Let's talk PORROS! (4 Viewers)

[sidpost]

In terms of cost or value, NL Pure's are way past the knee of the 'value vs. cost' curve. Even gently used, NL Pure's typically run $2500 which is $1,000 more than the Leica Noctovid's I recently bought.

If you want to talk about Porros exclusively, there really isn't a viable market for "modern Alpha" Porro bins. We can argue whatever technical nuances we want to but, size, weight, technology, and low sales volumes will keep Porros from evolving in the mainstream with the technology we see in modern Roof bins.

Marketing and consumer sales, through advertising, has clearly focused mainstream consumers on small relatively affordable (on the cheaper end) roof bins as being the 'bee's knees' of goodness. Now that viable Porros are not in the marketplace, mainstream consumers only consider Roof bins without a thought about why they might want a Porror bin.

 

[CharleyBird]

I bought an APM APO 7x50 Porro Prism binocular from APM in Germany that uses FK61 glass for $350 that gives me a better view than the NL 8x42 did. The APM has a lot of advantages like a bigger aperture pulling in 40% more light, better light transmission, more efficient prism, bigger exit pupil, almost no CA, no glare(even near the sun) and a 3D stereoscopic view that the NL can't make up for with optical chicanery. Now that is what you call porro value.

https://www.apm-telescopes.de/en/binoculars/binoculars-50mm-aperture/apm-ed-apo-7-x-50-magnesium-series-binoculars.html

You didn't mention this 7x weighs 1280g. Are you using it mainly for astronomy?

 

[Troubador]

You didn't mention this 7x weighs 1280g. Are you using it mainly for astronomy?

1.28kg? Drop that while walking through farmland and you would certainly get a flat field............

Lee

 

[CharleyBird]

As an alternative to gym membership I'm considering a set of APM dumbbells, pairs of 7x50, 11x70, 20x100 and 28x110

 

[Troubador]

As an alternative to gym membership I'm considering set of APM dumbbells, pairs of 7x50, 11x70, 20x100 and 28x110

Well , nothing unexpected about that since APM obviously stands for Accumulates Plenty of Muscles.....

Lee

 

[Paskman]

Well , nothing unexpected about that since APM obviously stands for Accumulates Plenty of Muscles.....

Lee

It's also got "Focus is achieved by adjusting each eyepiece individually so that you can match your unique vision precisely.", perfect for birding then: A "beauty cap!" and special folding rubber eye cups for use with glasses 👍. No wonder the NL's are history.

 

[henry link]

Old timers here have seen this pattern over and over. A fever grips Dennis. The main symptom, as always, is an absolute devotion to a new binocular or type of binocular to the exclusion of all others. The obvious disadvantages of his current favorite will be ignored for a few weeks to a few months. Then a new binocular will enter his life, a new fever will take hold, his current favorites will be dumped on eBay and scorned for the disadvantages that they had all along, and the cycle begins again.

 

[[email protected]]

Dennis what has happened to your need for the view to be ultra-sharp to the very edge of the field of view? This was vital as you needed to be able to roam your eyes around the fov and see sharp images everywhere.

And I notice in Post 278 you accuse Swarovski of chicanery which means the use of deception or subterfuge to achieve one's purpose. That is quite an accusation. Does this mean you look back on your years with Swaro binos with regret that you were 'deceived' for so long?

Lee

The Fujinon and APM porros are every bit as sharp at the edge as the NL or EL and maybe even a little sharper and the FOV is smaller but more natural. I have never looked through a big porro that has widely spaced objective tubes. Frankly, I was shocked how good they are! The only reason I even tried the Fujinons is because they were at the top of Allbinos ranking in the 7x50 and 10x50 class. The 3D view is really stunning.

 

[[email protected]]

It's also got "Focus is achieved by adjusting each eyepiece individually so that you can match your unique vision precisely.", perfect for birding then: A "beauty cap!" and special folding rubber eye cups for use with glasses 👍. No wonder the NL's are history.

With the APM APO 7x50 you hardly ever have to focus it because of the great DOF. The rubber eye cups are fine and actually simpler to use without glasses because there are no adjustments. You just put the binoculars up to your eyes and look through them.

 

[CharleyBird]

Perhaps we shall look back on this as an ApPorrontly Masochistic birding phase, when a sparkling compact & lightweight 8x32 Noctovid is announced
😉

 

[[email protected]]

You didn't mention this 7x weighs 1280g. Are you using it mainly for astronomy?

If you carry a 8x42 you are carrying 2 pounds so what is another pound to carry a binocular that gives you an extraordinary view. You can lose a pound off your belly and make up for it!

 

[[email protected]]

Perhaps we shall look back on this as an ApPorrontly Masochistic birding phase, when a sparkling compact & lightweight 8x32 Noctovid is announced
😉

I tried Noctovids. Although they are nice binoculars I just never felt they were the equal of the NL, EL or SF. If you like roofs I still feel the NL is the best choice.

 

[[email protected]]

In terms of cost or value, NL Pure's are way past the knee of the 'value vs. cost' curve. Even gently used, NL Pure's typically run $2500 which is $1,000 more than the Leica Noctovid's I recently bought.

If you want to talk about Porros exclusively, there really isn't a viable market for "modern Alpha" Porro bins. We can argue whatever technical nuances we want to but, size, weight, technology, and low sales volumes will keep Porros from evolving in the mainstream with the technology we see in modern Roof bins.

Marketing and consumer sales, through advertising, has clearly focused mainstream consumers on small relatively affordable (on the cheaper end) roof bins as being the 'bee's knees' of goodness. Now that viable Porros are not in the marketplace, mainstream consumers only consider Roof bins without a thought about why they might want a Porror bin.

It is all about marketing. The manufacturers push roof prism binoculars because they make more money on them. If more people would look through a porro they wouldn't sell any of these expensive roofs.

 

[PYRTLE]

Old timers here have seen this pattern over and over. A fever grips Dennis. The main symptom, as always, is an absolute devotion to a new binocular or type of binocular to the exclusion of all others. The obvious disadvantages of his current favorite will be ignored for a few weeks to a few months. Then a new binocular will enter his life, a new fever will take hold, his current favorites will be dumped on eBay and scorned for the disadvantages that they had all along, and the cycle begins again.

Only a few days this time if the following is incorporated.......

https://www.birdforum.net/threads/apm-ed-apo-7-x-50-magnesium-series-binoculars-for-sale-usa.403621/

I admire the passion behind the hobby and acquisitions but question the euphoria and praise that still languishes after moving on " the best view, bargain, beats any roof prism " that Dennis' continued praise attributed to this binocular. What am I missing? If the image etc is that extraordinary why sell it after a few hours and still laud the performance and merits? It wasn't a keeper.

I'm guessing that carrying it was harder than going down to the gym.

ATB

 

[Conndomat]

If more people would look through a porro they wouldn't sell any of these expensive roofs.

Dennis that's a bad argument!
You bought yourself a NL although you looked through many Swarovski hawks before!

Andreas

 

[jgraider]

Is it possible to have a split (optics) personality disorder?????

 

[CharleyBird]

Dennis, I can't keep up; could you clarify...

1. Why did you sell the Swaro 8x42 NL?
2. Why did you sell the APM 7x50 ED MS APO?

3. What do you currently use when you go birdwatching?

 

[[email protected]]

Only a few days this time if the following is incorporated.......

https://www.birdforum.net/threads/apm-ed-apo-7-x-50-magnesium-series-binoculars-for-sale-usa.403621/

I admire the passion behind the hobby and acquisitions but question the euphoria and praise that still languishes after moving on " the best view, bargain, beats any roof prism " that Dennis' continued praise attributed to this binocular. What am I missing? If the image etc is that extraordinary why sell it after a few hours and still laud the performance and merits? It wasn't a keeper.

I'm guessing that carrying it was harder than going down to the gym.

ATB

I bought the Fujinon FMTR-SX 7x50 and the APM APO 7x50 at the same time from APM to compare them and I decided I would keep the best of the two being the same format. On first look I thought the Fujinons were better, so I decided to sell the APM APO. I listed them in the classifieds and on Astromart. Then the next day I compared them again when the light was getting lower, and I found out the APM was every bit as good as the Fujinons and maybe even a little better. The APM APO controls CA a little better than the Fujinons with their HD glass. Both of them were INCREDIBLE as far as glare control even right next to the sun. No glare like the NL had! So I decided to keep them both and cancelled both ads.

 

[[email protected]]

Dennis that's a bad argument!
You bought yourself a NL although you looked through many Swarovski hawks before!

Andreas

I have NEVER looked through a big porro with wide objective spacing like the Fujinon or APM porro before. The Habicht is good, but it doesn't have the wide objective spacing of either the Fujinon or APM. The 3D view is remarkable, and I sold my NL in less than a week after getting them.

 

[Troubador]

If you carry a 8x42 you are carrying 2 pounds so what is another pound to carry a binocular that gives you an extraordinary view. You can lose a pound off your belly and make up for it!

But Dennis this argument (ahem) carries no weight because you don't carry your belly on a strap around your neck
Unfortunately this is exactly what you do with a bino.
Lee

The Fujinon and APM porros are every bit as sharp at the edge as the NL or EL and maybe even a little sharper and the FOV is smaller but more natural. I have never looked through a big porro that has widely spaced objective tubes. Frankly, I was shocked how good they are! The only reason I even tried the Fujinons is because they were at the top of Allbinos ranking in the 7x50 and 10x50 class. The 3D view is really stunning.

Enjoy your Porros Den.
Lee