris or Tringa as highly (at least in my head) since the idea was the variety of descriptive words (type of bird) within the same genus. Birds that have unique names like Willet and Ruff are more of a "name" than a "description".

So the winner IMO is Crithagra or Turdus.

I actually briefly thought of Turdus, but didn't look it up after thinking it was limited to Thrush and Robin. I wasn't aware of all the Old World name varieties in the genus. And now that I think about it if we go with the current eBird nomenclature Turdus would also get "Island-Thrush" as they hyphenate that one.

Are Redwing or Fieldfare really any different from Ruff or Willet? They are all names that apply to only one species with any modifier (in fact, Ouzel currently only applies to one species as well).

IMO Crithagra seems to be the winning genus.

 

[cajanuma]

Are Redwing or Fieldfare really any different from Ruff or Willet? They are all names that apply to only one species with any modifier (in fact, Ouzel currently only applies to one species as well).

IMO Crithagra seems to be the winning genus.

But if Willet gets split into Eastern and Western, would you say the same? And once a genus has both grosbeaks and canaries in it, do you count grosbeak-canary as yet another name?

 

[TicoTyler]

Are Redwing or Fieldfare really any different from Ruff or Willet? They are all names that apply to only one species with any modifier (in fact, Ouzel currently only applies to one species as well).

IMO Crithagra seems to be the winning genus.

I'd never heard of those species so didn't realize Redwing and Fieldfare were also one-offs.

 

[TicoTyler]

But if Willet gets split into Eastern and Western, would you say the same? And once a genus has both grosbeaks and canaries in it, do you count grosbeak-canary as yet another name?

This kind of gets to the general vibe I had with opening this thread. For example is birds are similar enough to be in the same genus, why do we have both Finches and Brushfinches? Forget eponym debate, lets fix all the mismatched common names!

 

[awiner]

With a bit of code, the answers are a three-way tie for the eBird/Clements 2024 taxonomy:

Crithagra
[Serin, Citril, Canary, Seedeater, Grosbeak, Siskin, Grosbeak-Canary]
Turdus
[Island-Thrush, Blackbird, Thrush, Fieldfare, Ouzel, Redwing, Robin]
Calidris
[Surfbird, Ruff, Sanderling, Stint, Dunlin, Knot, Sandpiper]

(For IOC, remove Turdus, which spells it as "Island Thrush", two words.)

For fun, if you ask the opposite question - "what group name appears in the most genera" - the answer is Flycatcher:

[Fraseria, Terenotriccus, Eutrichomyias, Guyramemua, Ramphotrigon, Elminia, Empidonomus, Myopornis, Agricola, Myiobius, Myiodynastes, Cyanoptila, Vauriella, Sigelus, Suiriri, Cnemotriccus, Contopus, Megarynchus, Pyrrhomyias, Xenotriccus, Melaenornis, Myiophobus, Mitrephanes, Eumyias, Onychorhynchus, Tyrannus, Pseudobias, Stenostira, Artomyias, Lathrotriccus, Myiarchus, Mionectes, Bradornis, Erythrocercus, Myiozetetes, Aphanotriccus, Leptopogon, Trochocercus, Myiagra, Anthipes, Pyrocephalus, Ficedula, Leucoptilon, Conopias, Muscicapa, Myiotriccus, Cyornis, Legatus, Nephelomyias, Humblotia, Empidonax, Tyrannopsis, Hirundinea, Phelpsia]

 

[njlarsen]

This kind of gets to the general vibe I had with opening this thread. For example is birds are similar enough to be in the same genus, why do we have both Finches and Brushfinches? Forget eponym debate, lets fix all the mismatched common names!

Maybe because that shows either that they were in different genera in the past, that they should become so in the future, or because it helps us think about the morphotypes within the genus.

For your second part, about fixing the names, no thank you. That would be a lot of needless instability, and should be avoided, just like the changing due to eponymes should not happen.
Niels

 

[TicoTyler]

Maybe because that shows either that they were in different genera in the past, that they should become so in the future, or because it helps us think about the morphotypes within the genus.

For your second part, about fixing the names, no thank you. That would be a lot of needless instability, and should be avoided, just like the changing due to eponymes should not happen.
Niels

To be fair common names keep changing as species/genus/families are re-defined, regardless of eponyms. Like last year seeing several Flycatchers renamed as Flatbills. Or this year the Amazona parrots now called Amazons (stupid change IMO). I don't think a systematic reworking of names is called for, but I can see the value of aligning within a genus.

 

[raymie]

Or this year the Amazona parrots now called Amazons (stupid change IMO).

At least here in the US this was barely a change, most people already called them amazons anyway.

 

[TicoTyler]

At least here in the US this was barely a change, most people already called them amazons anyway.

I wonder if it came down to places used to them as pets vs places used to them as wild animals thing? IDK. Here in Costa Rica no one called them Amazons nor did the field guides except for the quirky Dyer & Howell guide with its deciding to give different names to a third of the birds in the country.

Edit to add: I remember reading the SACC proposal notes and indeed there is a strong connection between the name Amazon and the pet trade, as well as the word I hate even more of "conure". And much like many of the voting members who ultimately ended up going along with it I can live with Amazon even if I don't particularly like it.

 

[pbjosh]

This kind of gets to the general vibe I had with opening this thread. For example is birds are similar enough to be in the same genus, why do we have both Finches and Brushfinches? Forget eponym debate, lets fix all the mismatched common names!

This is a slippery slope when you get to names that are more a morphotype and not a taxonomic unit like finch, warbler, hawk, eagle, etc. And it’s a sticky issue with things like Redstart and Redwing and Dunnock and Anhinga that are well established and beloved.

I think something like Stipplethroat as a group name was a brilliant move but also think the push to mass rename warblers and sparrows and finches and orioles is seriously misguided and generally think that common name to genus alignment is mildly overrated.

 

[pbjosh]

And much like many of the voting members who ultimately ended up going along with it I can live with Amazon even if I don't particularly like it.

I had a voting slot on that and while it was an easy yes vote for me I also personally don’t love the association with cage birds and I find myself slow to change from saying Mealy Parrot to Mealy Amazon for instance. However when I hear or see an Amazon that I can’t immediately call to species (which is often of course), I always just called out Amazons or Amazonas.

 

[njlarsen]

I had a voting slot on that and while it was an easy yes vote for me I also personally don’t love the association with cage birds and I find myself slow to change from saying Mealy Parrot to Mealy Amazon for instance. However when I hear or see an Amazon that I can’t immediately call to species (which is often of course), I always just called out Amazons or Amazonas.

Precisely with this one, there were at least one field guide with that group being amazons rather than parrots prior to the vote in SACC = Parrots of the world from 2010. I did not have a problem with the change in part because of the difference in flight between this group and the Pionus parrots.
Niels