scope dilemma! (4 Viewers)

[medinabrit]

did any of you guys ever read stephen ingrahams review on the pentax pf 80 ed .in better view desired, its as good as the euros for half the price ?.not the same snob appeal though.also what about the nikon fieldscope . another exellent scope
brian

 

[salty]

Mind you Salty, whichever one you choose, take heart from this. I can't remember seeing a post from someone who said "I spent £1,000+ on a Zeiss / Leica / Swaro / Nikon - now I wish I'd bought a different one cos this one's rubbish".

Seriously though, enjoy Birdfair. I'll keep an eye out for you in the optics tent - presumably you'll be the fella with the big queue behind you?

very fair point. will probaly be down to my own preference in the end. i cant imagine there being a huge difference between the top 3. im still swinging for the zeiss at the moment, probaly the only main spotting scope out there that i aint tried - cant remember seeing one in the field, let alone used one myself - so im very curious about this model.

also, not to forget to mention, the other 2. with the best prices that i have seen.

APO televid 77 - with zoom eyepiece. £950. cheapest but i have already owned this scope, although couldnt fault it apart from the weight and lenght.

swaro ATS 80HD - with zoom eyepiece. £1299. alot more expensive (£350 more than the leica), but is it worth it? im not so sure.

zeiss 85FL - with zoom eyepiece. £1128. in the middle price wise, but aledged superior zoom and brightest image, makes this the next scope for me????

bring on the test subjects please.............

 

[Karl J]

I think at this level Salty maybe you also want to consider the small personal differences ... how well you get on with this zoom set up ... or that focus set up ... etc.

Personally my eyes couldn't tell a whole lot of difference between the optics of the main 3 when i tried them 18 months or so ago, it was those smaller details that swung it

As a previous post said i've also never heard anyone say 'cor this scope is cr@p, wish i'd bought that one' with the top end models, so i'm sure you'll be happy no matter which one you end up with but it'd be interesting to see your decision ...

 

[hornet]

did any of you guys ever read stephen ingrahams review on the pentax pf 80 ed .in better view desired, its as good as the euros for half the price ?.not the same snob appeal though.also what about the nikon fieldscope . another exellent scope
brian

I don't know about snob appeal, but I've never seen a Pentax scope in the UK. I know they are extremely popular in the states, and very highly rated, but they are not well marketed or distributed over here.

I never see them in the optics shops, and I've never seen one in the field, so I've had no chance to check them out myself.

Nikon is a different story - they are excellent and widely available in the UK, and many BirdForum members here have them (and are just as passionate about them as other brand owners!) Although they are slightly cheaper than the Euro brands, the difference can actually be quite small.

 

[scampo]

...

APO televid 77 - with zoom eyepiece. £950. cheapest but i have already owned this scope, although couldnt fault it apart from the weight and lenght.

swaro ATS 80HD - with zoom eyepiece. £1299. alot more expensive (£350 more than the leica), but is it worth it? im not so sure.

zeiss 85FL - with zoom eyepiece. £1128. in the middle price wise, but aledged superior zoom and brightest image, makes this the next scope for me????

bring on the test subjects please.............

At that price you'd think they came with bird magnets attached, wouldn't you! The Zeiss is the best if you must have a zoom, otherwise the Nikon ED82 with 30x offers a dream view as scopes go!

 

[scampo]

...

Personally my eyes couldn't tell a whole lot of difference between the optics of the main 3 when i tried them 18 months or so ago, it was those smaller details that swung it

...

I'm surprised as with zoom eyepieces, the Zeiss lets you see about 50% more than the other scopes.

 

[kabsetz]

I have seen two Pentax 80mm ED's. The first we had in the ALULA test. It was a straight-body type, and while okay, it was nevertheless a distinct step below the top models in performance. The second one I looked with this past spring was the angled model and of more recent stock. This second scope was, frankly, optically rather poor. It was loaned to an acquaintance of mine while his Swaro AT 80 HD was being repaired, and he could hardly wait to get his own scope back. All this does not mean that there would not be good samples of the Pentax out there, and I do not for an instant doubt that the one Steve tested for BVD was excellent, but my small sampling of two was not promising.

Kimmo

 

[medinabrit]

all i can say ,is that i have 2 takahashi ,1 televue pronto & avixen scope & to my 67 yr old eyes the pentax is very good .im using pentax & tv nagler eye pieces .i own some pretty expensive swaro binos, but really think that my nikon se & pentax pcf sp binos are probably as good to most peoples eyes. after reading this thread i went out onto my deck & compared my $1600 15x56 bins with my $600 16x70 fujis then my pronto with the pf80. my old but still pretty good eyes couldnt see any significant difference.especially considering the price difference
brian

 

[Don Koch]

Has anybody looked thru the new Swaro STS80 HD? How does it stack up againt the standard Swaro ATS80HD or are they basically one and the same scope?
I'm a little confused at this point.
DK

 

[pduxon]

Has anybody looked thru the new Swaro STS80 HD? How does it stack up againt the standard Swaro ATS80HD or are they basically one and the same scope?
I'm a little confused at this point.
DK

same scope STS - Straight version ATS - Angled version

 

[scampo]

Is there a new Swaro? I haven't heard of it?

 

[iporali]

keep the replies coming in folks, thanks. some interesting points being made.

Salty,

Is there some reason why you wouldn't want to avoid any risks and buy back your "own" Leica - for a "bargain price"?

Ilkka :t:

 

[salty]

Salty,

Is there some reason why you wouldn't want to avoid any risks and buy back your "own" Leica - for a "bargain price"?

Ilkka :t:

i have considered getting the APO77 again. although when you hear of other models being lighter and brighter, and better zooms etc - i want to check out the models that are supposedly superior, however much, first.

 

[scampo]

I doubt later models are brighter, sharper or more contrasty - although all are shorter and lighter. I would say that the Zeiss is wider, the Nikon is close to the Leica but more compact, the Swaro is ergonomically a super scope...

 

[kabsetz]

Salty, I think Ilkka meant that you could get back THE VERY SAME Leica you sold. Since you were so happy with it, it was probably a very good one, and a different one might not be as good.

Kimmo

 

[rezMole]

Salty, I think Ilkka meant that you could get back THE VERY SAME Leica you sold. Since you were so happy with it, it was probably a very good one, and a different one might not be as good.

Kimmo

Erm... no he couldn't! My girlfriend and I are far too attached to it - I still find it so amazingly crisp and bright, and there's no way we're flogging it back to him. He could, however, get one at a reasonable price from another BF member who seems to be selling his - in fact, why don't you do that Salty?

 

[iporali]

Erm... no he couldn't! My girlfriend and I are far too attached to it - I still find it so amazingly crisp and bright, and there's no way we're flogging it back to him. He could, however, get one at a reasonable price from another BF member who seems to be selling his - in fact, why don't you do that Salty?

Oops - sorry rezMole, and others for the confusion! Yes, I thought postcardcv was selling Salty's previous Leica. But I agree, that could be a tempting offer.

Ilkka


EDIT: Ok, I decided to add some more detailed "IMHO-comments" on the scopes discussed.

Salty,

When you are comparing the scopes you could pay attention on these slight differences that I have been able to see myself (many of which mentioned earlier by others, like Kimmo at www.alula.fi):

Zeiss
I have understood that you mainly use the zoom. Well, the field-of-view
of the Zeiss zoom really is superior to all others and it is IMO more useful in birdwatching than subtle differences in contrast and edge sharpness. Center sharpness of the Zeiss zoom is also maybe the best there is. The reasons why not all users feel comfortable with the Zeiss may be quite strong pincushion distortion (edges of the image twist outwards) at lower powers and slightly yellow/greenish color cast. Zeiss only has 30x fixed eyepiece, which IMO is unnecessary if you have the zoom.

Swarovski
My personal favourite as a whole. Excellent sharpness and contrast almost to the very edge. A fine zoom, marvellous 30x and a great 20x wide angle eyepiece available. I like the focusing collar, but not everyone. Colour cast looks quite cold (bluish) compared to the others but I have seen a graph which shows that light transmission of the Swaro is more "even" than in the others. Chromatic aberration (lateral) more easily visible than in the Leica and the Zeiss. If you like this best, you just have to forget the price.

Leica
The Leica APO with the 32x wide has optically maybe the "best view" that I know of any terrestrial scopes. Unfortunately the Leica zooms that I have tried have not been as good - but several revisions have been made during the years. The Leica camera lenses have been known for their excellent "bokeh" (how good out-of-focus parts of the image look). IMO this may be the reason why I feel so comfortable with the Leica scopes as well. Unfortunately the Leica 77 is so very heavy and "uncompact" - a more lightweight version would be very welcome (BirdFair???). My favourite on the basis of pure optics.

Nikon
Make sure to check this out. The zoom has a narrow field-of-view because its range is from 25-75x, but the 75x may be useful sometimes. The fixed 30x is really good. The focusing collar is very rapid but precise.

Good luck for your shopping!

 

[Colin]

Hi Salty,
As one or two posters have mentioned, take a look at the Nikon ED82 at the Birdfair. I have one and it is fantastic and very good value for money. Obviously each person has different eyes and what some people see as good, others differ. Maybe I will see you at the fair on Sunday. I will be wearing a green badge with my name on it. Maybe speak to you then.

 

[salty]

Hi Salty,
As one or two posters have mentioned, take a look at the Nikon ED82 at the Birdfair. I have one and it is fantastic and very good value for money. Obviously each person has different eyes and what some people see as good, others differ. Maybe I will see you at the fair on Sunday. I will be wearing a green badge with my name on it. Maybe speak to you then.

i will be at the optics area testing out all the kit, just hope the weather ok, forecast rain.

 

[postcardcv]

i will be at the optics area testing out all the kit, just hope the weather ok, forecast rain.

It's going to be interesting to hear your conclusions after a weekend of testing.