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Common or Honey ? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Jean FRANCOIS
- Start date
agreed
Jean FRANCOIS
Well-known member
Deb Burhinus
Used to be well known! 😎
Yes for the reasons Roland and Tom said and on underwing/body plumage.
Andy Adcock
Worst person on Birdforum
I'd have said HB on shape, apart from the tail, look at head protrusion and typical, more obvious, carpal bend?
Richard Prior
Halfway up an Alp
That's funny Andy because I immediately thought the head looked too chunky and the neck too short for HB!
The just-fledged Common Buzzard here the past two weeks all look HB shaped, I've spent many a happy(?) hour sorting them out!
John Cantelo
Well-known member
Common Buzzard - the head shape (and much else) looks spot on to me.
I know it's said that young HBs tend to have shorter tails than adult HBs to more closely resemble Common Buzzards (on the assumption it affords them some protection to look like a supposed tougher customer) but if so why then do young CBs sport longer tails making them look less like experienced adults and more like effete HBs?
I know it's said that young HBs tend to have shorter tails than adult HBs to more closely resemble Common Buzzards (on the assumption it affords them some protection to look like a supposed tougher customer) but if so why then do young CBs sport longer tails making them look less like experienced adults and more like effete HBs?
Richard Prior
Halfway up an Alp
I think it's perhaps rather the bulging secondaries on young CB that give the impression that the tail is longer, as the wings look 'pinched in' where they meet the tail base (or perhaps that's just me !).
John, you're the second person that I've heard/read tell of this 'protection' strategy of HB young resembling CBs but in reality it's just a structural thing I'd guess....
birdboybowley
Well-known member.....apparently so ;)
My rule of thumb is that if you have to ask, it's a Buzzard
Jean FRANCOIS
Well-known member
A big thank you to all for your argued opinions.
And what unanimity!
Jean
And what unanimity!
Jean
Richard Prior
Halfway up an Alp
My rule of thumb is that if you have to ask, it's a Buzzard
Nice one Ads, a bit like ( most of) the ‘Sparrowhawk or Gos ?’ queries
John Cantelo
Well-known member
My rule of thumb is that if you have to ask, it's a Buzzard
.... except when it's not!
John Cantelo
Well-known member
It was mentioned in an article or book somewhere but I can't recall where!
Richard Prior
Halfway up an Alp
Ah yes, there’s always an exception to every rule!
Deb Burhinus
Used to be well known! 😎
Indeed I have heard this several times regarding plumage and seen various papers postulating the same. Like this in BB for example:
https://britishbirds.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/article_files/V99/V99_N03/V99_N03_P118_128_A001.pdf
(The 3 bars on the primaries and secondaries are diagnostic of HB in all plumages with juv having more although less extensive)
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Richard Prior
Halfway up an Alp
Thanks for the link to the BB paper Deb, an interesting read!
I find the idea that juvenile HB are mimicing CB rather strange. It seems logical, and as mentioned in the paper above, that several pernis species evolved in mimicing fierce raptors present in the same region. From personal observations this is also true for our HB. At several nest sites of Hobby over the years, adult birds do not bother or only get nervous when CB is approaching very close to the nest, but get crazy when a Goshawk is close (which is obviously a normal reaction), but they also attack any HB passing by even afar, so in my personal opinion HB is mimicing Goshawk in our regions (tail pattern, length) and the fact that juvenile HB would mimicing the rather boaring CB sounds not logical to me.
