Upton Warren (127 Viewers)

[upstarts1979]

Re - Natural England`s ruling at Flashes

It states "Some salt marsh species have declined so much the are only growing on the margins and must not be smothered"

Would not the churning up of the edges by the cattle have the same detrimental effect?

Dick

Hi Dick
After working on the Flashes for the last 30 years, we know where all the salt plants are and would never smother them with shingle or dredging spoil.
In fact we created many areas of salt marsh, by piling up the silt dredged from the channels. All the islands we built were in the open water away from the salt marsh. All I can say is, its a pity NE didn't act upon the information we gave them regarding the encroaching phragmites, where lots of salt marsh has now been lost.
I don't want to get into a slanging match, but I will hopefully find out more on Tuesday and post the FACTS on here. B john

 

[Dick-E-Dipper]

No slanging match intended, just a query with the good of the Flashes at heart.

I agree with your comments,
Keep up the good Work

Dick

 

[upstarts1979]

Birding today over to you Phil with the true numbers, but here are my notes.

Flashes :
Teal 50 ish, coot 9, water rail 2 calling, moorhen 30ish, greylag c30,
between 10 and 12 Jack snipe, common snipe c25, Lapwing c200,
kestrel, sparrowhawk, buzzard,
several winter thrushes.

also Dave W had 2 kestrels and a yellowhammer overhead.
also AM 2 shelduck per Steve (spike)

MOORS:
GCG 3, little grebe 5+, shoveler 21, teal c50, pochard 7 (6 male),
coot 220+, water rail several calling west side,
snipe c10,
pied wags c10 pre-roost
cettis at least 2 singing.

also Dave J had 3 little egrets this morning

 

[upstarts1979]

No slanging match intended, just a query with the good of the Flashes at heart.

I agree with your comments,
Keep up the good Work

Dick

No issues with what you stated and agree the cattle are not helping in some areas, especially where the salt plants are vulnerable.
However the cattle have created some amazing habitat around the 2nd and 3rd Flash. Here we flushed all the jack snipe and commons.
The only problem, is that this habitat cannot be seen from the hide. It is all hidden by the phragmites.
All the pics 1 to 4 are in the southern field (to the right of the hide behind the thin strip of reeds)
5 is in the area south of the 3rd flash and is in effect a floating bog.

 

[Phil Andrews]

A lot of things conspired against us today. Such as the weather, banned from laying shingle and to top it all, the car park was closed until 9.50. However we did finally get to tackle something we have talked about for years. Namely opening up the scrub to the east of the feeding station that runs along the Hen brook. We can now view into the east side of the Hen pool and the scrub on the north side of the brook.
We also planted a scrub mix along the NW corner of the Hen pool, this will screen the entrance to archery field when in the Hen pool hide.
We also started the feeding station.
Although we didn't get the normal quota of vols, those that did turn up worked like trojans and we had more chocolate and biscuits each8-P.
Thanks to Peter E, Timmy J, Craig R, Steve spike, Graham L, Des J, Dave W, Gary P, Mike W, Phil A and me.B

Pics 1 and 2 before work
3 and 4 after the work
5. the whole feeding station before work
all viewed from side of 'cuckoo hide' looking NE to right of feeding station

This work will have several benefits:

- Open up views to the southern end of the Hen Pool and the adjoining trees
- Create an obvious "flit path" where feeding passerines will need to fly across
- Regenerate the blackthorn which was very tired and in some cases rotten
- In piling up the brash potentially enable brambles to take hold, providing potential passerine feeding areas
- Give us a trial patch to review how the blackthorn rejuvenates which will help shape our thinking about how we manage the large blocks of it by the feeding station
- Provide another point of interest from the Feeding Station / Cuckoo Hide.

The feeders were also reinstated today; the feeding table wont be used this winter as its base has deteriorated to such an extent that the seed would just go mouldy. We either need to install a new base or build on a new one.

 

[Phil Andrews]

No issues with what you stated and agree the cattle are not helping in some areas, especially where the salt plants are vulnerable.
However the cattle have created some amazing habitat around the 2nd and 3rd Flash. Here we flushed all the jack snipe and commons.
The only problem, is that this habitat cannot be seen from the hide. It is all hidden by the phragmites.
All the pics 1 to 4 are in the southern field (to the right of the hide behind the thin strip of reeds)
5 is in the area south of the 3rd flash and is in effect a floating bog.

Would concur with John's comments; whilst the cattle have failed miserably in the principal objection of controlling / reversing the spread of the phragmites, they have produced a positive secondary outcome through grazing and trampling in vastly improving the a number of areas south and east of the second flash to the benefit of both winter snipe species and potentially some of the county's rarer breeders come the spring. There are now a number of shallow pools with disturbed mud surrounded by short growth behind the reeds -as per John's first photo of his latest batch - plus lots of new patches of fresh juncas growing favoured by the snipe.

 

[Phil Andrews]

Sunday 7th December

Many thanks to Dave Jackson for his assistance with the WeBS Count today:

Mute Swan - 2 on Sailing Pool
Greylag Geese -31 in fields by Hobden Hall Farm
Shelduck - 2 commuting between Moors Pool and Flashes
Mallard - 84
Shoveler - 21 at Moors Pool
Teal - 107 (52 at the Flashes mid afternoon)
Tufted Duck - 23
Pochard - 7 at Moors Pool late afternoon
GC Grebe - 7 (4 at the Sailing Pool, 3 at the Moors Pool)
Little Grebe - 11 (including 2 on the Sailing Pool)
Grey Heron - 3
Little Egret - 3 at Moors Pool this morning; 1 along the Salwarpe this afternoon
Cormorant - 41 this morning
Coot - 239
Moorhen - 44
Water Rail - minimum of 5 calling birds; one showing in the channel from West Hide at Moors Pool
Kestrel - male and female at the Flashes this morning
Sparrowhawk - landed on the ground at the Moors Pool late afternoon
Curlew - 12
Lapwing - 235
Snipe - c30 flushed at the Flashes; 3 at the Moors Pool
Jack Snipe - minimum of 8 flushed at the Flashes; potentially as many as 11
BH Gull - 260
LBB Gull - 1
Kingfisher - 3
Grey Wagtail - 1 at Flashes
Cetti's Warbler - minimum of 3 birds
Chiffchaff - 2 along the Salwarpe this afternoon
Yellowhammer - over the Flashes calling

 

[Woodchat]

My two penn'orth.....

Using cattle to control Phragmites was always going to be a non-starter. It is generally unpalatable to cattle as it contains high levels of Silicon in its fibres. I told Any Harris at the Trust this about 4 years ago but I guess he didn't believe me.

 

[Stone Snapper]

My two penn'orth.....

Using cattle to control Phragmites was always going to be a non-starter. It is generally unpalatable to cattle as it contains high levels of Silicon in its fibres. I told Any Harris at the Trust this about 4 years ago but I guess he didn't believe me.

Can i have some to seal round my bath

 

[Woodchat]

Can i have some to seal round my bath

Hi Vern,

You can try it, mate - but it will definitely leak. 8-P

I'm probably getting way too technical here. It is Silicones that are used in sealants /mastics - a kind of synthetic rubber (elastomer). Chemically, these compounds (polymers) are usually variants of poly(dimethylsiloxane) and are distinct from Silicon, which is an element.

Silicon is biologically available in the form of orthosilicic acid. Organisms can assimilate this form of Silicon and use it in their cellular structures.

 

[upstarts1979]

Hi Vern,

You can try it, mate - but it will definitely leak. 8-P

I'm probably getting way too technical here. It is Silicones that are used in sealants /mastics - a kind of synthetic rubber (elastomer). Chemically, these compounds (polymers) are usually variants of poly(dimethylsiloxane) and are distinct from Silicon, which is an element.

Silicon is biologically available in the form of orthosilicic acid. Organisms can assimilate this form of Silicon and use it in their cellular structures.

Vern what you could do to help the situation, is build a house out of reeds as the Marsh Arabs in Iraq have done for the last few thousand years. Or at least have a thatched roof8-P.
Joking apart, if the reeds were removed from some areas we would see an increase in waders such as redshank and lapwing, curlews and snipe would also benefit from an 'open' wet grazing marsh. We would keep the best quality reeds in the wetter areas of the 3rd Flash. But the reeds in the dryer areas are not viable as reed warbler or other reed loving species, so must be eradicated.:t:

 

[Abbeybirder]

John for one minute I thought you going to put EXTERMINATED and not eradicated.

 

[Stone Snapper]

Hi Vern,

You can try it, mate - but it will definitely leak. 8-P

I'm probably getting way too technical here. It is Silicones that are used in sealants /mastics - a kind of synthetic rubber (elastomer). Chemically, these compounds (polymers) are usually variants of poly(dimethylsiloxane) and are distinct from Silicon, which is an element.

Silicon is biologically available in the form of orthosilicic acid. Organisms can assimilate this form of Silicon and use it in their cellular structures.

Much better Dave lad well explained kid ooo

 

[Stone Snapper]

John for one minute I thought you going to put EXTERMINATED and not eradicated.

have you swallowed a dictionary big fellow or what ??8-P

 

[Chris Mills]

Here is a Blue Tit I saw at Upton Warren on Sunday 7th December from the Water Rail Hide. Higher res here: http://i.imgur.com/biR1kgG.jpg

 

[Stone Snapper]

Here is a Blue Tit I saw at Upton Warren on Sunday 7th December from the Water Rail Hide. Higher res here: http://i.imgur.com/biR1kgG.jpg

Nice shot Chris, i`m guessing left side of the hide

 

[upstarts1979]

No work party today, but the Tuesday team did have a tour of Lower smite and a presentation about the Flashes. This included the recent survey results and possible remedial action. A very interesting and enlightening talk on a subject close to my heart. I think we all learned something new and we now appreciate the complexities involved in 'getting it right', for both the salt plants and the birds.

After this we returned to a very cold, windswept, partially iced Moors pool. Nothing new and passerines were definitely at a premium.

Species count MOORS:
GCG 4, Little grebe 3, shoveler 25, teal c50, shelduck pr, pochard 4 males, tufted 20+, coot 230ish, water rail 2 heard, Little egret, curlew 12, lapwing 70,
at least 2 cettis singing,

SAILING POOL: GCG 3, tufted pr, coot 7, kingfisher.

FLASHES:
The roost was still lively, with lots of geese and gulls coming in. The water level has risen a little so the gulls and lapwing are gathering in front of the hide on the islets , spit and saucer. In fact late on all the teal, coot , moorhen and curlews were within 50 yards of the hide. The first green sand appeared at 4.35pm

Species count FLASHES:
Teal 23, mallard 45, shelduck came in to roost at 4.15 from the Moors, greylag 31, canadas 280, coot 9, moorhen 35, snipe 4, curlew 12, green sand 2, lapwing 248, BHG 620, LBBG 1 damaged winged bird roosted, starling 5,

 

[PeterE]

Species count MOORS:
GCG 4, Little grebe 3, shoveler 25, teal c50, shelduck pr, pochard 4 males, tufted 20+, coot 230ish, water rail 2 heard, Little egret, curlew 12, lapwing 70,
at least 2 cettis singing,

John, you can add the kestrel Bob P found over Amy's - a female, I believe.

Peter

 

[Stone Snapper]

John, you can add the kestrel Bob P found over Amy's - a female, I believe.

Peter

Eyes like a Hawk that potter :-O

 

[RGUEST3]

No work party today, but the Tuesday team did have a tour of Lower smite and a presentation about the Flashes. This included the recent survey results and possible remedial action. A very interesting and enlightening talk on a subject close to my heart. I think we all learned something new and we now appreciate the complexities involved in 'getting it right', for both the salt plants and the birds.

After this we returned to a very cold, windswept, partially iced Moors pool. Nothing new and passerines were definitely at a premium.

Species count MOORS:
GCG 4, Little grebe 3, shoveler 25, teal c50, shelduck pr, pochard 4 males, tufted 20+, coot 230ish, water rail 2 heard, Little egret, curlew 12, lapwing 70,
at least 2 cettis singing,

SAILING POOL: GCG 3, tufted pr, coot 7, kingfisher.

FLASHES:
The roost was still lively, with lots of geese and gulls coming in. The water level has risen a little so the gulls and lapwing are gathering in front of the hide on the islets , spit and saucer. In fact late on all the teal, coot , moorhen and curlews were within 50 yards of the hide. The first green sand appeared at 4.35pm

Species count FLASHES:
Teal 23, mallard 45, shelduck came in to roost at 4.15 from the Moors, greylag 31, canadas 280, coot 9, moorhen 35, snipe 4, curlew 12, green sand 2, lapwing 248, BHG 620, LBBG 1 damaged winged bird roosted, starling 5,

Are these results being made available john?