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West Midlands/Warwickshire local patches. (2 Viewers)

Hi Dave,
Don't know the county recorder myself, but from what I can gather he does most of his birding at a sensitive site, which the owners don't want too many people entering as well, and I think that's where he sees most of his rarities. I'm told that he knows his stuff. Incidently, he and a mate of mine found an Aquatic Warbler today at the site! Later saw it for myself with about a dozen other birders - I believe someone's reported it (don't know if they should've).

Matt
Click to expand...

if the site is sensative or private then they shouldent put news out, its the landowners choice,its great to have a landowner who greets in open arms in this situation but you also have to respect the farmers/landowners ideas,i was one of the lucky ones who recieved word on the warbler but was really anoyed that my dad wouldent take me even though we had 3 hours of doing nothing:-C.now theres no chance i can see it as im back to school tomorow though i would pay anything to see it(i would even skip school to see it,rubish lessons tomorow anyway:-O:-O)and judging the stuff that ive missed over te weekend im in a pritty rotton mood,and i thought a wigeon,a pintail and a barnicle goose was good:-O
well i will get over it,eventually
MB
 
Avesmaster said:
Hi Dave,
Don't know the county recorder myself, but from what I can gather he does most of his birding at a sensitive site, which the owners don't want too many people entering as well, and I think that's where he sees most of his rarities. I'm told that he knows his stuff. Incidently, he and a mate of mine found an Aquatic Warbler today at the site! Later saw it for myself with about a dozen other birders - I believe someone's reported it (don't know if they should've).

Matt
Click to expand...

Yesterdays Aquatic is at a different site i believe!! the last 1 was at a certain private fishery nr Draycote whos landowner is serious about his conservation & has even built a wader scrape (Avocet,Great White Egret ) I presume this 1 is a working quarry? Ive no doubt Jonathan knows his stuff but the only time you here of his records are from the annual rpt (Not all are at sensitive sites)


Ps the Rosefinch access is because the owner is back at work all week nothing more sinister!!!
Dave
 
midlands birder said:
judging the stuff that ive missed over te weekend im in a pritty rotton mood,and i thought a wigeon,a pintail and a barnicle goose was good:-O
well i will get over it,eventually
MB
Click to expand...

I'd say that a potential Earlswood first (Yellow-legged Gull) was also good!

Dave Hutton said:
Yesterdays Aquatic is at a different site i believe!! the last 1 was at a certain private fishery nr Draycote whos landowner is serious about his conservation & has even built a wader scrape (Avocet,Great White Egret ) I presume this 1 is a working quarry? Ive no doubt Jonathan knows his stuff but the only time you here of his records are from the annual rpt (Not all are at sensitive sites)
Click to expand...

Yes, I meant that they're 2 different sites involved, but both private/sensitive. I think I see what you mean about some of his records (e.g. just his initials next to a few Draycote records), but maybe in some ways you're doing something similar by not sending him your records for the county records database? No offence intended though, as it's up to you what you do and I know you put sightings on your blog (which I follow), but in my opinion the internet and bird news services, which are brilliant for people birding at the time, are not the best places to keep records permanently, for people to see decades from now. That's the main reason why I'm hoping to produce an Earlswood Bird Report, although there hasn't been much interest expressed in it :-C

Not directing this at Dave specifically, but I've noticed that the Warwickshire county recorder has been criticised on the web on more than a few occasions (mainly due to accepting a certain birder's records) but he doesn't seem to get any help from other experienced birders. How about a Warwickshire rarities committee being set up, like I think Staffordshire has? (Wasn't this mentioned on the Yahoo group some time ago?)

Anyone know if a certain Warwickshire reservoir beginning with W is sensitive?

Sorry if the above offends anyone - not intended.

draycotebirding said:
Can't see any problem with starting a "real" Warwickshire Birders on Yahoo groups, the person who sets it up would be able to moderate the members and no hiding behind different names (no offence Blackbird) Look forward to you setting it up.
You can also choose members to be moderators too.

Regards

John
Click to expand...

This and the text alert ideas sound good, but would a "real" birder who isn't known by many birders and has neither a good nor bad reputation (like me, maybe?) be able to join?

Matt
 
I also go to Wormleighton every now and then. I don't think it's sensitive - if so I have never been told off for sharing bird news. It also falls into the area covered by Banbury Ornithological Society and get put into their reports.

Gareth
 
hmmmm... Ive don't think i've ever met John, at least not knowingly, but he's always seemed like a good chap to me.

So, whats the deal with the Aquatic warbler? Anyone seen it? Is there access? Distant or close?

Cheers
Gareth
 
there is little accsess to the site(from my map book,but i may be wrong) but a few public paths, it appeares the quarry(or whatever it is) owners are now using force to keep birders out,sending security guards to escort birders off the site(see birdguides news page),shame that they cant make an exeption for this one bird which is very rare
MB
 
Can the bird be seen from public access? If not then why did it get put out in the first place? Sometimes it's not about surpression, there are other factors but if no one is able to access the site how was it found and then news released??

Gareth
 
gareth_blockley said:
Can the bird be seen from public access? If not then why did it get put out in the first place? Sometimes it's not about surpression, there are other factors but if no one is able to access the site how was it found and then news released??

Gareth
Click to expand...


A case of "we've seen and you've not?" ;) ;) ;)

I often wonder why these messages go out? I suppose it lets us know that the bird is in the area and may relocate and be spotted in a more accessible place
 
Salford Priors GP

I have looked over this site from the public footpath on the hill to the west and it was packed with birds. There is a monthly report in birdwatching magazine about this site and there are a lot of quality birds mostly waders. Geographically it is close to a river valley (Avon) and this would to help in its attraction to migrants. It also appears to be a good site for breeding birds.
The info getting out is a tease for any local birders trying to get access to the site. But it would appear that John Y-----y who is the birder getting the news out is not prepared to tell anyone else how to get in there.

Question to him :-
1. If the site is so sensitive why did you let the Auatic warbler news out?

2.Is the site is an important site for breeding birds and would disturbance jeopardise any success? if so well that would be understandable - however the breeding season is over now.

3. Is there any plan for the site after the gravel has been extracted ie to turn into a nature reserve? If so then again it is in the long term interest of birders and birds to minimise disturbance or upset the landowners.

4. Is the site dangerous? I have seen general public walking along the paths

I live less than 10 miles from the site and would like to get access to go birding there. If I know the 'score' then I will not bother if it causes problems, however if there are no reasons why access is not open to all then I will go birding there.
Just noticed on birdguides birders removed by security guards today. Maybe we will get the answers now
 
Salford Priors

upstarts1979 said:
I have looked over this site from the public footpath on the hill to the west and it was packed with birds. There is a monthly report in birdwatching magazine about this site and there are a lot of quality birds mostly waders. Geographically it is close to a river valley (Avon) and this would to help in its attraction to migrants. It also appears to be a good site for breeding birds.
The info getting out is a tease for any local birders trying to get access to the site. But it would appear that John Y-----y who is the birder getting the news out is not prepared to tell anyone else how to get in there.

Question to him :-
1. If the site is so sensitive why did you let the Auatic warbler news out?

2.Is the site is an important site for breeding birds and would disturbance jeopardise any success? if so well that would be understandable - however the breeding season is over now.

3. Is there any plan for the site after the gravel has been extracted ie to turn into a nature reserve? If so then again it is in the long term interest of birders and birds to minimise disturbance or upset the landowners.

4. Is the site dangerous? I have seen general public walking along the paths

I live less than 10 miles from the site and would like to get access to go birding there. If I know the 'score' then I will not bother if it causes problems, however if there are no reasons why access is not open to all then I will go birding there.
Just noticed on birdguides birders removed by security guards today. Maybe we will get the answers now
Click to expand...




Whoever released the news is very inconsiderate of the wishes of the few birders who have access as arranged legitimately with the Site Manager. After todays episodes with some birders actually arguing with the Site Manager I don't hold out much hope for the future.

Your question 3 was , I repeat was, very much on the cards.

We get back to the age old problem. It is completely private. Some people have permission which they have gone to a lot of trouble to obtain. I know this as someone who has actually attended interviews to get permission of my own for various Estates.

None of us has carte blanche to go where ever we like. Some of us establish relationships over many years to get us into certain areas at some of these places. These relationships are built on trust and are usually forged amongst active birders who get out into the field and find good birds and then share the information as sensitively as required.

A few folks in all counties are privy to information which for the sake of the bird is only released at the time of the Annual Report. If necessary details are even then withheld. The County Recorder is appointed to make judgements on these matters (especially if he finds the bird) and he seems to get it pretty well organised if he can. I remember him organising access to the Lesser Scaup at Farnborough for example. The grounds were closed up for the winter and no one even had to pay to get in. Thats just one of the County Firsts he has found

I think you will find that J Y......y didn t release the news but he did do his very best to get as many people as possible to see the bird. He has permission to be there and he escorted them to the bird.

As a working quarry there are issues for the Managers with H&S and all credit to the birders today who requested permission and were given it aswell as a hard hat. No credit whatsoever to the morons who were thrown off at 7.30am and those queuing up somewhat blatantly waiting for the Manager to go home.
 
Upstarts, I think Blackbird answered all your questions but I've sent John a link to this thread so he might be able to explain things himself. He's been going to Upton Warren for years so you might've spoken to him there.
 
The blackbird said:
Whoever released the news is very inconsiderate of the wishes of the few birders who have access as arranged legitimately with the Site Manager. After todays episodes with some birders actually arguing with the Site Manager I don't hold out much hope for the future.

Your question 3 was , I repeat was, very much on the cards.

We get back to the age old problem. It is completely private. Some people have permission which they have gone to a lot of trouble to obtain. I know this as someone who has actually attended interviews to get permission of my own for various Estates.

None of us has carte blanche to go where ever we like. Some of us establish relationships over many years to get us into certain areas at some of these places. These relationships are built on trust and are usually forged amongst active birders who get out into the field and find good birds and then share the information as sensitively as required.

A few folks in all counties are privy to information which for the sake of the bird is only released at the time of the Annual Report. If necessary details are even then withheld. The County Recorder is appointed to make judgements on these matters (especially if he finds the bird) and he seems to get it pretty well organised if he can. I remember him organising access to the Lesser Scaup at Farnborough for example. The grounds were closed up for the winter and no one even had to pay to get in. Thats just one of the County Firsts he has found

I think you will find that J Y......y didn t release the news but he did do his very best to get as many people as possible to see the bird. He has permission to be there and he escorted them to the bird.

As a working quarry there are issues for the Managers with H&S and all credit to the birders today who requested permission and were given it aswell as a hard hat. No credit whatsoever to the morons who were thrown off at 7.30am and those queuing up somewhat blatantly waiting for the Manager to go home.
Click to expand...

Hi Blackbird
Fair play for your reply.
I hope after this incident you are still allowed in there.
Unfortunately unless you can be on site all day then you will get some people who will do there own thing and upset the landowners/neighbours etc. Selfishly these people are driven by one thing - their list. As an ex twitcher from the 70's early 80's I've seen it happen many times although most people are responsible.
I can understand your dilemma, me and a friend have permission on a local fisheries and I dread the day we get a big one there.
Maybe if you organise a one off for this Saturday (bird allowing) and have a collection for the site manager it might go some way to appease him ( if its not too late).
After that I would keep everything quiet especially if there is a chance that the site could be a future wetland reserve. I think it might be an idea to drop the Birdwatching Mag report - seeing that got some people intersested in the site.
cheers John Belsey
 
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