Where's the Love- Kowa Genesis vs The Rest $1000 Bins (1 Viewer)

[Paultricounty]

+1 for seeing quite a lot of sample variation on the Genesis. I've only tried multiples the 8x33 as it's the only one that interests me but I'm on one good one out of 3 - I would have bought that one but my better half wasn't keen....

I’ve read about issues with the Kowa binos, but everyone I’ve bought and tried were excellent, that’s about half dozen. That being said I’ve had to return three Zeiss SF’s, four SFL’s I tried had some QC issues, as well as Issues with four Opticrons ( which I don’t buy anymore) and two issues with Nikon. The least issues I’ve had with any brand is Leica.

Paul

 

[w.travis]

Certainly my own experience of Kowa's Genesis line is one of variation between copies. My 8.5x44 was purchased after rejecting the first four I was offered, but is a gem and absolutely spot on optically and mechanically. I am currently trying to procure an 8x33, have already rejected two (as well as a used copy) myself and the dealer I'm purchasing through called me yesterday morning to say that the third copy had arrived and that he was immediately rejecting it on my behalf (this particular one had an unacceptably stiff focus movement).

I'm a huge fan of these binoculars and know how good they can be, but finding a perfect copy has proved to be a bit of a mission. 100% worth the effort though.

My 'copy variation' experiences with Meopta have been similar, but again, 100% worth the time and effort to find a perfect one.

With that all said, I'm probably just overly fussy...😉😇

+1 for seeing quite a lot of sample variation on the Genesis. I've only tried multiples the 8x33 as it's the only one that interests me but I'm on one good one out of 3 - I would have bought that one but my better half wasn't keen....

I’ve read about issues with the Kowa binos, but everyone I’ve bought and tried were excellent, that’s about half dozen. That being said I’ve had to return three Zeiss SF’s, four SFL’s I tried had some QC issues, as well as Issues with four Opticrons ( which I don’t buy anymore) and two issues with Nikon. The least issues I’ve had with any brand is Leica.

Paul

It's interesting to see how William and Bentley can go through multiple samples with problems before finding one that was good. Then Paul can go through multiple samples without any problems.

I was wondering if anyone was going to bring up other companies in which they have experienced similar quality control issues. So guess it's not just Kowa with multiple poor samples some of us are finding.

I have only ever owned ( and still own) 3 Kowa bins, but not the Genesis line. I have the YFII 6x30, YFII 8x30, and BDII XD 6.5x32 that all seem to be as good as they get for what they are. I do want to try the Genesis line at some point though.

 

[Paultricounty]

It's interesting to see how William and Bentley can go through multiple samples with problems before finding one that doesn't. Then Paul can go through multiple samples without any problems.

I was wondering if anyone was going to bring up other companies in which they have experienced similar quality control issues. So guess it's not just Kowa with multiple poor samples some of us are finding.

I have only ever owned ( and still own) 3 Kowa bins, but not the Genesis line. I have the YFII 6x30, YFII 8x30, and BDII XD 6.5x32 that all seem to be as good as they get for what they are. I do want to try the Genesis line in at some point though.

That was the point I was trying to make, not bashing anyone of them. I might’ve been bashing the makers on QC much more than the models.

 

[w.travis]

Well, my curiosity got the best of me, I ordered a Genesis 10.5x44. I own a Tract Toric 10x42 and have recently spent time with Nikon MHG 10x42 on multiple occasions. So, I'm curious to see what my thoughts are on the Genesis. Really looking forward to it, especially seeing the CA control it gets praised for.

 

[Rg548]

Well, my curiosity got the best of me, I ordered a Genesis 10.5x44. I own a Tract Toric 10x42 and have recently spent time with Nikon MHG 10x42 on multiple occasions. So, I'm curious to see what my thoughts are on the Genesis. Really looking forward to it, especially seeing the CA control it gets praised for.

I'd be very interested to hear how that Genesis compares against the Toric, which I heard are very good in low light.
Please get back to us

How are the Tracts compared to the Nikons..... we don't hear much about Tract on here...

 

[w.travis]

I'd be very interested to hear how that Genesis compares against the Toric, which I heard are very good in low light.
Please get back to us

How are the Tracts compared to the Nikons..... we don't hear much about Tract on here...

Will do on the Genesis.

The Tract Toric 10x42 as an OVERALL birding bin for me personally has been hard to beat. That is partially because it is a 10x which I prefer over all other magnifications for MOST (not ALL) birding situations.

Compared to MHG

• Sharpness and contrast: both slightly better in Toric. Image seemed to pops better in Toric.
• Edge sharpness: similar I think. I didn't specifically look at it with the MHG, but didn't notice any difference. In the Toric sharpness extends almost to very edge.
• FOV and AFOV: better in MHG. It's wider and immersive AFOV is immediately noticeable. Toric is not narrow by any means, the MHG just really stands out here. 69 degrees vs 65 degrees AFOV
• Brightness: seemed slightly better in MHG. Wonder if the immersive AFOV made it only appear brighter, because the Toric does really well in low light for a 10x. I only had them side by side during sunny conditions.
• Chromatic aberration: similar amount. I didn't notice an obvious difference, but didn't specifically look for a difference either.
• Focuser tension: better in MHG, my Toric sample is on the stiff side for my preference. Interestingly though, its like it just has to warm up each time I use it. It's stiffer at first but loosens up after a few turns back and forth.
• Ergonomics: for me both are great. Hand placement on barrels and finger placement on focuser comes very natural. They are both on the compact side.
• Eye relief: though equal on paper the MHG is slightly longer in use because the eye cups don't stick out as far when in the closed position.
• Build Quality: Toric seems to be more solidly built.
• Warranty: definitely Tract
• Cost: Tract Toric $200-300 cheaper
• Manufacturing location: both Japan

Of note I have the original Toric UHD. The current Toric UHD has something updated with the glass or coatings.

 

[Rg548]

Wow.... so the Tract comfortably hold its' own against an MHG....
Let's see what the Genesis brings to the table.

 

[w.travis]

Wow.... so the Tract comfortably hold its' own against an MHG....
Let's see what the Genesis brings to the table.

For sure it does. I didn't do an in depth comparison though, so my thoughts on those findings could change over time. That was all based on initial impression after using the MHG last week on 2 different occasions and then once with a 5 minute side by side with the Toric.

 

[w.travis]

Wow.... so the Tract comfortably hold its' own against an MHG....
Let's see what the Genesis brings to the table.

I've had the Genesis 10.5x44 for a few days now. I haven't had extensive use, but some around the house and property. It appears I've received a very good sample, thankfully not having same experience of some who have had multiple bad samples.

I haven't done a detailed side by side comparison with the Toric, but I've used the Toric A LOT for the past 6 years as my main bin, so feel pretty comfortable giving some thoughts against the Genesis and did spend a few minutes with them side by side.

The Genesis is a step up from the Toric 10x42 in most areas. An immediate difference I noticed is I prefer the focuser much more on the Genesis. It's smoother with perfect tension, larger, and better grip. Great focuser, I love it.

Build quality seems to go slightly to the Genesis, However, it is brand new so time will tell. Whereas the Toric I've had 6 years with much use and still looks very good without any obvious wear on the armor. So even though the build quality APPEARS to be better on the Genesis, the Toric has proved it thus far. To me the Genesis feels more high end (alpha/premium) combined with work horse. Toric feels quality work horse, but not high end like the Genesis.

Size and weight obviously go to the Toric if one is looking to stay light and compact. Side by side Toric is basically the same size as my Leica UHVD+ 7x42. The Genesis, though larger and heavier still feels great in my hands and balances very well. I can't say I prefer one over the other.

Eye placement while setting the interpupillary distance was slightly finicky with the Genesis. The Toric eye cups and eye placement has a similar feel as the Genesis but with more room for error regarding setting the interpupillary distance. Though once the interpupillary distance is set accurately on the Genesis, I have no problem with eye placement.

Optically I think I enjoy the Genesis slightly better overall. Better CA control which was expected and one of the main reasons I wanted the Genesis. During sunny conditions and overcast during mid day observing birds at feeder / in yard I can't say I noticed any obvious differences in brightness, sharpness, or contrast. However, looking at small black letters on a white sign, the Toric seems to produce slightly deeper black color to the small lettering, so maybe the contrast is slightly better it the Toric? Optically overall, I prefer the view of the Genesis, but can't specifically discern why yet.

So far VERY pleased and excited to own the Genesis Prominar 10.5x44. I'd make it my new main birding bin over the Toric, except I don't want it to get beat up and the Toric is so close in quality. So the Toric will likely continue to be my main work horse birding bin. But I'll definitely be keeping and using the Genesis as well.

If I could only keep one, it would be the Genesis. For now I think it has tied my UVHD+ 7x42 as my favorite bin I have or have had.

And check out that cool option with the lens hoods!

 

[Bentley03]

Great to hear you're so pleased with your new Genesis. Congratulations!

On first use, I thought my 8.5x44 was an unwieldy big heavy lump, but that focus wheel with it's wonderful smoothness and perfect tension really grows on you. The slightly spongy armour feels great in the hand too. And that focus snap is just so, so addictive. They are my favourite binoculars to 'fondle' and their combination of attributes give me a genuine thrill every time I use them. I am regularly heard audibly expressing my approval with a little 'oh yes', an 'mmmmmm', a 'wow' or a little chuckle.

Youv've chosen a fantastic binocular, enjoy!!!