Blackouts are just a function of eye relief and eye cup length and eye socket depth. You never know if you will get blackouts till you try the binocular.
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8x30 E II vs Contemporary Binos (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter perseid28
- Start date
I have found (with all my 8x CF porros) that the view is not directly comparable to 8x in a roof. To my eyes, it is more like a 7x roof, although this changes as the viewing distance gets greater (I use them generally at close to medium distances). I bought my Eii 8x30 at the start of winter and didn't want to take it out in the damp weather (and also had problems with my other porro binoculars where they all went out of alignment).
I bought a 7x36 ZR roof to use in place of the Eii when conditions were damp or when it might get knocked. I guess that the 7x36 ED2 is no ordinary 7x bin, as the view and overall package felt better to me. Later, I bought a (bargain) UV7x42HD. My Eii is no longer used.
I bought a 7x36 ZR roof to use in place of the Eii when conditions were damp or when it might get knocked. I guess that the 7x36 ED2 is no ordinary 7x bin, as the view and overall package felt better to me. Later, I bought a (bargain) UV7x42HD. My Eii is no longer used.
Roofs always have a bigger image scale than porro's of the same magnification. An 8x roof always looks bigger than an 8x porro.
If you are bothered by CA and eye placement of the Conquest you should definitely look for another bin. You won't know for sure if you really like the EII till you try a pair. From my experience the EII shows very little CA even when I am trying to look for it. My eyes have taken quite a bit of pounding while unnecessarily trying to induce CA against bright back grounds. It has become a bad habit, one that I will rue when I get older.
I believe everyone should own a good quality Porro and the EII is one of the best porros available now. It is one of the easiest bins I have tried including some of the Alpha roofs. The flimsy eye rubber cups take a little getting used to, but once you start using them the view is so immersive and addictive. Just this morning I was comparing the EII to the brand new SV 8x32 and the EII holds its own against the brilliant SV. The SV is slightly sharper than the EII in the center. The EII's wider FOV brings more into the view and the 3-D depth of view all but makes up for the slight fall in sharpness compared to the SV. When looking at a tree 50 yards out with the EII the eyes fool you into seeing the curve of the trunk. I get the same feeling when watching birds and animals. You want to reach your hand out and hold the bird (Don't try that with an Ostrich
. I never get that feeling with a roof bin. It is just stunning to use the EII scanning for birds in lakes and marshes where everything is in focus and so vivid.The EII has a reported close focus of 3m, but I can tell that it is actually 2m when I measured. Close focus on the EII needs the barrels to be brought closer to avoid eye strain, but it works well. Henry did an amazing review of the EII eleven years back and all of that holds true today - http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=38202
The only real issue in the field is lack of weather proofing in the EII. If you don't use them in rain they should work well for many years. I see that the Japan EII bins are going up in price on eBay. A Japanese seller on Amazon has them listed at $427 now and it will be a bargain at this price when they are sold out in a few years.
elkcub
Silicon Valley, California
Good luck with that. With Nikon one must cope with a quasi-legal semantic distinction between their product warranty and the nice-sounding but otherwise incomprehensible "no-fault policy," which applies only when other conditions don't lead them to exclude it.
Ed
It is likewise my experience that the 8x32 SE's sweet spot is somewhat sharper than that of the 8x30 EII which I think is the result of better contrast but why? Other users have reported the same to me. The extra 2 mm in objective diameter can't make that much of a difference, and even though my SE is more than 10 years older than the EII and may have leaded glass, it's hard to believe that even if it does have leaded glass that this would make much difference particularly where recently manufactured optical glass is involved.
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Interesting point.
The EII is a visibly more compact binocular:
- Its objective barrels are appx. 11 mm in length while the SE's are appx. 21 mm.
-At infinity focus the EII's distance from eyelens to objective lens is appx. 81 mm while the SE's is 92 mm.
This may not be proof the EII has faster objectives, but it is certainly suggestive.
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No.
The EII is I think a lot faster than f/4.
Maybe f/3.67 about.
The SE f/4.
Perhaps Henry can confirm.
In addition, this is probably why the shorter focal length EII eyepieces can have a wider AFOV than the SE and remain compact.
Does anybody know the focal length of the Habicht 8x30 objectives?
Sony's new 85mm f/1.4 GM FE lens, full frame, has specialised extreme aspheric making machines giving a surface accuracy to 0.01 microns. They claim incredibly smooth surfaces.
I don't know what this would mean for binocular optics.
I know that the very best optics still have to be made by hand, as machines up till now are not good enough.
The EII is I think a lot faster than f/4.
Maybe f/3.67 about.
The SE f/4.
Perhaps Henry can confirm.
In addition, this is probably why the shorter focal length EII eyepieces can have a wider AFOV than the SE and remain compact.
Does anybody know the focal length of the Habicht 8x30 objectives?
Sony's new 85mm f/1.4 GM FE lens, full frame, has specialised extreme aspheric making machines giving a surface accuracy to 0.01 microns. They claim incredibly smooth surfaces.
I don't know what this would mean for binocular optics.
I know that the very best optics still have to be made by hand, as machines up till now are not good enough.
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henry link
Well-known member
I know from directly measuring them that the eyepiece fieldstop diameters for both the SE and EII are identical at about 17mm and we know the true FOV for each, or at least Nikon's spec to the closest 1/10th degree (SE = 7.5º, EII = 8.8º). With that information the objective focal lengths can be calculated: SE = 130mm (f/4.06), EII = 110mm (f/3.67).
Henry
Henry
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I have owned and used both + the SE
I owned a pair of 8x30 EIIs for about a decade (2nd gen black non-peeling body covering), a pair of 8x32SEs (550xxx series) for four years, and Conquest HD 8x32s for about two years. I think there is a clear hierarchy - the Conquests are hands down the sharpest, the SEs next, followed by the EIIs. In fact the EIIs lagged enough that I sold them. I know they are "classic" and well loved on this site, but my experience has been that they are clearly not on par with the HDs. I do find the SEs a little easier on the eyes for all day birding - they somehow seem less demanding. But I think the Conquest HDs are THE value on the market these days - I have tried side by side with even the Ultravid and prefer the Conquest HDs. The key with the blackouts on the Conquest HDs is simply to extend the eyecups. Given the fact that they are waterproof, the Conquest HDs are a no brainer.
I am surprised to read of others finding the opposite. It certainly hasn't been my experience.
I owned a pair of 8x30 EIIs for about a decade (2nd gen black non-peeling body covering), a pair of 8x32SEs (550xxx series) for four years, and Conquest HD 8x32s for about two years. I think there is a clear hierarchy - the Conquests are hands down the sharpest, the SEs next, followed by the EIIs. In fact the EIIs lagged enough that I sold them. I know they are "classic" and well loved on this site, but my experience has been that they are clearly not on par with the HDs. I do find the SEs a little easier on the eyes for all day birding - they somehow seem less demanding. But I think the Conquest HDs are THE value on the market these days - I have tried side by side with even the Ultravid and prefer the Conquest HDs. The key with the blackouts on the Conquest HDs is simply to extend the eyecups. Given the fact that they are waterproof, the Conquest HDs are a no brainer.
I am surprised to read of others finding the opposite. It certainly hasn't been my experience.
Thanks Henry, that is what I thought.
Is the focal length of a Habicht 8x30 objective greater than an EII? If so, any idea of its value?
I found that out that out to 60 degree AFOV the SE 10x42 and Conquest HD have similar quality star images.
The fact that the Conquest HD goes out to 66.5 deg means that for me the Conquest HD is better, apart from the fact that I get serious blackouts with the SE although I have to be a bit careful with eye placement with the Conquest HD. I need the longer eyecups really.
Is the focal length of a Habicht 8x30 objective greater than an EII? If so, any idea of its value?
I found that out that out to 60 degree AFOV the SE 10x42 and Conquest HD have similar quality star images.
The fact that the Conquest HD goes out to 66.5 deg means that for me the Conquest HD is better, apart from the fact that I get serious blackouts with the SE although I have to be a bit careful with eye placement with the Conquest HD. I need the longer eyecups really.
Hello Perseid28. As far as I know, none of the new E2's available in the US are Nikon USA official imports. They are all gray market. I bought mine from Tristate Camera and from Camerabox, and neither has a US warranty. If this is a deal-breaker for you, then obviously you should take a pass. While I can empathize with the temptation to find a cheaper priced alternative to the Conquest, the fact is, you've already spent the $800 on the Conquest. The resale value on it would probably be between $400 and $500, which would be enough to fund the E2, but with very little left over. So what have you saved?
For what it's worth, of the several binoculars recently mentioned above, I have the Conquest, the E2, and the SE. To my eyes, the E2 is the sharpest, followed by the SE, and then the Conquest. But all are very sharp.
Got a little time in the back yard on an overcast day yesterday. Big difference between these bins is one's a porro and the other is a roof as I mentioned earlier. The image thru the roof appears larger than the image thru the porro as someone else already mentioned. The porro has a better 3D appearance to it. Both are really nice views. The roof has sloppy adjustable eyecups when compared to other adjustable eyecups out there. The porro has fixed rubber eyecups. Think the roof is more water resistant. Beyond that it is your preferences and personal ergonomics. I go back and forth on letting the EII go as I'm not a porro guy, but for some reason i keep holding onto it. It's a really comfortable view. For $400, you get upper tier optics and good construction... which is a great value and hard to beat.
CG
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Perhaps the lesson in all this is that over time it is nice to try numerous binoculars and just see what works best for you. Over the last few years I've had a few chances to try an array of the best optics and it is always revealing. It is one thing to read about them, another to hold and use. When birding with others I like to try what folks are using; you learn a lot.
perseid28
Well-known member
The Conquests just sold this afternoon for what I consider a very respectable price, so I guess I'll buy an E II and see how I like it!
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perseid28
Well-known member
I see that Tristate Camera still has the 8x30 E II listed, and it's about $50 cheaper than the Japanese Amazon sellers. But their customer reviews aren't all that positive; how was your experience dealing with them? I'm assuming the E IIs they're selling are pretty new stock?
NDhunter
Experienced observer
Tristate is a good place to deal with in my experience.
I would much rather deal with them than a Japanese seller.
The warranty will be much the same, if needed.
What happens with a close out model such as the EII, some sellers
buy a few cases and sell them, until the supply is gone.
Jerry
