Some digiscoping experiments with a dslr (1 Viewer)

[JGobeil]

Hi Guys,

I today bought myself a Nikon D60 with an AF-S DX NIKKOR 18 -55 mm f/3.5-5.6G VR Lens, Thanks to Paul, i am now pointing in the right direction with regards to a replacement eyepiece for my cheap Acuter scope, namely a Hyperion 8 - 24 mm Zoom that should fit directly onto my camera.

Before anyone says it, i know i have to learn how to use the camera first. But there is no harm in building my kit up as i learn.

I would appreciate it guys if when browsing Ebay, if you find suitable teleconverters or extension tubes that would suit my equipment please let me have the details. I have seen many items for sale on Ebay and being newish to the DSLR / SLR technology i am unsure of what is good / bad.

Once again i appreciate your patience and help.

regards

Congradulations. The D60 will be a good foundation to build on.

While the kit lens will be adequate as an all around lens, it is far from optimal for digiscoping. I suggest you start hunting for a good fast prime lens in the 20-50mm range. If you go for a wide angle lens, you will also need a tele-converter, as Paul explained, in order to get adequate magnification. As an example, I recently got a Canon f1.8 50mm EF Mk1 lens on eBay for 70$.

While you hunt for this and an eyepiece for your scope, you can learn how to use your DSLR. Don't skip the manual like many do. Read it completely at least a couple times; this will be time well spent.

Good luck. I wish you fun and success.
Jules

 

[Paul Corfield]

For a Nikon 50mm lens have a look for a 50mm f/1.8 Nikkor AI-S (sometimes written as AIS). They did a pancake (thin) version but don't buy that because it's not very good. This is an old lens (early 1980's) but supposed to be the sharpest you can get and fairly cheap on ebay. Don't worry about teleconverters or anything like that yet.

Paul.

 

[Kuldoode]

Paul,

Do you mean like these:-

Nikon 50mm 1.8 MF lens AIS GREAT!

VIVITAR 19mm F3.5 Nikon LENS Ai-S AIS BOXED AND MINT

Lens Nikon Nikkor 50mm 1.8 AIS

The middle one is a vivitar 19mm, is this anygood ?

regards

 

[Paul Corfield]

The first one in your list would be the one to go for. From what I've read you need to look at the serial numbers on the front of the lens and look for ones that begin with a 3 as the one does in your first link. The sharpest ones built between 1981 and 1985 go from 318XXX to 3300000. The later ones aren't as good but it's probably splitting hairs as far as us amateurs are concerned. The one you linked to will be very good though. Avoid the F1.2 and F1.4 versions and stick with the F1.8

I'd avoid the 19mm Vivitar as it will provide very little magnification. A 28mm lens would be about the lowest you would want to go. A 50mm and a 28mm would pretty much cover everything.

Paul.

 

[Kuldoode]

Paul,

What about this one ?



Nikkor AiS 28mm f2 lens

the reason i am asking is if DSLR has got a 1.5 factor up on conventional SLR with the 28 mm not be nearer 50mm in digital world than the 50mm SLR on a dSLR ?

regards

 

[Paul Corfield]

Here's two photos I took for you to see what you could expect from either lens. These were taken at a measured range of 10m. The eyepiece was a 24mm one and would be like the Baader zoom at it's lowest power which covers the range of 8-24mm.

First photo was with a 28mm lens and 2nd photo with a 50mm lens. I'd ignore the crop factor of the lens because all you are using the lens for is to magnify the image and so a bigger lens provides more magnification. Beyond 50mm is where it starts to drop off and you need the sunniest of days, good glass etc. Your scope is 480mm focal length which is the same as mine so a 50mm lens will get you a photo of a small bird out to about 50m range and a larger bird maybe 100m range or more depending on the size of the bird. With the zoom eyepiece you may get more than that but as always, if you want more detail and the best quality photo, get closer to the subject, don't try and do it with magnification. At the end of the day, both lenses would have their uses.

Paul.

 

[Kuldoode]

Hi again Paul,

Thanks for showing me that it helps me understand what is obtainable with lens.

Im i correct in saying that the set up i would be aiming for would be similiar to this:-

D60 camera, with 50mm f1.8 lense which would attached directly to the hyperion zoon lens which would be attached to the scope ?

Does the 50mm f1.8 lens attach to the hyperion without any special adaptors ?

Once i master playing with this i can then introduce teleconverters, extension tubes etc ?

Last question i have, some of my images have a purple glow to them, is this the Scope glass or the eyepiece glass that causes this problem ?

I had fun yesterday with the camera and scope but i dont know how to change the images to 800 * 800, otherwise i would upload them and let you all have a giggle at my first pics.

regards

 

[Paul Corfield]

The Baader zoom eyepiece has a 54mm thread and I think the Nikon lens has a 52mm thread so you would just need a step up ring that most camera shops sell and they are readily available and much cheaper on ebay as well. Just check whatever lens you get, it will be written on the front what size the filter thread is.

With your scope I should imagine it's a combination of the the scope and the eyepiece glass causing the purple glow. I get it with my scope and you will get it with all achromat type lenses to some degree. The only thing you can improve on your scope is the eyepiece and I would think that by doing that you would improve it quite a bit as the Baader is very good. If that didn't work then it would be a new scope but the front lens shouldn't be that poor that it's producing all the purple glow you have now. There's a lot of glass in a zoom eyepiece and that's the most likely cause at the moment.

You can use a teleconverter with a 28mm lens but it will be too powerful to use with a 50mm. The extension tubes can be used with both lenses.

Paul.

 

[Kuldoode]

Something interesting that i have found is when i purchased the camera i was recommended a UV filter for the front of the lens, so that if i scratch it i throw it away as oppose to having to repair the lens, good shout i thought, how wrong was i ?

AT night when taking shots i see a ghosting of light with the lens on and with it off no ghosting. So i done a little experiment today through the scope, i took several pics with it on and off, the pics that had the filter off had less "Purple Glow" that those that were taken with it on.

Have you guys seen this or is this me being stupid. i am intending leaving it off.

Slowly getting the hang of the manual side of things, played with reducing the shutter speed to let more light in, also played with the iso at different speed, interesting results which i know will benefit me through the scope when i get my eye piece etc sorted out, as i have noticed most of the pics i have taken by holding camera at scope tend to be really light images, so next time i will play with shutter speeds and aperture.

This is fun though, havent done so much reading for years, and i still have tons to do.

Feel like a kid again LOL.

Thanks for your help guys, as soon as i find out how to crop to 800 i will post a couple of first tries etc as i would really appreciate feedback as to where i am going wrong.

PAUL - i have just order a SP54 ( Baadar ) to 52mm adaptor ring, last one i could find in UK for £3:25 free recorded delivery. All i need now is the 8 - 24 hyperion ( best i have found in UK is £160 ) which will be towards the end of the month and a decent 50mm lense. These will have to wait as her indoors wants a pup German Shepherd, which means a trip from here to Redcar in a fortnight today !!

 

[Paul Corfield]

I use a UV filter on my scope and haven't noticed anything. I use it to give the sky a better blue colour than I would normally get without it. I'm not using a camera lens on my setup though so it may be different. It may just be the filter. I use a fairly expensive one made from ground optical glass. Cheaper ones just use basic glass so there is a difference in quality.

Holding the camera up to the eyepiece will give light images because you will get some light coming in from the sides. Once you get the new eyepiece and have the lens screwed onto it this will disappear.

Cheapest I found the Baader 8-24mm zoom is here for £148 http://rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/detail.php?id=2498

Paul.

 

[Paul Corfield]

Had a bit more of a play with my 28mm lens today, see photos. Screwed it onto my 17mm Baader Hyperion eyepiece via a step ring. It works pretty well and the only drawback I can see is it seems to suffer from a very shallow depth of field which can mean parts of the bird can be out of focus. I'll probably invest in a better 28mm lens and do some more tests. Shutter speeds are up around 1/500 so it's plenty fast.

I sold my William Optics ZS-80 telescope today to make way for something with a bit more reach. Most likely going to go for the Skywatcher Pro Evostar 80ED which has a 600mm focal length compared to the 480mm of the ZS-80. It will translate to a 900mm f7.5 lens with the crop factor on my DSLR and with the 2X teleconverter it will make a nice 1800mm lens.

Paul.

 

[Kuldoode]

Interesting chioce of scopes, reason i say that i was told by a deal that the celestron, acuter and skywatcher are all made by the same manufacturer, a company i think this is how you spell it "Syntra"

Let me know what you think of it when you get it as i have the acuter pro series 80mm scope.

regards

 

[Paul Corfield]

Interesting chioce of scopes, reason i say that i was told by a deal that the celestron, acuter and skywatcher are all made by the same manufacturer, a company i think this is how you spell it "Syntra"

Let me know what you think of it when you get it as i have the acuter pro series 80mm scope.

regards

That's correct. Syntra also make the Orion scopes too. The Skywatcher Pro's get very good reviews and I've seen enough photos taken with them to be sure it will be a good choice. They all pretty much use the same optics in all those makes. The only difference with a spotting scope that can let down optical quality is you have to have some sort of erecting prism and it comes with an eyepiece. In a spotting scope that's a lot of glass that you have no control over. With a straightforward telescope all you have is the objective lens projecting onto the camera ccd which means the photo will nearly always be of a better quality than a comparable spotting scope. The Acuter may have the fluorite elements like the Skywatcher, Orion etc but it can all get messed up going through the prisms/eyepiece. The fluorite element is there to keep the colours of light together and to minimise colour fringing which is why it works best just to project straight onto the film plane.

Have a look at this link below. This guy that uses the Skywatcher 80ED and uses similar methods to me with 2X teleconverters etc.

http://fernandobatista.smugmug.com/gallery/3540865_6D86H#211104984

Paul.

 

[Paul Corfield]

Some digiscoping experiments with a dslr (new scope)

The new scope arrived today. Went for the Skywatcher Pro Evostar 80ED. Only ordered it yesterday so really pleased with the level of service.

The scope is excellent. It has a doublet objective with a single FPL-53 ED fluorite glass element and after taking plenty of photos today I can say there is pretty much zero aberration. I took some photos of a Crow almost into the sun and viewing the photo at full size I could hardly detect any blue or purple fringing. Really good for a £285 telescope. The scope is nicely balanced and as it comes with tube rings you can fine tune the balance to suit the weight of the scope plus dslr.

The focal length of the telescope is 600mm and f7.5 which translates to some good magnification, especially with the dslr crop factor.

Here's 5 photos from today with some text on each one.

Paul.

 

[JGobeil]

Very nice sharp pictures Paul. It seems like a good purchase... at a good price ! Congradulations.

It is nice to be able to easily balance the scope on the tripod. This can be a MAJOR source of vibrations and movement. I had difficulties with my setup with the DSLR, the lens and the eyepiece on the scope. I finally solved it by adding a 6" lensplate. I also added a red dot sight. I will try to test this assembly today - it should be interesting.

Regards
Jules

 

[Kuldoode]

Hi Guys,

I think i have managed to upload some images, these are my first attempt with dslr now that i am getting the hang of the manual thing. this was taken just holding the camera against the scope. Find it hard to keep it steady.

Hopefull when i get my other eyepiece and learn to focus better i think i can safely say my images will improve.

Paul, obtained a 50mm 1.8 lens yesterday , off ebay, serial number is within range that you provided.

I also bought the 52 to 54 mm step up ring so that i can attach to the baader hyperion when it arrives.

Then i will upload for true critisism and advice, in the meantime feel free to have a laugh at the ones i have attached. I can assure you this is much better than what i was getting with my coolpix.

speak soon guys.

 

[Neil]

The new scope arrived today. Went for the Skywatcher Pro Evostar 80ED. Only ordered it yesterday so really pleased with the level of service.

The scope is excellent. It has a doublet objective with a single FPL-53 ED fluorite glass element and after taking plenty of photos today I can say there is pretty much zero aberration. I took some photos of a Crow almost into the sun and viewing the photo at full size I could hardly detect any blue or purple fringing. Really good for a £285 telescope. The scope is nicely balanced and as it comes with tube rings you can fine tune the balance to suit the weight of the scope plus dslr.

The focal length of the telescope is 600mm and f7.5 which translates to some good magnification, especially with the dslr crop factor.

Here's 5 photos from today with some text on each one.

Paul.

Paul,
Looks good. The dove shows excellent detail. I admire you're focusing skills. When you've got time can you show pics taken at max magnfication with a 60x type eyepiece?
Neil.

 

[Paul Corfield]

Paul,
Looks good. The dove shows excellent detail. I admire you're focusing skills. When you've got time can you show pics taken at max magnfication with a 60x type eyepiece?
Neil.

I've only got a couple of eyepieces Neil so I can't get to exactly 60X and I don't have a point and shoot camera anymore so can only try this with the dslr. These photos however are at 92X. Taken through a 6.5mm eyepiece with the DSLR and a 28mm lens so not sure how the 28mm lens affects the overall magnification. Range was around 30-35m. Been very windy/stormy here the last couple of days so even though I got a lucky shot of this Wood Pigeon it was blowing around all over the place. Still, it shows that at 60X the scope shouldn't have a problem. The 6.5mm eyepiece I used is a real cheap astro one so it's hardly ideal but I was quite surprised that it worked this well. Shall wait for some better weather.

First photo shows the target I was aiming for. It's a small street lamp on a path at the back of my house. 2nd photo is at 92X and I think it's a small daylight sensor on top of the street lamp. 3rd photo is of a Wood Pigeon in the tree to the left of the street lamp, also at 92X magnification.

Kuldoode - your images/scope show some promise. Should be up and running once you have the eyepiece.

Paul.

 

[Kuldoode]

Paul,

Can i ask a perhaps silly question, in your picture you say that the focal length is 600mm and with the 6.5 that gives 92x magnification, how does the eyepiece figures come into play with magnification.

eg if i have a 480mm focal length and i use a say 8mm eye piece, what magnification would i be talking about if i was using my camera with a 50mm f1.8 lens ?

regards

 

[Paul Corfield]

Paul,

Can i ask a perhaps silly question, in your picture you say that the focal length is 600mm and with the 6.5 that gives 92x magnification, how does the eyepiece figures come into play with magnification.

eg if i have a 480mm focal length and i use a say 8mm eye piece, what magnification would i be talking about if i was using my camera with a 50mm f1.8 lens ?

regards

To get the magnification of the scope you divide the focal length by the eyepiece size. So your 8mm will provide 60X magnification and at 24mm it will give 20X.

I'm not sure how this then translates to the camera ccd once you add a lens in between the eyepiece and camera. There's a calculator here that should help. http://www.jayandwanda.com/digiscope/digiscope_calc.html

Paul.