Swallow Epping Forest yesterday evening. (1 Viewer)

[KenM]

Took a few almost out of the frame corner shots of a Barn Swallow last night, reviewed this am and was surprised at the red vent/flanks!
Assume that this is an occasional feature on UK Swallows although I couldn’t find any on line, these birds only emanating from NA and the Eastern Med?

Cheers

 

[Alexander Stöhr]

Hello Ken,

interesting bird, thanks for sharing!

I cant add anything new, so I refer to this thread: Swallow Subspecies in Africa With thanks to MacNara and all once more.

(And yes, no offence you know: I hope to see the original picture, if you find the time)

 

[Butty]

no offence you know: I hope to see the original picture, if you find the time

The pale rufous colours on the wing suggest that the color balance of this photo is wrong, and we know from the OP's previous postings of photos of images on a small screen that they are liable to be too saturated and too red.
Can you post only originals please, Ken, unless in exceptional and urgent circumstances? We know that you are able to do this because typically you always do in the end - when you need to extend your period of getting attention.

 

[KenM]

Hello Ken,

interesting bird, thanks for sharing!

I cant add anything new, so I refer to this thread: Swallow Subspecies in Africa With thanks to MacNara and all once more.

(And yes, no offence you know: I hope to see the original picture, if you find the time)

Swallow is a bird that I generally never attempt to image in flight (degree of difficulty 😩) and accordingly rarely scrutinise.
I have lightened slightly and sharpened, the bird seemingly shows a warm wash to the UTC’s/flanks, whether this is within variability I know not?

Cheers

 

[Butty]

Pay yer money and take yer choice . . .

 

[Barred Wobbler]

The rufous belly on this fly-through swallow caught my eye as it approached this morning, even though it wasn't very close. By the time I got the camera up and located the bird it was already well on its way, so all I got were some not-very-well focused record shots. Northumberland coast. It's notable that the vent area is even redder than the belly, which had caught my eye in the first place.

 

[lou salomon]

such transitiva-type swallows are seen about anywhere on the continent, especially during spring migration. as far as I understood these aren't true ssp. transitiva but individuals of nominate hirundo which have had baths in puddles rich of iron oxide.

 

[KenM]

such transitiva-type swallows are seen about anywhere on the continent, especially during spring migration. as far as I understood these aren't true ssp. transitiva but individuals of nominate hirundo which have had baths in puddles rich of iron oxide.

Can understand the reasoning, nevertheless,
strikes me as a little odd, that the deeper tone of red to the vent, is “neatly contrasted” by the much paler belly/chest area?

 

[foresttwitcher]

nominate hirundo which have had baths in puddles rich of iron oxide.

I agree that, definitely with the bird in post 6, it looks much more like staining.

 

[KenM]

I agree that, definitely with the bird in post 6, it looks much more like staining.

I’d have expected any staining to be uneven, rather than neatly contrasted?

 

[foresttwitcher]

I’d have expected any staining to be uneven, rather than neatly contrasted?

Well, this is where individual perceptions of a single photograph come in, as I see the reddish as very patchy and uneven and not "neatly contrasted". But I'm not going to get into an argument about it.

 

[Barred Wobbler]

About 1/15 sec earlier.

 

[KenM]

Well, this is where individual perceptions of a single photograph come in, as I see the reddish as very patchy and uneven and not "neatly contrasted". But I'm not going to get into an argument about it.

As far as I was concerned it was an exchange of opinions FT, nothing more, nothing less.
I’d be interested to know if there was any hard evidence to the red oxide explanation, which prompts the question…have House Martins ever been recorded with red staining?
Because in 60 years of birding I’ve never seen any evidence of such in the field or images.

Cheers

 

[Alexander Stöhr]

Interesting Ken!
Thanks, after reading your comment, I thought and I cant remember such an abnormal coloured House Martin too. In contrast, I see very few Barn Swallows with reddish/warm orange/peachy underparts each year in Germany.

Here is one House Martin with slightly dirtened underparts

https://flic.kr/p/22WLN4o

(06.06 2016, Prenzlau, NE_Germany)

Here is a recent one Club300 Germany by Jonas Till Jäschke

 

[Andy Adcock]

such transitiva-type swallows are seen about anywhere on the continent, especially during spring migration. as far as I understood these aren't true ssp. transitiva but individuals of nominate hirundo which have had baths in puddles rich of iron oxide.

I've noted a few here in Cyprus recently.

 

[KenM]

I've noted a few here in Cyprus recently.

I’ve certainly seen the odd one at Paphos over the years.👍

 

[KenM]

Interesting Ken!
Thanks, after reading your comment, I thought and I cant remember such an abnormal coloured House Martin too. In contrast, I see very few Barn Swallows with reddish/warm orange/peachy underparts each year in Germany.

Here is one House Martin with slightly dirtened underparts

https://flic.kr/p/22WLN4o

(06.06 2016, Prenzlau, NE_Germany)

Here is a recent one Club300 Germany by Jonas Till Jäschke

I’m beginning to think that the ”red oxide” theory was put out by the same guy that stated…BOP’s don’t cross open water Alexander.😉

 

[Alexander Stöhr]

Yes Ken,
might well be.

But I think I heard the staining theory before and that truely warm-bellied birds are within variation for nominate Barn Swallows. And when Lou remembered it too, than it surely must be written somewhere.

But as you know, I am extremly interested in such topics and I am grateful you mentioned the (appearant? Yes I think so) lack of stained House Martins. And it might well mean something (I have seen both species collecting mud side by side before).

Conclusion? Thanks for flagging this Ken. I hope as always for more comments. Thanks!

 

[Andy Adcock]

A slight tangent for which I apologise in advance, we have Hirundines taking water from our swimming pool, all day, every day. They obviously need water to make mud but, sometimes, they are making much more contact with the water than would seem neccessary, it's just usually the bill that goes in so are they bathing?

 

[KenM]

A slight tangent for which I apologise in advance, we have Hirundines taking water from our swimming pool, all day, every day. They obviously need water to make mud but, sometimes, they are making much more contact with the water than would seem neccessary, it's just usually the bill that goes in so are they bathing?

Can’t see why not Andy, when my birds drink at the pool, they often finish off with a bathe (not talking hirundines here…I should be so lucky) Thrushes, finches, Tits, Crests etc.